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C31 vs HR24


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77 replies to this topic

#51 OFFLINE   raott

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 07:21 AM

I think anyone can find a "what if" case.
U-Verse has customers, but is limited to 3 or 4 channels.
The HR34 & C31 can share a tuner, which is nice, as the commercial for Whole Home DVR becomes a bit more of a reality, as you're not limited to recordings, but can do it with live TV.
Have you ever run out of tuners on the HR34 with a C31?
It pops up a screen where you select which recording to interrupt.
If Genie were "in my way", it would get stopped.
If the "couple of teenagers" end up putting more demand on the system, the customer can add/change them to a DVR.
You can't do this with U-Verse.


If I made a post about Uverse and how great it was (which I don't think it is) Uverse would get blasted about its limitation regarding the number of HD channels that can be used.

I've never run out of tuners on the HR34 with a C31 because it has not been released yet and I've never once (been a customer since 1997 and a member here for many, many years) been offered free equipment to test. I would suspect there are some here that have repeatedly been given free equipment to test.

Genie being in the way was the entire point of my initial post. Directv's initiatives are good ones (Genie and the C31), my point, and I was simply thinking out loud, was whether the HR34 had sufficient tuners so that a customer wasn't left with failed expectations when they run out of tuners. IMO, 8 would be a better number (I'm not the only one who has offered that opinion, I've seen a poster who is an installer and ardent Directv supporter offer the same).
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#52 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 07:48 AM

Genie being in the way was the entire point of my initial post. Directv's initiatives are good ones (Genie and the C31), my point, and I was simply thinking out loud, was whether the HR34 had sufficient tuners so that a customer wasn't left with failed expectations when they run out of tuners. IMO, 8 would be a better number.

"My point" was more that customers adapt to what they have.
I'd guess if there were 8 tuners, there would still be those that didn't have enough.
A "new install" wouldn't have "failed expectations", would it?
If the customer finds they need more, they can add to their setup.
The current HR34 & 3 HD receiver install is using the 8 tuners from the SWiM, so it does make some sense to only have 5 in the HR34.
Move to the HR34 & C31s and there is a option for another DVR.
If I had a couple of teenagers, "I'll tell you", I wouldn't want their playlist being shared. :lol:
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#53 OFFLINE   carl6

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 08:29 AM

Lets just agree to disagree.


Good advice for everyone.

I too have a C31, and overall it is a great little unit. There are certain situations where I prefer having a DVR as opposed to a C31. There are situations where the C31 is the better solution. There is no single solution that is perfect for every customer.

One thing I will say though, in general the information you get on this web site, on these forums, is going to be as current and accurate as any you will get anyplace, including DirecTV.

#54 OFFLINE   TheRatPatrol

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 09:32 AM

Smart move from a cost perspective, but not very thought out if that proves to be true as the HR34 does not have enough tuners to allow for a seamless TV watching experience (ie using double play) have Genie operating and the customer trying to record a show all the while supporting 3 C31s.

In that scenario the customer will have C31s without tuners of their own and a major new feature in Genie pulling one (or even multiple) tuners for its use. So what is the customer left with to watch TV if he's also recording a show?

I see a customer getting frustrated by constantly having to to juggle and ration tuners to make it all work.

The HR34 should have had 8 tuners IMO (or change the silly policy of one HR34 per account).

I agree.

An 8 tuner HMC would make more sense if it has to share tuners with the clients. Then you could stream 3-4 live channels while still having tuners left over to record and watch on the main TV. This would also make installs easier, one HMC with clients, taking advantage of the SWiM 8.

Rumor is that there is a new HR44 in the works, but it may only have 3 tuners in it. Could this be a "supplement" to the HR34? 5+3 giving you 8 tuners total, taking advantage of the SWiM 8 and giving you more tuners for the clients?

None of this has been confirmed yet and probably won't be until CES.

#55 OFFLINE   dpeters11

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 09:36 AM

Not to get off topic, but I find it funny that David Bott just recently wrote this article on what a home theater is. Maybe he's right and we need to start using a new term.

http://www.avsforum....s-it-now-anyway

#56 OFFLINE   armophob

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 11:53 AM

Kind of silly at this point in the game.
It is simply what was coined a while back for a stereo system and a large screen.

#57 OFFLINE   Diana C

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 11:57 AM

A family of 5 with a couple of teenagers and three TVs in the house would hardly be considered "power users". The 5 tuners aren't just for recording, they have to support live TV as well if D* moves to a 3 C31 installation. But I agree that if each TV is being used, the net affect of tuners available for recording /watching live TV would be the same as having an HR2X with 3 receivers (ie 5 total tuners) with the added benefit of being able to pause live TV on the other TVs.

The point I was making is the wildcard is Genie. If that is a major push, there is simply not enough tuners. People will either be unable to use Genie or be aggravated because they constantly have to ration tuners in the house. Especially in the current implementation where Genie seems to take tuners as it pleases to the point it interferes with live TV.


I guess I just don't understand this...

Today, the "standard" promotion is 1 dual-tuner DVR and 3 HD receivers, giving the customer 5 total tuners, only 2 of which can record, and only 4 of which can be used for live TV (since this is a 4 outlet setup) which leaves one always available for recording.

If the new standard were to become a HR34 and 3 C31s, the customer still has 5 tuners, only four of which can be used for live TV, leaving one for recording at all times, but with the possibility of using more than 2 recording tuners if live TV isn't required at one or more of the C31s.

Since Genie is ALWAYS subordinate to scheduled recordings (and I assume live TV requests) and only records things you don't explicitly ask for, I don't see how it can interfere with the use of the system. If all the tuners are in use, Genie will do nothing. Is this an issue? The customer would be totally unaware that Genie MIGHT have recorded something if a tuner was available.

Seems to me that the hypothetical "standard install" has more net functionality with the HR34/C31 configuration than with the HR2X/H2X configuration. In addition, I am confident the C31 uses less power when idle than a H2X receiver, so you save energy as well.

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#58 OFFLINE   sigma1914

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 12:05 PM

It's funny reading all the backlash about not having live tuners as a negative for a C31 when most of the time posters are constantly saying they never watch commercials or live tv any more. Which is it? ;)
If you stop responding to them or put them on ignore, then eventually they'll go away.

#59 OFFLINE   raott

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 12:29 PM

I guess I just don't understand this...

Today, the "standard" promotion is 1 dual-tuner DVR and 3 HD receivers, giving the customer 5 total tuners, only 2 of which can record, and only 4 of which can be used for live TV (since this is a 4 outlet setup) which leaves one always available for recording.

If the new standard were to become a HR34 and 3 C31s, the customer still has 5 tuners, only four of which can be used for live TV, leaving one for recording at all times, but with the possibility of using more than 2 recording tuners if live TV isn't required at one or more of the C31s.

Since Genie is ALWAYS subordinate to scheduled recordings (and I assume live TV requests) and only records things you don't explicitly ask for, I don't see how it can interfere with the use of the system. If all the tuners are in use, Genie will do nothing. Is this an issue? The customer would be totally unaware that Genie MIGHT have recorded something if a tuner was available.

Seems to me that the hypothetical "standard install" has more net functionality with the HR34/C31 configuration than with the HR2X/H2X configuration. In addition, I am confident the C31 uses less power when idle than a H2X receiver, so you save energy as well.


Most of what you posted I agree with and in fact stated in my prior posts. However, Genie has NOT been shown to be subordinate to live TV, in fact, there are a number of threads that indicate the opposite. Whether this is a bug, due to the lack of feedback from Directv, I suppose we will have to wait for that answer.

My point was, the new flagship has 5 tuners. The C31 install each takes a tuner, now you are down to two. I was simply thinking out loud that, with a new feature that takes one or more tuners to maximize its potential, and an install that takes three tuners, the HR34 may have been better served having more than 5 tuners. The standard install today does not have Genie potentially taking tuners.
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#60 OFFLINE   raott

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 12:34 PM

It's funny reading all the backlash about not having live tuners as a negative for a C31 when most of the time posters are constantly saying they never watch commercials or live tv any more. Which is it? ;)


I don't see backlash about the lack of tuner in a C31. I think they are a great idea. Personally, I watch live TV often, especially sports and news. I think the average user likely watches more live TV than recorded material. But, it was actually a former mod that once posted that a DVR was a "recorder" putting the word "recorder" in great big huge capital letters, way back when many people were complaining about the lack of DLBs, insinuating that those who watched live TV were actually doing things wrong.
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#61 OFFLINE   Steve

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 12:51 PM

Installation scheduled for Friday. Install HR34, HR24, and 2 C31's.

Believe it or not, there are times I've got five HR34 shows recording at once in prime time, and none of them are the baseball playoffs. Based on this, I'd go with an HR2x instead of a C31, if up-front cost is not a consideration. Downside is you'll have to manage multiple Series Managers and TDLs.
/steve

#62 OFFLINE   Drucifer

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 02:33 PM

The DirecTV site should have a worksheet that allow to check off rooms from a list and then add how many viewers will be in each room.

Which when filled out would describe the options available for each room.

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#63 OFFLINE   unislick

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 07:22 PM

Although this thread seems to have multiple personalities, it has provided me with much insight (even if I didn't ask for it :-)).

A sanity check. Recall my equipment (HR34, HR24, C31, C31)

The C31 ONLY steals a tuner when viewing live TV, correct? I will have one C31 that will probably only be used but a dozen times a year (guest bedroom in the basement). Therefore, that leaves 3 tuners to record from and still be watching live tv on the HR34 and a C31. In the event, I want to tape 4 recordings at a time, I can record the 4th or 5th (depending on if live tv is being used) on the HR24 and still see these recordings from all the other TVs (HR34 and the C31s). Do I have this right?

This setup gives me less recording conflicts and the ability to see content across DVRs than my current 3 VIP722s from DISH. The only thing I am concerned with is storage space as I can store up 600 hours of HD (200 hours on each VIP722) and this Directv setup will only give me 300 hours of space. But, DISH and I's marriage got rocky with the big ten network debacle they recently just settled.

#64 OFFLINE   Steve

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 09:07 PM

The C31 ONLY steals a tuner when viewing live TV, correct? I will have one C31 that will probably only be used but a dozen times a year (guest bedroom in the basement). Therefore, that leaves 3 tuners to record from and still be watching live tv on the HR34 and a C31. In the event, I want to tape 4 recordings at a time, I can record the 4th or 5th (depending on if live tv is being used) on the HR24 and still see these recordings from all the other TVs (HR34 and the C31s). Do I have this right?

You do. Just requires a little planning, as you say. Otherwise you may sit down at a C31 or HR34 to watch LIVE and only then realize you have a conflict, when it now may be too late to move a recording in progress to the HR24.

Just pointing this out, because here's what I have scheduled for tonight and Wednesday, both nights I'll want to be watching playoff baseball live on TBS. As you can see, if I wanted to sit at the 34 or C31, I'd likely have to cancel the scheduled recordings on 231 each night and hope those episodes will be re-aired.

Attached Thumbnails

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/steve

#65 OFFLINE   Diana C

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 05:48 AM

...This setup gives me less recording conflicts and the ability to see content across DVRs than my current 3 VIP722s from DISH. The only thing I am concerned with is storage space as I can store up 600 hours of HD (200 hours on each VIP722) and this Directv setup will only give me 300 hours of space. But, DISH and I's marriage got rocky with the big ten network debacle they recently just settled.


You could put a 2 or 3TB external on the HR34 to get up to 400 or 600 hours on there if 300 hours total is an issue.

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#66 OFFLINE   Rickt1962

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 07:46 AM

Rickt1962

What other free devices enable one to watch DVR content from elsewhere in your home (more specifically other TVs...mobile devices aren't preferred for me)?


All u need is a http://www.smarthome...odulator/p.aspx I have my DVR plugged into this and every TV in my house on Channel 122 get My DVR TV or Movies using the DirecTv RF remote

U can buy a 4 channel modulator and send your DVD player to all TV's and outside video camera's etc etc endless uses for it. And you dont pay a per month fee to view YOUR Content of YOUR DVR

If i was single and living alone , The only way i would go the route of paying the monthly fee is if I purchased a NEW TV From Samsung with the RVU built ! Unit would look nice on the Bedroom wall and No boxes to deal with.

But buying the C31 oops Renting since you have to pay everymonth doesnot make sense. For the same money get another DVR

#67 OFFLINE   RAD

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 07:58 AM

Now if they came up with a RF modulator that did HD signals vs SD for $45 I'd be all over that. But all my TV's are HD and a SD only solution like you're isn't something I'd do.

See post My Setup for configuration info.


#68 OFFLINE   Davenlr

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 08:03 AM

Now if they came up with a RF modulator that did HD signals vs SD for $45 I'd be all over that. But all my TV's are HD and a SD only solution like you're isn't something I'd do.


Ive been looking for an ATSC modulator since ATSC came out. Nothing but commercial units for big bucks.

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#69 OFFLINE   Rickt1962

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 08:16 AM

Now if they came up with a RF modulator that did HD signals vs SD for $45 I'd be all over that. But all my TV's are HD and a SD only solution like you're isn't something I'd do.


Just install a HDMI Splitter in the back of your DVR then convert to Cat 5 wire it can go upto a 150' Cheap way they do make a RF Modulator in HDMI but dam its expensive !

#70 OFFLINE   RAD

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 08:25 AM

Just install a HDMI Splitter in the back of your DVR then convert to Cat 5 wire it can go upto a 150' Cheap way they do make a RF Modulator in HDMI but dam its expensive !


It's a nice idea if you have an easy way to be running a dedicated cat 5 cable to the locations you need. Most home have coax run to things like bedrooms but not a cat 5.

See post My Setup for configuration info.


#71 OFFLINE   spartanstew

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 08:30 AM

All u need is a http://www.smarthome...odulator/p.aspx I have my DVR plugged into this and every TV in my house on Channel 122 get My DVR TV or Movies using the DirecTv RF remote

U can buy a 4 channel modulator and send your DVD player to all TV's and outside video camera's etc etc endless uses for it. And you dont pay a per month fee to view YOUR Content of YOUR DVR

If i was single and living alone , The only way i would go the route of paying the monthly fee is if I purchased a NEW TV From Samsung with the RVU built ! Unit would look nice on the Bedroom wall and No boxes to deal with.

But buying the C31 oops Renting since you have to pay everymonth doesnot make sense. For the same money get another DVR


I used a channel plus modulator for many years (still hooked up, actually), but we haven't used it in about 6 months. Got tired of the SD and now that there's MRV, just decided to spend the extra $15 per month in mirror fees to have HD everywhere.

I'm sure Directv can't wait to get their hands on your unit.

 
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#72 OFFLINE   harperhometheater

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 11:45 AM

It's a nice idea if you have an easy way to be running a dedicated cat 5 cable to the locations you need. Most home have coax run to things like bedrooms but not a cat 5.


Just use DECA or MoCA (if no DirecTV Signal is on that line).
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#73 OFFLINE   Steve

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 12:16 PM

I used a channel plus modulator for many years (still hooked up, actually), but we haven't used it in about 6 months. Got tired of the SD and now that there's MRV, just decided to spend the extra $15 per month in mirror fees to have HD everywhere.

My DirecTV bill is creeping up a bit too high, so I just did the opposite! :lol: For my two guest bedroom 4:3 CRTs, which are rarely used, I went from a box on each one of them, to one H21 in the attic connected to an RF modulator and an RF remote in each bedroom. The way I look at it, it's a $6 month saving that pays for the protection plan.

If there was a full-time occupant in either room, I'd upgrade it to a flat screen and full HD. For the 2-3 times a year someone's actually going to watch those screens, however, 4:3 SD is fine.
/steve

#74 OFFLINE   Rickt1962

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 12:24 PM

My DirecTV bill is creeping up a bit too high, so I just did the opposite! :lol: For my two guest bedroom 4:3 CRTs, which are rarely used, I went from a box on each one of them, to one H21 in the attic connected to an RF modulator and an RF remote in each bedroom. The way I look at it, it's a $6 month saving that pays for the protection plan.

If there was a full-time occupant in either room, I'd upgrade it to a flat screen and full HD. For the 2-3 times a year someone's actually going to watch those screens, however, 4:3 SD is fine.


Im the same way, SD is fine for all the small TV's around my house. Geeesh some people really get anal ! LOL When i watch a movie i want to be in front of my 65" HD with surround sound ! Thats wer i want the HD to be not my small TV's :nono:

#75 OFFLINE   Bill Broderick

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 12:25 PM

You do. Just requires a little planning, as you say. Otherwise you may sit down at a C31 or HR34 to watch LIVE and only then realize you have a conflict, when it now may be too late to move a recording in progress to the HR24.



But, on the few times that this happens, you can just set the HR-24 to record the show that you want to watch live, which will allow you to essentially "steal" one of the HR-24 tuners to watch that live show on whatever TV you want.




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