Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo
- - - - -

For the love of God!!! HR24 audio dropouts


  • Please log in to reply
68 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   double

double

    AllStar

  • Registered
  • 89 posts
Joined: Sep 12, 2006

Posted 14 January 2013 - 09:40 PM

WTF!!!! I cant take it anymore. I just searched the forum and I am seeing posts back to 2010 about the issue. I lived with it since i got my HR-24 in late 2010 because i always thought it was my POS Onkyo TX-SR606 surround receiver. I upgraded to a Yamaha RX-A820 and what do you know......still a problem. There is no rhyme or reason. live, recorded, no particular frequency. 2 freaking years with the smae problem? WOW! I have been a Direct customer for 13 years, i think i deserve a little better than this. is this still an issue for the HR-24 for most? Is it an issue for the HR34? I want to upgrade to an HR-34, but not interested if it also suffers from the issue.
AU9 Dish/ SWM-16 Multiswitch
HR-24/500 HDMI to Yamaha RX-A820 to Samsung UN55ES7500
HR-22/100 HDMI to LN52A650 LCD & Component Video to Toshiba 20HLV86 LCD w/DVD
HR-21/700 HDMI to Samsung LNS4095DX
HR-22/100 HDMI to Viewsonic 40" LCD
HR-20/700 HDMI to Veiwsonic 40" LCD

Every location has 1 RG6Q and DECA. System has broadband DECA.

Broadband provided by Verizon DSL

...Ads Help To Support This Site...

#2 OFFLINE   JerryMeeker

JerryMeeker

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 188 posts
Joined: Sep 20, 2007

Posted 14 January 2013 - 09:54 PM

I have two HR24's and one HR21. I have the occasional audio dropout on all three. By occasional, I mean several during a night's viewing. My signal strength is strong, so I have assumed it's just the DTV signal.

#3 OFFLINE   jimmie57

jimmie57

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 5,129 posts
  • LocationTexas City, TX
Joined: Jun 26, 2010

Posted 14 January 2013 - 10:45 PM

I have two HR24's and one HR21. I have the occasional audio dropout on all three. By occasional, I mean several during a night's viewing. My signal strength is strong, so I have assumed it's just the DTV signal.


I find this a lot on my HR23 on CBS, FOX, ESPN AND GOLF Channels.

DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM, HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#4 OFFLINE   hdtvfan0001

hdtvfan0001

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 32,440 posts
Joined: Jul 28, 2004

Posted 15 January 2013 - 06:44 AM

I find this a lot on my HR23 on CBS, FOX, ESPN AND GOLF Channels.

Indeed.

Assuming every audio drop is an HD DVR, DirecTV transmission, or connection issue is a mistake.

While audio is quite clean 99% + of the time...there are still occasional hiccups in the audio transmitted by networks and indivisual channels.

The best audio equipment in the world cannot compensate for an audio "hiccup" coming from the source or lost along the transmission path.
DBSTalk CHAT ROOM MODERATOR
DirecTV Customer Since 1996

#5 OFFLINE   CCarncross

CCarncross

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 7,058 posts
  • LocationJackson
Joined: Jul 19, 2005

Posted 15 January 2013 - 06:57 AM

All HD stuff exhibits this, on every provider I have ever witnessed.

#6 OFFLINE   dpeters11

dpeters11

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 14,603 posts
  • LocationCincinnati
Joined: May 30, 2007

Posted 15 January 2013 - 08:38 AM

It does seem worse with Dolby on, and some AV receivers handle it better than others. It would make my Onkyo click. Still happens on occasion with my Denon, but without clicking. I haven't watched it in a few seasons but I swore it was worst with a particular program on History.

#7 OFFLINE   WestDC

WestDC

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 2,022 posts
Joined: Feb 09, 2008

Posted 15 January 2013 - 09:07 AM

HR-24/500-It seams that model (500) may have more issues than any other HR receiver in the fleet.

If you search on the 500 series you will find a bunch of different strange happenings.
"Let's Have Some Fun!"
SL-5, SWM-16, (2) HR22-100, (1) H21-200, (1) H20-100, (1) HR44-200, (1) CCK

#8 OFFLINE   double

double

    AllStar

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 89 posts
Joined: Sep 12, 2006

Posted 15 January 2013 - 10:29 AM

mine happens all of the time. when it happens, it is for a duration of 1-12 seconds. the frequency just completely varies. sometimes an hour can go by with nothing, sometimes it can happen 3-4 times in a half hour show. all that is required to "fix" it is to pause then play.
AU9 Dish/ SWM-16 Multiswitch
HR-24/500 HDMI to Yamaha RX-A820 to Samsung UN55ES7500
HR-22/100 HDMI to LN52A650 LCD & Component Video to Toshiba 20HLV86 LCD w/DVD
HR-21/700 HDMI to Samsung LNS4095DX
HR-22/100 HDMI to Viewsonic 40" LCD
HR-20/700 HDMI to Veiwsonic 40" LCD

Every location has 1 RG6Q and DECA. System has broadband DECA.

Broadband provided by Verizon DSL

#9 OFFLINE   BAHitman

BAHitman

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 432 posts
  • LocationAustin Texas
Joined: Oct 23, 2007

Posted 15 January 2013 - 10:37 AM

I notice it on occasion, but it is usually in the recording as when I back it up, it is there so I don't blame the DVR, I blame the source. sometimes I can even see a video hickup in my locals...

I have seen it at friends house with TWC also so I don't think it's necessarily a DirecTV problem...

HR34, HR20x3, HR22, HR23, H24, H21

-BAHitman


#10 ONLINE   MysteryMan

MysteryMan

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 7,482 posts
  • LocationUSA
Joined: May 17, 2010

Posted 15 January 2013 - 10:40 AM

WTF!!!! I cant take it anymore. I just searched the forum and I am seeing posts back to 2010 about the issue. I lived with it since i got my HR-24 in late 2010 because i always thought it was my POS Onkyo TX-SR606 surround receiver. I upgraded to a Yamaha RX-A820 and what do you know......still a problem. There is no rhyme or reason. live, recorded, no particular frequency. 2 freaking years with the smae problem? WOW! I have been a Direct customer for 13 years, i think i deserve a little better than this. is this still an issue for the HR-24 for most? Is it an issue for the HR34? I want to upgrade to an HR-34, but not interested if it also suffers from the issue.


Better to look for cause rather than to blame. ;)
DIRECTV customer since 1995.

#11 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 23,328 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 15 January 2013 - 12:09 PM

It does seem worse with Dolby on, and some AV receivers handle it better than others. It would make my Onkyo click. Still happens on occasion with my Denon, but without clicking. I haven't watched it in a few seasons but I swore it was worst with a particular program on History.


I've got 2 Sony AVs and a Sammy AV and none of them click or have audio dropouts that I would blame on D* or the units themselves. I do hear some crap on Fox from time to time, heard it on the playoffs this weekend. That I'd blame on Fox. I still find it hard to believe that Fox still broadcasts in 720p. With that in mind, I'm not surprised to hear strange noises from their broadcasts.

Rich

#12 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 23,328 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 15 January 2013 - 12:10 PM

I notice it on occasion, but it is usually in the recording as when I back it up, it is there so I don't blame the DVR, I blame the source. sometimes I can even see a video hickup in my locals...

I have seen it at friends house with TWC also so I don't think it's necessarily a DirecTV problem...


It's usually a broadcast problem.

Rich

#13 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 23,328 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 15 January 2013 - 12:11 PM

Better to look for cause rather than to blame. ;)


You ever hear anything like that on your Sonys?

Rich

#14 OFFLINE   Laxguy

Laxguy

    Honi Soit Qui Mal Y Pense.

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 15,110 posts
  • LocationWinters, CA, between Napa and Sacramento
Joined: Dec 02, 2010

Posted 15 January 2013 - 12:53 PM

I lived with it since i got my HR-24 in late 2010 because i always thought it was my POS Onkyo TX-SR606 surround receiver. I upgraded to a Yamaha RX-A820 and what do you know......still a problem


Your sig. line indicates you're going HDMI direct to the TVs. Is that correct?
"Laxguy" means a guy who loves lacrosse.

#15 OFFLINE   double

double

    AllStar

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 89 posts
Joined: Sep 12, 2006

Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:01 PM

Better to look for cause rather than to blame. ;)


huh? i pay them $200 a month! I shouldn't have to do anything whatsoever, but turn it on and enjoy. This problem has been present for almost two years or more!!!!!!! It is time for blame now! I have no problem with slight audio dropouts during channel changing or during FF RWD sessions, but this is ridiculous! I am about to throw a major bitchfest. None of my other boxes do this, they might have some of the standard anomolies, but not like this.
AU9 Dish/ SWM-16 Multiswitch
HR-24/500 HDMI to Yamaha RX-A820 to Samsung UN55ES7500
HR-22/100 HDMI to LN52A650 LCD & Component Video to Toshiba 20HLV86 LCD w/DVD
HR-21/700 HDMI to Samsung LNS4095DX
HR-22/100 HDMI to Viewsonic 40" LCD
HR-20/700 HDMI to Veiwsonic 40" LCD

Every location has 1 RG6Q and DECA. System has broadband DECA.

Broadband provided by Verizon DSL

#16 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

veryoldschool

    Lifetime Achiever

  • Moderators
  • 42,201 posts
Joined: Dec 09, 2006

Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:07 PM

huh? i pay them $200 a month! I shouldn't have to do anything whatsoever, but turn it on and enjoy. This problem has been present for almost two years or more!!!!!!! It is time for blame now! I have no problem with slight audio dropouts during channel changing or during FF RWD sessions, but this is ridiculous! I am about to throw a major bitchfest. None of my other boxes do this, they might have some of the standard anomolies, but not like this.

I'm not sure what is going on with your 24, but my HR24-500 doesn't have these.
A.K.A VOS

#17 OFFLINE   hdtvfan0001

hdtvfan0001

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 32,440 posts
Joined: Jul 28, 2004

Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:10 PM

huh? i pay them $200 a month! I shouldn't have to do anything whatsoever, but turn it on and enjoy. This problem has been present for almost two years or more!!!!!!! It is time for blame now! I have no problem with slight audio dropouts during channel changing or during FF RWD sessions, but this is ridiculous! I am about to throw a major bitchfest. None of my other boxes do this, they might have some of the standard anomolies, but not like this.

It appears you are referencing a specific issue with a specific HR24 HD DVR. As you have seen, others with HR24 units have not shared your experience.

In your case...and assuming there are no other issues that you've checked with connectors and/or cables on your HR24 and/or your Yamaha AVR...then you've likely checked the primary things you can check on your end.

It's not impossible that there may be an issue with either the HR24 itself or else the audio driver in the firmware to your specific model Yamaha AVR.

My recommendation is that you e-mail DirecTV support, share all the details of what you've checked and the specific model information of all your equipment...and let them recommend how they might solve your issue.

There could be a number of things leading to your experience, so it becomes somewhat of a process-of-elimination path to follow.
DBSTalk CHAT ROOM MODERATOR
DirecTV Customer Since 1996

#18 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 23,328 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:18 PM

huh? i pay them $200 a month! I shouldn't have to do anything whatsoever, but turn it on and enjoy. This problem has been present for almost two years or more!!!!!!! It is time for blame now! I have no problem with slight audio dropouts during channel changing or during FF RWD sessions, but this is ridiculous! I am about to throw a major bitchfest. None of my other boxes do this, they might have some of the standard anomolies, but not like this.


This probably won't help you much, but I think the 24-500s are one of the very best DVRs and one of the wackiest. I have six of them and they certainly are interesting at times. You might have one that has gone from wacky to shot. Might be time to consider swapping it out. I had to replace a couple of them, they just went nutz. Happens. Happens with all of them. They'll usually give you a 24 for a 24.

Rich

#19 ONLINE   MysteryMan

MysteryMan

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 7,482 posts
  • LocationUSA
Joined: May 17, 2010

Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:32 PM

huh? i pay them $200 a month! I shouldn't have to do anything whatsoever, but turn it on and enjoy. This problem has been present for almost two years or more!!!!!!! It is time for blame now! I have no problem with slight audio dropouts during channel changing or during FF RWD sessions, but this is ridiculous! I am about to throw a major bitchfest. None of my other boxes do this, they might have some of the standard anomolies, but not like this.


Not doubting your issues. However, I as well as others who have HR24-500s are not experiencing what you are. Again, ldentify the cause before you blame.
DIRECTV customer since 1995.

#20 ONLINE   MysteryMan

MysteryMan

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 7,482 posts
  • LocationUSA
Joined: May 17, 2010

Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:33 PM

You ever hear anything like that on your Sonys?

Rich


No.
DIRECTV customer since 1995.

#21 OFFLINE   double

double

    AllStar

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 89 posts
Joined: Sep 12, 2006

Posted 15 January 2013 - 02:00 PM

guys, let me preface this with what i do and the level of knowledge i have. I am in the custom electronic installation business. I have owned my business for 15 years now. We work almost exclusively in very high end homes with our average system cost of $50k and our current largest project of $350k is completing as we speak. I am not a dealer for directv, but have put up 100 dishes and hundreds of receivers over my 15 year career. For the last 8 years, out of 100s of clients, I have had two that did not get Direct. I am intimately familiar with the workings of direct.

This problem is definitely exclusive to the HR24 boxes in my opinion. This is completely different from every other anomaly that other HR boxes experience in relation to audio. I have searched and found hundreds of other posts in relation to this problem with the HR24. I lived with it for so long because I havent had the time or the want to get to the bottom of it. I am always swapping, exchanging, loaning equipment so we always have a mish mash of equipment in our rack at home. I had a client give us an Onkyo TXSR606 with bad hdmi board. we used it for optical audio and it did the drop out constantly. i always chocked it up to the absolute POS onkyo. i sent the 606 for repair to onkyo and got it back with functioning hdmi. still did it. again i chocked it to the onkyo. my solution was to always turn DD off. as busy as my family has been, we never really thought of it much.

as the holidays approached and i got stuck with a UN55ES7500 left over from job, i decided to redo my entire system. Yamaha RX-A820, BD-S673, B&W speakers sub, etc. finally (after yearsof 80-90% complete) got the Crestron control system up and running with dimmers, thermostat, etc. ready for a month long family fest with family in and out for over a month.

what do you know..... it still did it! tried the blu-ray, works perfectly. tried one of the older HR boxes, perfect. it is the HR-24. i wouldnt mind leaving the older HR box in the rack for the main system, but the 24 is so much better! it is snappier for sure. I have been a premium subscribing customer for 13 years, i deserve to have this rectified.

in all fairness to directv, i havnt called them once to discuss. like i said it was never really a big problem until i actually thought about it, then life takes over again and i would forget until the next time i thought about it. now all of this time has gone by and i just want it fixed. above all, i am really shocked to see that the issue was well documented as far as 2010 and is still a problem!! crazy.

also, i am not sure if it would exhibit this directly connected to tv vs through A/V receiver. might try that tonight!
AU9 Dish/ SWM-16 Multiswitch
HR-24/500 HDMI to Yamaha RX-A820 to Samsung UN55ES7500
HR-22/100 HDMI to LN52A650 LCD & Component Video to Toshiba 20HLV86 LCD w/DVD
HR-21/700 HDMI to Samsung LNS4095DX
HR-22/100 HDMI to Viewsonic 40" LCD
HR-20/700 HDMI to Veiwsonic 40" LCD

Every location has 1 RG6Q and DECA. System has broadband DECA.

Broadband provided by Verizon DSL

#22 OFFLINE   TomCat

TomCat

    Broadcast Engineer

  • Registered
  • 3,926 posts
Joined: Aug 31, 2002

Posted 15 January 2013 - 02:08 PM

It does seem worse with Dolby on, and some AV receivers handle it better than others. It would make my Onkyo click. Still happens on occasion with my Denon, but without clicking. I haven't watched it in a few seasons but I swore it was worst with a particular program on History.


I think that is the key; interopability with consumer equipment. When DD was designed it was not really envisioned for transport via sat or terrestrial, but was for closed systems like laserdisk, etc. They never really put any error correction in it. DVB, QAM, and ASTC add forward error correction, but that is sort of tacked-on rather than designed for DD from the ground up, so is not all that robust.

In a world where they try to compress as much as possible and cram as much info into a stream as is possible, the ability for errors to creep in is near the hairy edge. Also, any digital transmission is never totally error-free, even with error correction. A "perfect" stream still averages one glitch a day. A good stream averages one every hour or two, an acceptable one averages one every minute or two, and a poor one averages more than one glitch per minute, if you look at this from a QoS standpoint.

That implies that peaking your alignment may reduce the issue. And that QoS standard applies to the video; DD may manifest more errors for a particular "acceptable" level of video delivery quality.

There is also the factor that while PCM/analog audio is exceptionally reliable in a HTS, DD is often not. This has partly to do with the fact that dropped audio frames can cause clicking and muting for digital, while that just won't happen with PCM/analog. This means that you have to have a visible video glitch to have a concurrent audio dropout if you are using PCM/analog, while if using DD into a AVR, you can have minor glitches that don't even manifest in video but still might mute or click the DD.

It is also similar to the handshake for HDMI; both ends of a DD connection have to be clocked perfectly all the time, or there will be mutes or clicks. But that system once again is not all that robust; once HDMI locks, it pretty much stays locked, but DD can drift in and out of lock more often than it really should. It's not a great system for a HTS application, but then it is what it is.

And here is what points away from the sat transmission and reception, and towards the DD link to your AVR as being where the problem most likely is, is that the only audio sent to your DVR is DD; the PCM/analog outputs are derived from a 2.0 downmix from that 5.1 source. If the analog audio is OK, the DD audio must be nearly as OK up to that point. The DD link outbound from there to the AVR is typically where we see the problems.

About all you can do is have the newest firmware in your AVR (Denon and Onkyo used to be the worst offenders in DD issues, but newer firmware fixes a lot of that). Or use PCM/analog, which drops out much more rarely for DVB delivery.
It's usually safe to talk honestly and openly with people because they typically are not really listening anyway.

#23 OFFLINE   double

double

    AllStar

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 89 posts
Joined: Sep 12, 2006

Posted 15 January 2013 - 02:09 PM

No.


it definitely happens to the sonys. in fact. im pretty sure it was VOS who sent his sony AVR to direct to test in 2010. it is actually pretty well documented on the webs.
AU9 Dish/ SWM-16 Multiswitch
HR-24/500 HDMI to Yamaha RX-A820 to Samsung UN55ES7500
HR-22/100 HDMI to LN52A650 LCD & Component Video to Toshiba 20HLV86 LCD w/DVD
HR-21/700 HDMI to Samsung LNS4095DX
HR-22/100 HDMI to Viewsonic 40" LCD
HR-20/700 HDMI to Veiwsonic 40" LCD

Every location has 1 RG6Q and DECA. System has broadband DECA.

Broadband provided by Verizon DSL

#24 OFFLINE   hdtvfan0001

hdtvfan0001

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 32,440 posts
Joined: Jul 28, 2004

Posted 15 January 2013 - 02:13 PM

This problem is definitely exclusive to the HR24 boxes in my opinion. This is completely different from every other anomaly that other HR boxes experience in relation to audio. ......
..... ! tried the blu-ray, works perfectly. tried one of the older HR boxes, perfect. it is the HR-24.

...in all fairness to directv, i haven't called them once to discuss. like i said it was never really a big problem until i actually thought about it, then life takes over again and i would forget until the next time i thought about it. now all of this time has gone by and i just want it fixed. above all, i am really shocked to see that the issue was well documented as far as 2010 and is still a problem!! crazy.

It's a bit of a struggle to empathize with your plight when DirecTV themselves has not yet been contacted to resolve the problem. It's also safe to assume that jumping up and down in frustration doesn't fix much.

Based on your added information, it would seem that the time would be best spent having a conversation with the technical area of DirecTV - your solution may be as simple as them providing a replacement HD DVR.
DBSTalk CHAT ROOM MODERATOR
DirecTV Customer Since 1996

#25 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

veryoldschool

    Lifetime Achiever

  • Moderators
  • 42,201 posts
Joined: Dec 09, 2006

Posted 15 January 2013 - 02:16 PM

it definitely happens to the sonys. in fact. im pretty sure it was VOS who sent his sony AVR to direct to test in 2010. it is actually pretty well documented on the webs.

Yes, I did and the problem, which wasn't anywhere near as bad as you've posted, was addressed in a software update "way back then".

Dolby has had problems with the encoders used in the uplink, but for the most part, this has finally been addressed too.

To have the level of dropouts you seem to be having, "just isn't normal", and I say this with the amp that was used to find the problem back then.
A.K.A VOS




Protected By... spam firewall...And...