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Guest Message by DevFuse

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Do I own my HR34?


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108 replies to this topic

#41 OFFLINE   P Smith

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 11:39 PM

we should educate our customers ... but if you try to arguing here, prepare: no one stone left unturned !

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#42 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 11:41 PM

the point is, you (paid subsidized price) will own it after one year if you'll get another one or after expiration of the contract. What you must do with IRD after your contract expired ? And you paid the $100 or $200 for it?

The cell phone comments are not entirely accurate. Cell phones are not leased. The customer owns the phone immediately and may do whatever they want with the phone immediately (destroy, sell, whatever).

Regardless of what the customer does with the phone they are responsible for the separate service contract that they sign. They will need to fulfill that service contract or pay ETF to end that service contract. Making the commitment to the service contract leads to a discount on the phone. But the phone is NOT leased.

Comparing satellite to cell phone also fails when it comes to pricing. Once the customer agrees to the cell phone price plan it is their price until the customer chooses to change the plan. Annual increases even after the initial one or two year commitment do not come in to play. Even customers who bring their own device and run month to month without commitment do not fall under routine price increases. With few exceptions (the cell phone company ceasing service being the primary one) once you agree to the price plan you do not need to worry about a cell phone company changing the price. Satellite service does not follow that pricing scheme.

I wish one could buy satellite service and never see a price increase unless one changed their own plan. But that is not the way it works. I wish one could buy satellite receivers at deep discounts in exchange for one or two year commitments and own them on day one but that is not the way it works (at least not any more).

DBS service and cellphones - apples and oranges.

#43 OFFLINE   acostapimps

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 11:41 PM

Oh, yeah, new excuse for someone who are arguing in favor of the company ...
If he put his words here, then he should be prepare ... anyway, there are many manufacturers who doing R&D SW&HW development and manufacturing IRDs for DTV. Perhaps DTV DOESN'T do that at all.
and you peacefully escape questions from post#36, hehe


What? I'm talking about subs not the company, and who's arguing when all I'm saying are facts.

Directv Genie DVR HR44-700
Directv HD DVR HR24-500
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Directv Wireless Mini Client C41W-100 (Deactivated)
Directv Standard SD Receiver D12-700 

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#44 OFFLINE   P Smith

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 11:55 PM

Sat comps made the turn not that long ago. Before we could pay full price for the IRDs (Target, Fry's, Wall-mart, etc) or after one year contract (no payment for the equipment !!!) own the box, LNBF, switch, etc after one year contract. That works with leasing model simultaneously, but that time wasn't the ridiculous upfront fee. The fee is pure "burglary" !

#45 OFFLINE   P Smith

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 11:57 PM

What? I'm talking about subs not the company, and who's arguing when all I'm saying are facts.


Oh ! I didn't realize you are posting under two nicks and post#13 is your. :D

#46 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 12:26 AM

Sat comps made the turn not that long ago. Before we could pay full price for the IRDs (Target, Fry's, Wall-mart, etc) or after one year contract (no payment for the equipment !!!) own the box, LNBF, switch, etc after one year contract. That works with leasing model simultaneously, but that time wasn't the ridiculous upfront fee. The fee is pure "burglary" !

It is a one time "lifetime" lease deal ... and not a bad deal in the long run. If one buys their receiver it is only worth what they can sell it for later. Lease for $100 and pay the same monthly fees as an owned receiver or own for $500-$600 and hope that one can get $400-$500 out of the receiver on resale?

Yes, it can get old paying $100 for lease upgrades every couple of years to get the latest greatest model. But the introduction of those new models leads to the devaluing of the old models. How does one sell their $500 owned receiver for $400 and break even when newer models are on the market?

The primary value I can see in owning the receiver is knowing what receiver you are paying for. Unless one can specify the exact model when leasing buying can be a benefit. People who like to open covers an tweak their receivers are also less restricted on an owned receiver. But these choices come at a price.

If the resell market is strong enough that owning and reselling for each upgrade saves money then it makes sense to do so. But if one is going to lose more than the one time lease fee every time they do an upgrade they are paying for the "other benefits" of owning.

#47 OFFLINE   wingrider01

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 05:50 AM

Wisdom ? Nay ... there are only two companies on the market .. and each second year they're trying to merge.


err no, look again you missed quite a few

#48 ONLINE   carl6

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 07:22 AM

The primary value I can see in owning the receiver is knowing what receiver you are paying for.


Being able to deactivate and retain the receiver, then reactivate it at a future time, is also an advantage if you have a seldom used viewing location such as a guest room that is only occupied a few weeks out of the year. With an owned receiver you do not have a recurring acquisition cost. Under the leased model you would have to pay the upfront fee every time you wanted to activate that location. Under this scenario, it is actually less costly to keep the receiver active year round than to pay the acquisition cost for the receiver annually.

#49 OFFLINE   Old_School

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 09:13 AM

Being able to deactivate and retain the receiver, then reactivate it at a future time, is also an advantage if you have a seldom used viewing location such as a guest room that is only occupied a few weeks out of the year. With an owned receiver you do not have a recurring acquisition cost. Under the leased model you would have to pay the upfront fee every time you wanted to activate that location. Under this scenario, it is actually less costly to keep the receiver active year round than to pay the acquisition cost for the receiver annually.


That there is why i have an extra H25 on my account. I have a extra tubed Tv in the garage so i can watch the news, weather or listen to music while i am tinkering around in there... It's only really warm enough 8 months out of there year for me to heavily use it. It's much cheaper to pay the upfront cost of $99 and keep it active year round than to add/remove when needed.

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#50 OFFLINE   sigma1914

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 09:30 AM

No one owns the HR34 unless you paid the steep price for it $600 or $700 I think, just like a buying an unlocked cellphone or one with no contract.


Not true.
If you stop responding to them or put them on ignore, then eventually they'll go away.

#51 OFFLINE   P Smith

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 09:59 AM

err no, look again you missed quite a few


Really ? Then name it !

#52 OFFLINE   slice1900

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 10:03 AM

I kind of see what your saying but don't like how you said it. It shouldn't cost them any more since its sent through the air and you only need 1 dish with a clear view of the southern sky.

Now maybe it has to do with all the licensing fees for decryption (NDS), Dolby, HDMI, and other software. The software field is where it's at. Software licensing and maintenance contracts are HUGE moneymakers.



A lot of technology licenses are only charged per unit up to a certain threshold and eventually max out. I know MPEG licenses are like that, pretty sure HDMI (I believe it is actually HDCP that is licensed) is also, but different licenses will have different terms and thresholds. Some thresholds may be set more for those making higher volume products like computers, televisions, or phones/tablets, so Directv may not max out some fees that others do.

Even if the licensing cost for an additional receiver was zero, they still have a very good reason to charge more for more receivers. Every receiver someone has in their home is one more they have to manufacture and support. That cost is not zero to Directv so they don't want you to have any more than you really need. If it didn't cost more for more receivers the average customer would have more of them on their account. I'm sure some people reading this thread would have more if adding another was free of charge.

I have a commercial public viewing account and don't pay any per receiver fees, but I own all 22 receivers. I don't know if its even possible to lease receivers on this type of account. If they gave them to me for "free" but charged $6/receiver/month it would have cost me much more by now. They probably don't care so much about trying to nickel and dime me per receiver when I pay five figures every year in programming fees that are based on crowd capacity.

#53 OFFLINE   P Smith

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 10:05 AM

It is a one time "lifetime" lease deal ... and not a bad deal in the long run. If one buys their receiver it is only worth what they can sell it for later. Lease for $100 and pay the same monthly fees as an owned receiver or own for $500-$600 and hope that one can get $400-$500 out of the receiver on resale?

Yes, it can get old paying $100 for lease upgrades every couple of years to get the latest greatest model. But the introduction of those new models leads to the devaluing of the old models. How does one sell their $500 owned receiver for $400 and break even when newer models are on the market?

The primary value I can see in owning the receiver is knowing what receiver you are paying for. Unless one can specify the exact model when leasing buying can be a benefit. People who like to open covers an tweak their receivers are also less restricted on an owned receiver. But these choices come at a price.

If the resell market is strong enough that owning and reselling for each upgrade saves money then it makes sense to do so. But if one is going to lose more than the one time lease fee every time they do an upgrade they are paying for the "other benefits" of owning.


The dissonance is you pay upfront for a lease and getting no return of it or no owning the IRD after your contract is ended.
Next person leasing SAME box will pay the $100 or $200 again and again for it.

Between two "stalls" you have no choice, like a horse ... in each one you forced to give up your money for nothing.

#54 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 10:11 AM

Being able to deactivate and retain the receiver, then reactivate it at a future time, is also an advantage if you have a seldom used viewing location such as a guest room that is only occupied a few weeks out of the year. With an owned receiver you do not have a recurring acquisition cost. Under the leased model you would have to pay the upfront fee every time you wanted to activate that location. Under this scenario, it is actually less costly to keep the receiver active year round than to pay the acquisition cost for the receiver annually.

The comparison I was looking at was the $100 lease vs the $500-$600 purchase. Given those prices if one did want to deactivate it for a portion of the year one could reactivate five times and break even. There could still be some resale value in a five year old receiver. But enough to make it worth owning? Unless it was only active a couple months per year leaving it active would be the cheapest path.

I do not fault people for wanting to own their equipment ... I just don't see saving money as being a reason.

#55 OFFLINE   P Smith

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 10:12 AM

Such license fee as for HDCP incorporated into a chip's price (like main in IRD: BCM74xx); so the manufacturer will pay $30 per CPU (bulk OEM price) and it will include MPEG,HDCP,SATA,etc.
Actually, the point is not well taken when brought it here. COmpare to $100 or $200 per each lease beginning for same IRD. What is happen multiple times per its life.

#56 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 10:19 AM

The dissonance is you pay upfront for a lease and getting no return of it or no owning the IRD after your contract is ended.
Next person leasing SAME box will pay the $100 or $200 again and again for it.

As long as I am not losing more than the depreciation I'm ahead.

When buying a receiver for $500 instead of leasing it for $100 one would have to sell it for $400 to break even. Likely? Possible? The resale market is limited to people who believe it is better to pay more to own than to lease - and the seller is competing against the lease price.

#57 OFFLINE   wingrider01

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 10:26 AM

Really ? Then name it !


clue - FTA satellite

#58 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 10:33 AM

The dissonance is you pay upfront for a lease and getting no return of it or no owning the IRD after your contract is ended.
Next person leasing SAME box will pay the $100 or $200 again and again for it.

Between two "stalls" you have no choice, like a horse ... in each one you forced to give up your money for nothing.

I don't think anyone likes paying an "up front" fee for something they don't own, but you're also not looking at the whole picture either.

"New" receiver is either free or has an up front cost.
Receiver gets returned and goes through the refurbishing process [added cost] and returned to inventory.
From inventory it enters the cycle again where it may be a replacement for a defective receiver [free], or it may be another "free install", or it does have another "up front" charge.

Yes it's a numbers game, but it isn't just a "$100 or $200 again and again".
A.K.A VOS

#59 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 10:37 AM

As long as I am not losing more than the depreciation I'm ahead.

When buying a receiver for $500 instead of leasing it for $100 one would have to sell it for $400 to break even. Likely? Possible? The resale market is limited to people who believe it is better to pay more to own than to lease - and the seller is competing against the lease price.

10 years ago, A HD receiver [not a DVR] cost me $800. It was a POS and Sony finally swapped it for a newer model 18 months later. This new model retailed for $345.
Another 18 months later it was obsolete with the shift to MPEG-4.
This was the worst "investment" I'd made to that date.
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#60 OFFLINE   Rich

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 01:02 PM

That there is why i have an extra H25 on my account. I have a extra tubed Tv in the garage so i can watch the news, weather or listen to music while i am tinkering around in there... It's only really warm enough 8 months out of there year for me to heavily use it. It's much cheaper to pay the upfront cost of $99 and keep it active year round than to add/remove when needed.


Not true, you're losing money by keeping the receiver active. PM me for more info, if you're interested.

Rich




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