Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk, like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community, but don't worry this is a simple free process that requires minimal information for you to signup. Be a part of DBSTalk by signing in or creating an account.
  • Start new topics and reply to others
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get email updates
  • Get your own profile page and make new friends
  • Send personal messages to other members.
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo
- - - - -

3TB and 4TB Drives. The Danger!


  • Please log in to reply
192 replies to this topic

#81 OFFLINE   Herdfan

Herdfan

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 5,887 posts
Joined: Mar 18, 2006

Posted 02 October 2012 - 02:17 PM

Every time this has come up, I've been told there weren't enough people using the eSATA function for this change to be authorized by D*.


Because everyone knows how flaky the externals can be so they just replaced the internals and the TOS be damned. :eek2:

I didn't say that out loud did I?

My Setup

 

Why can I get to the "Adult's Only" area faster than I can get to the "ToDo" List?  DirecTV, that is messed up!!!


...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#82 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

RunnerFL

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 15,506 posts
Joined: Jan 04, 2006

Posted 02 October 2012 - 02:26 PM

Actually, OSX is a descendant of NeXT, which was derived from Unix and borrowed a few things from BSD Unix.


Which is like saying a Peanut Butter & Jelly sandwich has no grapes involved. Since NeXT comes from BSD and OSX comes from NeXT that means OSX comes from BSD. And by "borrowed a few things" you mean the core of everything it does, then yes they "borrowed a few things". I just cut out the middle man to avoid straying too far off topic with long drawn out posts on trying to copy content from one drive to another using OSX.

Now as for the topic....

It's clear that the technology is out there that will allow sharing drives between DVRs, now it's just a matter of convincing DirecTV that they need to allow this.
THIS SPACE FOR RENT

#83 OFFLINE   inkahauts

inkahauts

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 14,030 posts
Joined: Nov 13, 2006

Posted 02 October 2012 - 02:27 PM

Because everyone knows how flaky the externals can be so they just replaced the internals and the TOS be damned. :eek2:

I didn't say that out loud did I?


I doubt more the .001 % of people have esata drives connected, and less than half that who would actualy consider opening up and replacing the internal drvie.

#84 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

RunnerFL

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 15,506 posts
Joined: Jan 04, 2006

Posted 02 October 2012 - 02:27 PM

Because everyone knows how flaky the externals can be so they just replaced the internals and the TOS be damned. :eek2:

I didn't say that out loud did I?


You're probably pretty close to being absolutely correct unfortunately. I don't agree with externals being flaky though. I haven't had any issues with an eSATA device on a DirecTV DVR.
THIS SPACE FOR RENT

#85 OFFLINE   P Smith

P Smith

    Mr. FixAnything

  • Registered
  • 19,393 posts
  • LocationBay Area
Joined: Jul 25, 2002

Posted 02 October 2012 - 02:36 PM

I doubt more the .001 % of people have esata drives connected, and less than half that who would actualy consider opening up and replacing the internal drvie.


20000000 customer / 100000 = 200 DVRs
is that what you mean ?

#86 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • Topic Starter
  • DBSTalk Club
  • 19,403 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 02 October 2012 - 03:17 PM

Rich....you should duck about now. :lol:

Actually, OSX is a descendant of NeXT, which was derived from Unix and borrowed a few things from BSD Unix. BSD is another derivative of Unix that has evolved quite a bit since it's "mating" to NeXT and MacOS. Linux is yet a third derivative of Unix.

All 3 operating systems have a common root, Unix, but evolved along different paths.

Edit: One other thing....most of the networking layer in Microsoft Windows was adapted from BSD.


Wow! Thanx for the warning... :lol:

Rich

#87 OFFLINE   hdtvfan0001

hdtvfan0001

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 31,529 posts
Joined: Jul 28, 2004

Posted 02 October 2012 - 04:06 PM

It's to the point we might need breadcrumbs to find out way home on this discussion. :D
DBSTalk CHAT ROOM MODERATOR
DirecTV Customer Since 1996

#88 OFFLINE   Herdfan

Herdfan

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 5,887 posts
Joined: Mar 18, 2006

Posted 02 October 2012 - 04:37 PM

You're probably pretty close to being absolutely correct unfortunately. I don't agree with externals being flaky though. I haven't had any issues with an eSATA device on a DirecTV DVR.


I don't necessarily mean DirecTV's implementation of eSATA, but instead external drives having issues. I have had several and every single one of them has had issues. Now the issue on my MX-1's was simply the fan would get dusty and need to be cleaned, but still walking into a room and hearing your hard drive making noise is a bit unsettling.

My internals run much better.

And I would guess there are more than 200 here on this board who have changed internals.

My Setup

 

Why can I get to the "Adult's Only" area faster than I can get to the "ToDo" List?  DirecTV, that is messed up!!!


#89 OFFLINE   dennisj00

dennisj00

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 7,900 posts
  • LocationLake Norman, NC
Joined: Sep 27, 2007

Posted 02 October 2012 - 06:05 PM

Somehow we expect a $39 enclosure with a $99 drive to be reliable 24x7 for several years on a port that's unsupported with a 12" cable!!

Spending to stimulate the economy as fast as the credit cards will allow!

My Setup / Weather at Lake Norman!/ Boathouse BEES
DLB, MRV, nomad, HDGUI are HERE! . . . We're DONE!


#90 OFFLINE   Davenlr

Davenlr

    Geek til I die

  • Registered
  • 9,085 posts
Joined: Sep 16, 2006

Posted 02 October 2012 - 06:11 PM

Somehow we expect a $39 enclosure with a $99 drive to be reliable 24x7 for several years on a port that's unsupported with a 12" cable!!


Going on 3 yrs now...not a single issue yet :)

Tivo Premier XL4, Tivo Premier, Tivo HD whole home on Xfinity HD, DirecTv Whole Home with 39" high gain KaKu dish, Roku3,SageTv 8 TB Win8 Server -> DVDO Edge-> Denon AVR, Klipsch KB15's/Panasonic 55ST60 plasma"


#91 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

RunnerFL

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 15,506 posts
Joined: Jan 04, 2006

Posted 02 October 2012 - 07:17 PM

Somehow we expect a $39 enclosure with a $99 drive to be reliable 24x7 for several years on a port that's unsupported with a 12" cable!!


Why shouldn't we? They are the exact same drives, or in some cases better, that are inside and the same cables...
THIS SPACE FOR RENT

#92 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

RunnerFL

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 15,506 posts
Joined: Jan 04, 2006

Posted 02 October 2012 - 07:18 PM

Going on 3 yrs now...not a single issue yet :)


I've got one that's right around that area too.
THIS SPACE FOR RENT

#93 OFFLINE   inkahauts

inkahauts

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 14,030 posts
Joined: Nov 13, 2006

Posted 02 October 2012 - 09:00 PM

20000000 customer / 100000 = 200 DVRs
is that what you mean ?


Yeah, I doubt that even 500 people have ever opened up a hrx to install a larger hard drive.

#94 OFFLINE   P Smith

P Smith

    Mr. FixAnything

  • Registered
  • 19,393 posts
  • LocationBay Area
Joined: Jul 25, 2002

Posted 02 October 2012 - 09:46 PM

If only one Rich did 60, then your number is not correct for sure.

#95 OFFLINE   hdtvfan0001

hdtvfan0001

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 31,529 posts
Joined: Jul 28, 2004

Posted 03 October 2012 - 06:42 AM

Yeah, I doubt that even 500 people have ever opened up a hrx to install a larger hard drive.

Does doing about 15 by one person count somehow? ;):D

As for the topic at hand...I'm still trying to comprehend any "danger"... :shrug:

I "get" all the other stuff.
DBSTalk CHAT ROOM MODERATOR
DirecTV Customer Since 1996

#96 OFFLINE   Herdfan

Herdfan

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 5,887 posts
Joined: Mar 18, 2006

Posted 03 October 2012 - 07:20 AM

As for the topic at hand...I'm still trying to comprehend any "danger"... :shrug:


I guess the "danger" is the possibility of losing your recordings. And while I would not want to, it is not the as a big of issue as it used to be. When DVR's came and I had a TiVo Series 1, if you lost a drive or something didn't record, you were SOL until it that episode came back as a rerun.

Today, it is not the issue it was because you can always watch it online or buy it from iTunes. But still I don't want to lose everything.

One thing you have here, and the providers have help people buy into it with larger and larger hard drives, is that we now use DRV's for archiving as much as time-shifting. There are some shows that get watched later the same day or within the week. There are others that will stack up and get watched say over Thanksgiving week when no new shows are on.

If we did nothing but time-shift within a week time period, we would not need 1T drives. Wouldn't need 500GB drives. But the providers included them to entice customers into thinking they can keep 100/200/500 hours of content.

At that point, I think they have a responsibility to do all they can to allow the customer to save their content should there be a box failure. Now they can't do anything about drive failure, but they can about other types of receiver failures.

My Setup

 

Why can I get to the "Adult's Only" area faster than I can get to the "ToDo" List?  DirecTV, that is messed up!!!


#97 OFFLINE   harsh

harsh

    Beware the Attack Basset

  • Registered
  • 17,838 posts
  • LocationSalem, OR
Joined: Jun 14, 2003

Posted 03 October 2012 - 08:41 AM

BSD is another derivative of Unix that has evolved quite a bit since it's "mating" to NeXT and MacOS.

BSD doesn't really exist anymore aside from a handful of spin-offs. Berkeley turned the project off in 1995 after an 18 year run.

Edit: One other thing....most of the networking layer in Microsoft Windows was adapted from BSD.

Adaptation is a practice that Microsoft doesn't typically employ. See more at "unauthorized borrowing".

The original NT stack was based on a stack from Spider Systems that was a BSD derivative. Microsoft subsequently came into possession of a new "from scratch" winsock stack that was distributed in NT3.5 and Windows 95. The reason the copyright notice is still in there has to do with the fact that some of the ancillary programs from the Spider incarnation that aren't part of the transport layer were never rewritten (ftp, rcp, rsh).

http://www.kuro5hin....6/19/05641/7357

Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. -- JFK


#98 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • Topic Starter
  • DBSTalk Club
  • 19,403 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 03 October 2012 - 08:47 AM

I doubt more the .001 % of people have esata drives connected, and less than half that who would actualy consider opening up and replacing the internal drvie.


That's the wall we hit every time we start a thread such as this. If people understood the benefits of an external drive, I think they'd go for it.

My wife was at a business dinner recently and someone brought up D*. After a bit of listening, she told the table about the system we have and, while several people had D*, they had no idea what MRV was. That surprised me. It's not like D* didn't advertise it when it was introduced. People just seem to tune out what they don't understand. My point being, if folks don't know about a fully supported function, one that was widely advertised, how are they gonna know and understand an unsupported and unadvertised function such as the eSATA function?

Not that I want to see D* go into the external drive business. I like the freedom to choose my HDDs myself. And my external devices.

Kind of a quandary, no?

Rich

#99 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • Topic Starter
  • DBSTalk Club
  • 19,403 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 03 October 2012 - 08:55 AM

I don't necessarily mean DirecTV's implementation of eSATA, but instead external drives having issues. I have had several and every single one of them has had issues. Now the issue on my MX-1's was simply the fan would get dusty and need to be cleaned, but still walking into a room and hearing your hard drive making noise is a bit unsettling.

My internals run much better.

And I would guess there are more than 200 here on this board who have changed internals.


The externals seem to have problems with the external devices, not the HDDs in them. I don't know how many "bad" FAPs and Xtremes I threw away before I tried ripping the HDD out of them and putting it in another external device. And the HDDs worked. It was mostly the external devices that caused my problems. They're cheap and you get what you pay for. I have had less trouble with the Thermaltake docking stations than any other external device I've tried.

I've got eight HRs that I own and have a 2TB HDD in all of them. They just run better with a large HDD internally.

Rich

#100 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • Topic Starter
  • DBSTalk Club
  • 19,403 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 03 October 2012 - 08:58 AM

Why shouldn't we? They are the exact same drives, or in some cases better, that are inside and the same cables...


The enclosures are the weak link in the chain. I've had many failures.

Rich




spam firewall