Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo

DIRECTV to Present at Citi's Global Internet, Media & Telecommunications Conference


  • Please log in to reply
77 replies to this topic

#51 OFFLINE   Sixto

Sixto

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,201 posts
Joined: Nov 17, 2005

Posted 09 January 2013 - 10:54 PM

I am saying that I don't believe that was the intended purpose, rather than your own purpose. If you use it for archiving purposes and that wasn't its intended use...that's on you. Seems silly to complain about losing your archives on a device intended for short-term recording rather than long-term archiving.

The point is that when you're capable of having 1TB (200+ HD) of DVR storage, when you do an upgrade, there may certainly be content that you want moved to the new DVR.

Allowing DVR to DVR transfers, within the same account, on current firmware, would be a significant benefit.

1TB certainly isn't needed if you watch everything that you record each week. :)
DirecTV: Genie HR44, H25, CCK, GenioGo, SWiM-16 & SWiM-8, DECA to Gigabit Switch with FiOS (75/75)
FiOS: Roamio Pro's (2), Roamio Plus, Mini's (4) with Ultimate HD (My Roamio Thoughts)

...Ads Help To Support This Site...

#52 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

Hoosier205

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,612 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2007

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:11 PM

The point is that when you're capable of having 1TB (200+ HD) of DVR storage, when you do an upgrade, there may certainly be content that you want moved to the new DVR.

Allowing DVR to DVR transfers, within the same account, on current firmware, would be a significant benefit.

1TB certainly isn't needed if you watch everything that you record each week. :)


I'm referring (for the most part) to people who archive content for years and, in some cases, complete multi-year series. It's like digital hoarding. They then whine when they cannot keep that content in permanent stasis for future collectors to drool over. These are not normal users. The intended purpose of a DVR is to allow people to pause and/or record reasonable amounts of content for reasonable periods of time. While "reasonable" is a broad term...it ain't that broad. Not the Library of Congress level of archiving that some people favor. Not a permanent collection.

Although I am taking about the extremists for the most part, I also don't understand the level of angst over lost recordings. Unless it was a program/event you had a direct involvement in, is it really that important? Regardless, you have other means of obtaining just about anything you can record with a DVR that might be more suitable for archiving purposes. If it is that important, you will.

I have gone through many DVR's. I lost recordings each time. None of it was irreplaceable.
DTV = Digital Television

#53 OFFLINE   Sixto

Sixto

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,201 posts
Joined: Nov 17, 2005

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:20 PM

I'm referring (for the most part) to people who archive content for years and, in some cases, complete multi-year series. It's like digital hoarding. They then whine when they cannot keep that content in permanent stasis for future collectors to drool over. These are not normal users. The intended purpose of a DVR is to allow people to pause and/or record reasonable amounts of content for reasonable periods of time. While "reasonable" is a broad term...it ain't that broad. Not the Library of Congress level of archiving that some people favor. Not a permanent collection.

Although I am taking about the extremists for the most part, I also don't understand the level of angst over lost recordings. Unless it was a program/event you had a direct involvement in, is it really that important? Regardless, you have other means of obtaining just about anything you can record with a DVR that might be more suitable for archiving purposes. If it is that important, you will.

I have gone through many DVR's. I lost recordings each time. None of it was irreplaceable.

Hi, gotcha, but still trying to understand your point.

So if someone records whole series, and saves stuff, that's bad?

If a DVR fails, well, then it fails, stuff happens, and there are raid solutions, but allowing content to be copied from one DVR to another would be a cool feature if one was looking to enhance the TV provider experience. Or get really cool and allow USB flash drive backup and restore, all encrypted with DRM protection, on the same account. We're talking high-end stuff, and they may decide that it's not worth the investment, but when monthly fees for some of us is approaching $200/mo, high-end features would be nice once in a while.
DirecTV: Genie HR44, H25, CCK, GenioGo, SWiM-16 & SWiM-8, DECA to Gigabit Switch with FiOS (75/75)
FiOS: Roamio Pro's (2), Roamio Plus, Mini's (4) with Ultimate HD (My Roamio Thoughts)

#54 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

Hoosier205

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,612 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2007

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:34 PM

Hi, gotcha, but still trying to understand your point.

So if someone records whole series, and saves stuff, that's bad?

If a DVR fails, well, then it fails, stuff happens, and there are raid solutions, but allowing content to be copied from one DVR to another would be a cool feature if one was looking to enhance the TV provider experience. Or get really cool and allow USB flash drive backup and restore, all encrypted with DRM protection, on the same account. We're talking high-end stuff, and they may decide that it's not worth the investment, but when monthly fees for some of us is approaching $200/mo, high-end features would be nice once in a while.


Using a DRV to archive an entire multi-year series...is ridiculous. A season? Okay. Eight seasons of House? A bit nutty. Most series are offered in formats that are more conducive to that endeavor. My point is that using a DVR outside if its intended use and then complaining about an issue that interferes with your use of that device for something other than its intended use...is also ridiculous.
DTV = Digital Television

#55 OFFLINE   boukengreen

boukengreen

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 354 posts
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:36 PM

i would love to be able to put my high school's first state championship on a flash drive from my dvr which i have kept on there since it aired on december 1 2011
There are some things arrows can't kill, for everything else there's Master Sword.

#56 OFFLINE   Sixto

Sixto

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,201 posts
Joined: Nov 17, 2005

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:38 PM

i would love to be able to put my high school's first state championship on a flash drive from my dvr which i have kept on there since it aired on december 1 2011

Same here. I have a couple of recordings with personal value and would love to save those recordings from DVR to DVR.
DirecTV: Genie HR44, H25, CCK, GenioGo, SWiM-16 & SWiM-8, DECA to Gigabit Switch with FiOS (75/75)
FiOS: Roamio Pro's (2), Roamio Plus, Mini's (4) with Ultimate HD (My Roamio Thoughts)

#57 OFFLINE   Sixto

Sixto

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,201 posts
Joined: Nov 17, 2005

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:41 PM

... My point is that using a DVR outside of its intended use ...

Well, I'll let others fight the good fight, but the comment above does sound weird to me, especially when the storage space is 1TB.

People use their iPhone as a cash register with the Square device. I'm not going to tell them that it's a phone. :)
DirecTV: Genie HR44, H25, CCK, GenioGo, SWiM-16 & SWiM-8, DECA to Gigabit Switch with FiOS (75/75)
FiOS: Roamio Pro's (2), Roamio Plus, Mini's (4) with Ultimate HD (My Roamio Thoughts)

#58 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

Hoosier205

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,612 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2007

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:43 PM

If someone truly has personal recordings that are near and dear enough...they will get a more permanent copy though other means knowing that the copy on their DRV goes with the device. Unless it isn't worth the effort of course.
DTV = Digital Television

#59 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

Hoosier205

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,612 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2007

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:47 PM

Well, I'll let others fight the good fight, but the comment above does sound weird to me, especially when the storage space is 1TB.

1TB isn't very big these days. Choosing to ignore the intended use of a DVR due solely to HDD size sounds "weird" to me.

People use their iPhone as a cash register with the Square device. I'm not going to tell them that it's a phone. :)


I would hope not since the Square device is what is being used for its intended purpose.
DTV = Digital Television

#60 OFFLINE   Sixto

Sixto

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,201 posts
Joined: Nov 17, 2005

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:52 PM

If someone truly has personal recordings that are near and dear enough...they will get a more permanent copy though other means knowing that the copy on their DRV goes with the device. Unless it isn't worth the effort of course.

But it's not as convenient.

If there will be an easy path to upgrade technology every two years via the protection plan, then it absolutely makes sense to allow recordings to be transfered from old DVR to new DVR. Now it may get decided that it's a high-end feature and will not be developed, but it's certainly a good idea, and would certainly be used/loved by some, especially TV enthusiasts, who may also be the same people that want to upgrade every two years.

For me personally, I always want the latest device, whether it be my DVR or my phone (& tablet). Life is too short, and it's all relatively inexpensive with it only being a few hundred bucks every couple of years, thus allowing transfer would be great. I certainly wouldn't downplay it's usefulness, it would be used, similar to the backup/restore that I do with the iPhone once a year when upgrading.
DirecTV: Genie HR44, H25, CCK, GenioGo, SWiM-16 & SWiM-8, DECA to Gigabit Switch with FiOS (75/75)
FiOS: Roamio Pro's (2), Roamio Plus, Mini's (4) with Ultimate HD (My Roamio Thoughts)

#61 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

Hoosier205

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,612 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2007

Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:56 PM

But it's not as convenient.


Less convenient than using a device outside of its intended purpose and losing that content? It isn't an archiving device.
DTV = Digital Television

#62 OFFLINE   Sixto

Sixto

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,201 posts
Joined: Nov 17, 2005

Posted 10 January 2013 - 12:04 AM

I just like stuff online and easily accessible. I've moved away from all physical media long ago, can't remember the last time that I touched a CD/DVD, and don't have a Blu-Ray player.

So to close this out, your point is that DirecTV should not enable a feature to allow movement of content from one DVR to another DVR because content should not be kept for long periods of time?

Edited by Sixto, 10 January 2013 - 12:15 AM.

DirecTV: Genie HR44, H25, CCK, GenioGo, SWiM-16 & SWiM-8, DECA to Gigabit Switch with FiOS (75/75)
FiOS: Roamio Pro's (2), Roamio Plus, Mini's (4) with Ultimate HD (My Roamio Thoughts)

#63 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

Hoosier205

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,612 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2007

Posted 10 January 2013 - 12:10 AM

I just like stuff online and easily accessible. I've moved away from all physical media long ago, can't remember the last time I touched a CD/DVD.

So to close this out, your point is that DirecTV should not enable a feature to allow movement of content from one DVR to another DVR because content should not be kept for long periods of time?


I never said they shouldn't enable such a feature. I said that long-term archivers (digital hoarders) or those with personal attachments to particular content should know better.

What do you use for high quality content without one? Streaming? Lossy audio and low bitrate, overly compressed video? Yikes...

Edited by Hoosier205, 10 January 2013 - 12:16 AM.

DTV = Digital Television

#64 OFFLINE   Sixto

Sixto

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,201 posts
Joined: Nov 17, 2005

Posted 10 January 2013 - 12:17 AM

I never said they shouldn't enable such a feature. I said that long-term archivers (digital hoarders) or those with personal attachments to particular content should know better.

It's Blu-ray, not Blue-ray. What do you use for high quality content without one? Streaming? Lossy audio and low bitrate, overly compressed video? Yikes...

Yep, fixed the typo.

DirecTV 1080p VOD, but usually wait for movies to hit the premiums and DVR them. Have DirecTV Premier, also have Apple TV. Been very happy.
DirecTV: Genie HR44, H25, CCK, GenioGo, SWiM-16 & SWiM-8, DECA to Gigabit Switch with FiOS (75/75)
FiOS: Roamio Pro's (2), Roamio Plus, Mini's (4) with Ultimate HD (My Roamio Thoughts)

#65 OFFLINE   brett_the_bomb

brett_the_bomb

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 182 posts
Joined: Oct 24, 2009

Posted 10 January 2013 - 12:19 AM

Out side of this arguement it would still be nice to start a new receiver where the old one left off. Series links included.

The protection plan upgrade path as I under stand has no model distinction but rather as dtv always has, consider upgrades to be additional or upgraded features SD to a dvr or hd to dvr etc. But as always I think to dtv an hd/dvr is any hr2x. So I would not be surprised when calling for said upgrade to be told your getting an hd/dvr and nothing more specific than that.... but that's just what I expect given my experience.

My setup: HR 44, HR34, 2x HR 24, 2x HR 23-700, 4x C31's, Nomad...


#66 OFFLINE   Sixto

Sixto

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,201 posts
Joined: Nov 17, 2005

Posted 10 January 2013 - 12:24 AM

Out side of this arguement it would still be nice to start a new receiver where the old one left off. Series links included.

The protection plan upgrade path as I under stand has no model distinction but rather as dtv always has, consider upgrades to be additional or upgraded features SD to a dvr or hd to dvr etc. But as always I think to dtv an hd/dvr is any hr2x. So I would not be surprised when calling for said upgrade to be told your getting an hd/dvr and nothing more specific than that.... but that's just what I expect given my experience.

Yep, backup/restore settings to/from the cloud near the top of the wishlist.

And it will be interesting to see how the upgrades work, I'd never allow an upgrade to something older, I'd rather do something from Solid Signal if I had to. I do have the protection plan.
DirecTV: Genie HR44, H25, CCK, GenioGo, SWiM-16 & SWiM-8, DECA to Gigabit Switch with FiOS (75/75)
FiOS: Roamio Pro's (2), Roamio Plus, Mini's (4) with Ultimate HD (My Roamio Thoughts)

#67 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

Hoosier205

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,612 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2007

Posted 10 January 2013 - 12:26 AM

Yep, fixed the typo.

DirecTV 1080p VOD mostly, or wait for movies to hit the premiums and DVR them. Also have Apple TV. Been very happy.


That's a shame. I hope you didn't invest too much in your other equipment then.
DTV = Digital Television

#68 OFFLINE   Sixto

Sixto

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,201 posts
Joined: Nov 17, 2005

Posted 10 January 2013 - 12:28 AM

That's a shame. I hope you didn't invest too much in your other equipment then.

Well, I'll end the night where Tom did, many posts ago, we all have our opinions. :)

Take care ...
DirecTV: Genie HR44, H25, CCK, GenioGo, SWiM-16 & SWiM-8, DECA to Gigabit Switch with FiOS (75/75)
FiOS: Roamio Pro's (2), Roamio Plus, Mini's (4) with Ultimate HD (My Roamio Thoughts)

#69 OFFLINE   Hoosier205

Hoosier205

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 6,612 posts
Joined: Sep 03, 2007

Posted 10 January 2013 - 12:31 AM

Well, I'll end the night where Tom did, many posts ago, we all have our opinions. :)

Take care ...


It's not a matter of opinion, but you're welcome to assume that it is.
DTV = Digital Television

#70 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

RunnerFL

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 16,152 posts
Joined: Jan 04, 2006

Posted 10 January 2013 - 06:47 AM

Choosing to ignore the intended use of a DVR due solely to HDD size sounds "weird" to me.


And who are you to declare what its intended use is? Did you invent it?

If it wasn't designed for long term storage then why is "Keep until I delete" an option? Seems pretty long term to me.
THIS SPACE FOR RENT

#71 OFFLINE   dpeters11

dpeters11

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 13,931 posts
  • LocationCincinnati
Joined: May 30, 2007

Posted 10 January 2013 - 08:13 AM

Using a DRV to archive an entire multi-year series...is ridiculous. A season? Okay. Eight seasons of House? A bit nutty. Most series are offered in formats that are more conducive to that endeavor. My point is that using a DVR outside if its intended use and then complaining about an issue that interferes with your use of that device for something other than its intended use...is also ridiculous.


I know someone on Dish, and when I was watching one of the last seasons of Lost, I found that they had the entire series to that point saved, and hadn't watched it yet. I told him they really needed to start watching, and he quickly interrupted me and said "no spoliers". At that point I had to say "The plane crashes."

But when DirecTV allows you to set up a 20TB RAID array, and their box is still a single point of failure, a change is needed.

#72 OFFLINE   brett_the_bomb

brett_the_bomb

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 182 posts
Joined: Oct 24, 2009

Posted 10 January 2013 - 08:27 AM

I know someone on Dish, and when I was watching one of the last seasons of Lost, I found that they had the entire series to that point saved, and hadn't watched it yet. I told him they really needed to start watching, and he quickly interrupted me and said "no spoliers". At that point I had to say "The plane crashes."

But when DirecTV allows you to set up a 20TB RAID array, and their box is still a single point of failure, a change is needed.


Does any one know if any company does allow recordings to be transferred or backed up or is directv alone in this?

My setup: HR 44, HR34, 2x HR 24, 2x HR 23-700, 4x C31's, Nomad...


#73 OFFLINE   dpeters11

dpeters11

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 13,931 posts
  • LocationCincinnati
Joined: May 30, 2007

Posted 10 January 2013 - 08:34 AM

Dish allows offloading of shows to external, can be played on any box on the account.

Actually, I think at one point they had some regular receivers that you could add an external drive, pay a one time fee, and voila, it was a DVR.

#74 OFFLINE   hancox

hancox

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 457 posts
Joined: Jun 23, 2004

Posted 10 January 2013 - 08:41 AM

1TB isn't very big these days. Choosing to ignore the intended use of a DVR due solely to HDD size sounds "weird" to me.



I would hope not since the Square device is what is being used for its intended purpose.


Choosing to ignore that D* is proposing a scheduled receiver swap, which could possibly have nothing to do with archiving (i.e. what happens to current content recorded the night before?), sounds like "you're trolling again" to me.

#75 OFFLINE   dpeters11

dpeters11

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 13,931 posts
  • LocationCincinnati
Joined: May 30, 2007

Posted 10 January 2013 - 11:04 AM

I don't think we can call it a scheduled receiver swap. It would be an option for the user to exercise, and I'm not familiar enough with how it works in Texas to know if it's going to make much difference.

Someone with say an HR22, what will exercising their plan benefit get them? A guaranteed 24, cheap upgrade to a 34 or any refurb that is luck of the draw (like an HR21)? Would a 34 user be guaranteed a 44? etc.

It might be more like free upgrade from a receiver to DVR etc.




Protected By... spam firewall...And...