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36 replies to this topic

#26 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 12:52 PM

My guess is that some, not all, of you need to properly adjust your audio setups if you are having that much trouble with the dialog in these mixes.
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#27 OFFLINE   bigglebowski

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 03:05 PM

Do you think the bass is taking away from the vocals?

#28 OFFLINE   Michael P

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 03:50 PM

My guess is that some, not all, of you need to properly adjust your audio setups if you are having that much trouble with the dialog in these mixes.


There is little that can be done at the "end user's" location, unless they have a Dolby Digital set-up and can adjust the front center speaker separately from the other channels.

For those of us listening in "2.0" the only adjustment is to shut off the surround feature (if our TV's have that feature). 98% of the time the dialog gets washed out when the surround is turned on. I bet many who have this feature don't even know it's there or how to change it.
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#29 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 03:57 PM

There is little that can be done at the "end user's" location, unless they have a Dolby Digital set-up and can adjust the front center speaker separately from the other channels.

For those of us listening in "2.0" the only adjustment is to shut off the surround feature (if our TV's have that feature). 98% of the time the dialog gets washed out when the surround is turned on. I bet many who have this feature don't even know it's there or how to change it.


For the most part, those people listening in 2.0 are listening to mixes produced for 5.1 environments. It will bury the dialog more than it should be. Then you have people who do have a 5.1/7.1 setup, but they don't actually now how to utilize it properly.
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#30 OFFLINE   kenglish

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 01:50 PM

If the station or channel is not setting up the metadata properly, especially if it's vastly different from what the audio producer planned for, mix-down levels can be all over the place. (i.e.: Stations can, and often do, use their own metadata, rather than what was sent by the network or programming producer.)
Metadata can do everything from, describing the way channels mix-down, to how they are (volume, audibly) compressed on both surround and mix-down, to how the low-frequency audio is reproduced.

We use a box that does some "gain riding" and such, but NBC (and the Mormon Tabernacle Choir ;)) requires us to pass everything unmodified, so we switch it in and out of those modes via automation. The box just protects from over-level, uniformly across all channels, then.

#31 OFFLINE   satcrazy

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 11:02 AM

If the station or channel is not setting up the metadata properly, especially if it's vastly different from what the audio producer planned for, mix-down levels can be all over the place. (i.e.: Stations can, and often do, use their own metadata, rather than what was sent by the network or programming producer.)
Metadata can do everything from, describing the way channels mix-down, to how they are (volume, audibly) compressed on both surround and mix-down, to how the low-frequency audio is reproduced.

We use a box that does some "gain riding" and such, but NBC (and the Mormon Tabernacle Choir ;)) requires us to pass everything unmodified, so we switch it in and out of those modes via automation. The box just protects from over-level, uniformly across all channels, then.


This would then be the reason commercials on the same channel can have a vast difference in volume, correct? And also why some stations as a whole are louder as well?

Apparently the History channel can get it right, as I posted earlier.

Where is the uniformity?

#32 OFFLINE   Michael P

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 05:16 PM

Where is the uniformity?

Add to the confusion the "local insertion" commercials. On "cable channels" Dish inserts their own spots, on the local networks the local stations insert commercials. In both examples there is a chance for fluctuations (either up or down) in perceived audio levels. Keep in mind the key word is "perceived". From a strict technical point of view there is uniformity, however the human ear does not hear uniformly. Audio meters come in several variations (peak or average), neither can gauge perceived loudness. Even if a human were to sit at an audio console and monitor everything that is broadcast, that engineer hears the sound from his studio and not your living room/family room/bedroom etc. where the end product is heard. The acoustics of your listening environment also affects the end result.

This is an impossible situation, there is no way that a single audio stream can sound the same in every listening environment.
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#33 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 05:26 PM

Add to the confusion the "local insertion" commercials. On "cable channels" Dish inserts their own spots ...

DISH does this at the receiver level (as well as at the uplink) ... which adds to the complication. (Yes, some of those inserted ads are NOT on satellite feed ... they play from your DVR.)

#34 OFFLINE   satcrazy

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 02:24 PM

As if loud commercials aren't bad enough:

http://paidcontent.o...argeted-tv-ads/

[ yeah, HJ a little, ]

Hope this stays overseas....

#35 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 04:49 PM

Both DISH and DirecTV already do targeted advertising. :D
(Commercials played back on the customer's DVR to cover national commercials.)

#36 OFFLINE   satcrazy

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 05:01 PM

Both DISH and DirecTV already do targeted advertising. :D
(Commercials played back on the customer's DVR to cover national commercials.)


Ahhh

Didn't know this, as I don't have a dvr.

#37 OFFLINE   djlong

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 05:45 AM

I didn't think "Southern New Hampshire University" was paying for national spots :)




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