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Guest Message by DevFuse


SD Quality...it is true!

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66 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   Sea bass

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 12:59 PM

I found an old VHS tape yesterday with original Batam movie taped from fxm (late 90's). The pq is poor already on VHS, but is better than most SD channels I receive today! That is kind of sad...SD really has suffered over the years. Cool program, it has a pop up video style, giving facts on the movie.

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#2 OFFLINE   Satelliteracer


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 01:26 PM

In my opinion so much of this depends on what you view it on. Viewing SD on today's HD televisions really exposes the issues of SD. I've seen SD on an SD only television and it looks like it is "supposed" to in my opinion. Just my two cents.
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#3 OFFLINE   veryoldschool


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 02:04 PM

In my opinion so much of this depends on what you view it on. Viewing SD on today's HD televisions really exposes the issues of SD. I've seen SD on an SD only television and it looks like it is "supposed" to in my opinion. Just my two cents.

I think you've hit the nail on the head.
The scaling factor for SD to fill the screen of an HD display is very high and you're really looking at the scaler more than the original video.
With a good scaler, SD doesn't look "that bad".

#4 OFFLINE   oldcrooner



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Posted 17 February 2013 - 03:49 PM

It also looks so much better when it isn't so over-compressed as it is when Directv gets hold of it and stuffs it on the 101 satellite.
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#5 OFFLINE   Davenlr


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 03:57 PM

A DVD will easily show how good or bad a set/scaler can reproduce SD on any particular display. Anything worse is the result of the distribution system/provider compressing the crap out of it, downrezzing it, and mutilating it.

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#6 OFFLINE   tonyd79


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 03:58 PM

In my opinion so much of this depends on what you view it on. Viewing SD on today's HD televisions really exposes the issues of SD. I've seen SD on an SD only television and it looks like it is "supposed" to in my opinion. Just my two cents.

That's part of it but I get SD sub channels that look pretty good. Not to mention DVDs (not blu ray). And some SD looks pretty good on fios. Directv SD is not good.
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#7 OFFLINE   billsharpe


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 04:29 PM

My SD channels look noticeably better with FiOS TV than they did with DirecTV.

HD picture quality seems about the same for both services on my 40-inch Sony.

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#8 OFFLINE   spartanstew


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 04:36 PM

I occasionally watch SD material from D* and DVD's on my 126" screen and both are very watchable.

Way better than anything I have on VHS (yes, still have a VHS player in the theater, but only used twice in the last 3 years).

I'm sure Directv can't wait to get their hands on your unit.

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#9 OFFLINE   HoTat2


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 05:03 PM

Well ... with SD resolutions on the order of 480 x 480 pixels or less and a max. transponder loading of as many as 14 SD channels (from the TPN maps) crammed into only a 24 MHz wide TPN. on Ku band. Then then scaling up such low resolution over-compressed signals to fill today's large HD screens, what sort of decent PQ can one realistically expect from that?


Also, make sure you folks specify if its actually a Super-VHS recording you're comparing it to or not.

#10 OFFLINE   Dude111


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 06:22 PM

I love VHS movies!!!! (Movies that have not been compromised digitally (Digitally Mastered,Digitally Recorded,Dolby Digital,etc) as it takes the quality away from them and they dont sound/look as good))

#11 OFFLINE   Sea bass

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 08:07 PM

In my opinion so much of this depends on what you view it on. Viewing SD on today's HD televisions really exposes the issues of SD. I've seen SD on an SD only television and it looks like it is "supposed" to in my opinion. Just my two cents.

Ok, well I viewed the recorded fxm VHS on my 55" Toshiba...turned off, went to ch. 258 on the same tv, technically the same channel...I would expect the live channel to be a bit better then a 12 year old recording...

#12 OFFLINE   acostapimps


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 10:13 PM

Unless we get fxm hd, sd quality would not look good in any hd set unless it has a good scaler which would look halfway decent at best, but some sd channels have more compression than others, that explains why some look decent than others.

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#13 OFFLINE   dishrich


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 11:14 PM

I've seen SD on an SD only television and it looks like it is "supposed" to in my opinion.

I'm sorry, but even on a good quality SDTV (think Sony XBR) D* SD has looked like total CRAP for some time! It most definitely can't hold a candle to what I used to get off of my C-band dish - or even back in the OTA analog TV days.

Most of E* SD prog looks a little better than D* SD - but not by much

Pretty sad, but our Comcast SD prog looks quite a bit better than EITHER DBS provider does - in spite of it all being (compressed) digital now. (but NOT out of a DTA box that ONLY has RF out, of course :eek: )

#14 OFFLINE   carl6


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Posted 17 February 2013 - 11:16 PM

I have one SD receiver active, and it is hooked to a smaller SD CRT type color TV. It looks great. If I take that same receiver and feed it into my smallest HD TV, it looks poor. I agree completely with Satelliteracer, it really depends on what you are watching the SD channel on.

#15 OFFLINE   MysteryMan


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Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:02 AM

When it comes to SD picture quality it's a mixed bag. Compression, type of HDTV, TV calibration, channel, and source material used by the broadcaster all come into play. Example: I have a Sony XBR-65HX929 and a Sony KDL-55HX729. Both were professionally calibrated. On some channels like TCM SD the picture quality is good. Change the channel to Chiller and you'll start thinking it's time to make a appointment with the optometrist. Go to a channel like Encore Westerns or the Military Channel and its a gamble. Because of source material they use sometimes the picture quality is good, other times it's not.

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#16 OFFLINE   Mike_TV



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Posted 18 February 2013 - 06:57 AM

Is VHS the new vinyl?

#17 OFFLINE   raott


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Posted 18 February 2013 - 07:13 AM

I still have two SD TVs in the house, one of which gets watched every single day. Directv SD is awful.

It isn't about scaling or HD televisions doing a poor job, it is the source, which is low rez and highly compressed. Not sure why that is tough to acknowledge.
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#18 OFFLINE   n3vino



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Posted 18 February 2013 - 07:40 AM

I have a 10 year old Sony CRT HD monitor which displays 480P and 1080I. Actual native formats. I set the box to send both signals. SD looks pretty good on my set. I wonder if on the new sets, it has to do with upscaling on the sets that only have an HD native format, be that 720P or 1080P.

It could have something to do with how the box is setup to handle SD. Some have the box to send only the HD mode, and some have it set to send both 480I and their HD format. That might be something to look at on which does the better upscaling.

On my set, it's better to let the box send the set's native formats. I also let the box upscale 720P to 1080I because my set does not display 720P. On my set 720P is downscaled to 480P.

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#19 OFFLINE   BosFan



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Posted 18 February 2013 - 09:42 AM

SD? What is this SD you speak of? :D

When I do watch SD it looks pretty much the same as it ever did on my 26" LCD, moving to the 42" it gets to not looking so good and I pretty much refuse to tune into a SD channel on the 55". Compared to OTA and to me it pretty much a horse a piece. So, I am going with the scaling concept.

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#20 OFFLINE   fleckrj



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Posted 18 February 2013 - 09:59 AM

Uncompressed SD can look very good, even on an HD TV. I still have a large library of DVDs that look as good or better than most of the movies shown on the so-called HD movie channels. DVDs are 480p. VHS is 250i, so VHS will never be as good as DVD.

Before DirecTV had HD, the quality of the SD channels was nearly as good as DVD and far better than VHS. Now the SD quality is not nearly as good as it used to be, but there are some SD channels on DirecTV that are much better than others. All of the SD channels looked better on my old Toshiba 55" rear projector SD TV than they do on my Panasonic 55" Plasma HD TV.

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