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Genie "The Good Stuff" Discussion


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138 replies to this topic

#101 OFFLINE   jangell2

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:02 AM

That's because no one would buy anything over six feet at the prices they'd charge for such a cable in a big box store. :D

Since you have a cable that is working in the meantime, and thus could tolerate a few days' shipping time, consider buying one of ideal length from Monoprice. Some are even made of RG6, and ten-footers are still under $5. Non-RG6 less than half that.

The rush was that I wanted to get back there today and hookup my AppleTV and the new coax. It is a freaking pain-in-the-ass to get back there and I won't trouble you with the details. I ordered the cable from Amazon on my phone while I was out shopping. Should have it tomorrow.

My question above about needing an antenna has been answered. I found an AM antenna in my box o' electronic junk and now RF works.

As to the difference between digital and non-digital coax, the digital ones have the phono style connectors for one. Not sure about other differences.
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#102 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:01 AM

What makes a coaxial cable "digital" or not? Is it the price, or is there really something in the specs?


Coaxial audio is always digital.
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#103 OFFLINE   Laxguy

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:22 AM

Coaxial audio is always digital.


Thanks, but I was asking about the cable itself: Is the word "digital" added to make it sound more modern (sorta like a "digital TV stand") or are they in fact different from any other coax in the cabling?
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#104 OFFLINE   Rich

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 12:04 PM

Thanks, but I was asking about the cable itself: Is the word "digital" added to make it sound more modern (sorta like a "digital TV stand") or are they in fact different from any other coax in the cabling?


Interesting question you pose. Before things changed, you could use coax for analog signals from your TV antenna. We're using the same coax (OK, different sizes) for our digital signals.

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#105 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 12:10 PM

Thanks, but I was asking about the cable itself: Is the word "digital" added to make it sound more modern (sorta like a "digital TV stand") or are they in fact different from any other coax in the cabling?


Still not sure I get you here... There's only one kind of Coax Audio and that's digital. Are you asking if there is a difference between a coax audio cable and RG6 coax? Yes, definitely different.
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#106 OFFLINE   Rich

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 12:21 PM

Still not sure I get you here... There's only one kind of Coax Audio and that's digital. Are you asking if there is a difference between a coax audio cable and RG6 coax? Yes, definitely different.


I actually tried to use a normal RG6 coax on my AVR and it didn't work. What do they put in the audio coax cables to make them different?

I remember MI (I think that's the right name, not sure) coax that we used in our powerhouse for something. When stripped, it looked just like any other coax but with a larger center wire. That stuff was old, really old. Like 1936 old.

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#107 OFFLINE   TMan

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 12:39 PM

One could make a digital audio cable from RG6 coax, RG59 coax, or I imagine others. Are the cheap cables they sometimes include in, for example, a basic DVD player even technically coax at all?

I have made cables myself with bulk RG6 cable, some RCA/phono connectors, and a couple of hand tools. One carries digital audio from my DVD player to my AV receiver. Another carries the ".1" preamp signal from that receiver to my subwoofer. Another is mostly in the wall and carries composite video to my ceiling projector. I also have a bundled cable that consists of three RG6 cables in one sheath to carry component video to the projector.

For audio-video interconnects, I imagine the center conductor being copper-clad steel or solid copper doesn't matter too much. For carrying signals from a satellite dish to the satellite boxes in the house, or for the cable company service drop, the conductor would matter.

RG59 is mostly considered inadequate for wiring a home for cable/satellite distribution these days, but you could still make a-v interconnects with it. The Monoprice link I posted above has both RG6- and RG59-based cables.
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#108 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 12:47 PM

I actually tried to use a normal RG6 coax on my AVR and it didn't work. What do they put in the audio coax cables to make them different?

I remember MI (I think that's the right name, not sure) coax that we used in our powerhouse for something. When stripped, it looked just like any other coax but with a larger center wire. That stuff was old, really old. Like 1936 old.

Rich


Well I think the confusion lies in the assumption that solid core coax (RG-58, RG-59, RG-6, etc) is the only "coax" there is. Any cable with two "axis", aka conductors, is coaxial. Technically your standard L/R (White/Red) RCA cables are coax as well. You just don't see people calling them that. That's why I do my best to call it RG-6 instead of "coax".

Coaxial cable has a wire conductor in the centre (solid or stranded) a circumferential outer conductor and an insulating medium called the dielectric separating these two conductors.
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#109 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 12:48 PM

Are the cheap cables they sometimes include in, for example, a basic DVD player even technically coax at all?


If they weren't coaxial, 2 conductor, they wouldn't work.
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#110 OFFLINE   Laxguy

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 01:00 PM

Thanks, Gents and Ladies.

I am clear now on the nomenclature, but not clear on why a well made RG6 cable with RCA style plugs wouldn't work as a "digital audio cable". Or, in fact, why an old "analog" RCA cable wouldn't work for short runs of digital audio if the quality of the wires was good (and no big outside interference, etc.)
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#111 OFFLINE   Rich

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 01:13 PM

Well I think the confusion lies in the assumption that solid core coax (RG-58, RG-59, RG-6, etc) is the only "coax" there is. Any cable with two "axis", aka conductors, is coaxial. Technically your standard L/R (White/Red) RCA cables are coax as well. You just don't see people calling them that. That's why I do my best to call it RG-6 instead of "coax".

Coaxial cable has a wire conductor in the centre (solid or stranded) a circumferential outer conductor and an insulating medium called the dielectric separating these two conductors.


I know all that!

No electrician worth his salt would confuse RCA cables with what we think of as coax. Still, that didn't stop me from wondering if the digital audio coax doesn't have two conductors instead of one. What is the difference between audio coax and RG6? I've never stripped an audio coax and I really don't know the difference.

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#112 OFFLINE   Rich

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 01:17 PM

Thanks, Gents and Ladies.

I am clear now on the nomenclature, but not clear on why a well made RG6 cable with RCA style plugs wouldn't work as a "digital audio cable". Or, in fact, why an old "analog" RCA cable wouldn't work for short runs of digital audio if the quality of the wires was good (and no big outside interference, etc.)


I dunno either, but I had a hell of a time putting (jamming, cramming, trimming, squeezing) that cable into an RCA plug. One of my "unlazy" days. And after all that, it didn't work. I think I also tried a regular RCA cable too and that didn't work either.

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#113 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 01:24 PM

Thanks, Gents and Ladies.

I am clear now on the nomenclature, but not clear on why a well made RG6 cable with RCA style plugs wouldn't work as a "digital audio cable". Or, in fact, why an old "analog" RCA cable wouldn't work for short runs of digital audio if the quality of the wires was good (and no big outside interference, etc.)


I'm not sure about an RG-6 cable but an old, as you call it, "analog RCA cable" should work as a temporary measure. It's just the quality of it isn't going to be as good as a cable made for a S/PDIF signal.
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#114 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 01:29 PM

No electrician worth his salt would confuse RCA cables with what we think of as coax.


Maybe not, but they are technically both "coax".

Still, that didn't stop me from wondering if the digital audio coax doesn't have two conductors instead of one.


You didn't read what I posted I guess.. The DO have two conductors. If they didn't have two conductors they wouldn't be "coax". Co = 2 axial = axis/conductor

Again, coax isn't just the solid core RG cables.

What is the difference between audio coax and RG6? I've never stripped an audio coax and I really don't know the difference.


One is solid core the other is stranded.
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#115 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 01:43 PM

The Coax Audio cables that monoprice sells use RG6/U, the U being unbalanced. Maybe that's why plain RG6 doesn't work. Also if you've ever held a coax audio cable you'll realize it's not a solid core cable.

http://www.monoprice...&seq=1&format=2
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#116 OFFLINE   Laxguy

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 02:01 PM

I'm not sure about an RG-6 cable but an old, as you call it, "analog RCA cable" should work as a temporary measure. It's just the quality of it isn't going to be as good as a cable made for a S/PDIF signal.


Absolutely. In fact, a non-coax cable could work there, but would be the worst of the temporary connections.

I didn't think about it until you posted it that RCA cables were coax. At least the cheapest looking one I had is when I axed it for the sake of science.....:P
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#117 OFFLINE   Rich

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 02:07 PM

Maybe not, but they are technically both "coax".


Wasn't disagreeing, just an opinion.


You didn't read what I posted I guess.. The DO have two conductors. If they didn't have two conductors they wouldn't be "coax". Co = 2 axial = axis/conductor


I wasn't clear. I thought there might be two solid conductors in the audio cable separated by the dielectric.

One is solid core the other is stranded.


What's the difference? I know from an electrician's POV, 12AWG is the same, stranded or solid.

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#118 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 02:08 PM

Absolutely. In fact, a non-coax cable could work there, but would be the worst of the temporary connections.

I didn't think about it until you posted it that RCA cables were coax. At least the cheapest looking one I had is when I axed it for the sake of science.....:P


Any 2 conductor wire should work but how good it sounds it what matters most. :lol:
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#119 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 02:11 PM

What's the difference? I know from an electrician's POV, 12AWG is the same, stranded or solid.


I'm searching for specs but from what I've been able to gather (without chopping up my S/PDIF cables) is that they have a 7 conductor stranded center core. Other than that they appear to be the same as your "standard" RG6 as far as the braided outter core.

They are both listed as "75 ohm coax".

UPDATE: What's the difference? Apparently the type of coax used for connecting satellite and antenna feeds are "a completely different kettle of fish". Does that explain it enough? :lol:

http://www.dummies.c...nd-optical.html

Edited by RunnerFL, 29 November 2012 - 02:24 PM.

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#120 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 03:38 PM

I'm searching for specs but from what I've been able to gather (without chopping up my S/PDIF cables) is that they have a 7 conductor stranded center core. Other than that they appear to be the same as your "standard" RG6 as far as the braided outter core.

They are both listed as "75 ohm coax".

UPDATE: What's the difference? Apparently the type of coax used for connecting satellite and antenna feeds are "a completely different kettle of fish". Does that explain it enough? :lol:

http://www.dummies.c...nd-optical.html


I find this somewhat odd. I have never put RCA connectors on rg6 sat coax and tried it for digital coax connections, but I would think it should work, for that works fine for regular composite video from what I have seen, and composite video cables work fine for digital coax cables, which I have tried.




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