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Upgrade 16 unit condo building to SWM


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11 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   hbwallace

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 12:07 PM

This four story condo building has 4 units on each floor. Only 3 units were using DirecTV until we began the upgrade. There are 2 dishes on the roof that we can't get to without much expense (renting a lift). One dish has a very poor signal and had been disconnected over a year ago. The other dish is providing an adequate signal but not what we would like.

 

The old switches were a combination of cascaded 6x8 & 6x16 to provide four cables/signals to each condo. Our plan was to keep 2 of the current users on a 6x16 and add a SWM32 to provide new service to one current user and 3 new users. Unfortunately, we were not able to get an adequate signal from the dish to split between the two systems so everyone is going on the SWM32.

 

We will need to add another SWM32 for additional users. What recommendations can you give me regarding connecting the next SWM32. Will using the cascade ports be the best solution or should we use a MST 774/771 to split the dish signal? Do we need an amp?

 

Another issue has been older receivers (H21s) in an existing installation that doesn't see the satellite. We tried forcing a software update but there wasn't a good enough signal to get the update. These same receivers were working fine on the legacy switches. Any ideas?

 

Thanks.



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#2 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 10:53 PM

The SWiM-32 is the only one that can have another SWiM cascaded off the legacy ports. The loss to the legacy ports is about a dB.

The H21 "should work" fine on a SWiM and their software came SWiM compatible from the factory "that many" years ago.

These may be defective if they won't now shift to SWiM mode,


A.K.A VOS

#3 OFFLINE   hbwallace

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 06:53 PM

Thanks for the info. We got the H21s working yesterday. Little problem with the cabling :nono2: . So the cascade ports are essentially legacy ports. Interesting. I understand that you can only cascade them once. That will at least cover our current orders.

 

Thanks again.



#4 OFFLINE   hbwallace

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 10:00 AM

Project proceeding now with one SWM32 installed feeding 4 condos - one condo with Genie. Now ready to add the second SWM32. Planning to use the cascade ports to feed it. Do we need both power supplies on the second SWM32? Isn't one of the power supplies on the first SWM powering the LNB?

 

If we don't get a good signal on the secondSWM32, should we add an amp or a polarity locker?



#5 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 01:09 PM

Project proceeding now with one SWM32 installed feeding 4 condos - one condo with Genie. Now ready to add the second SWM32. Planning to use the cascade ports to feed it. Do we need both power supplies on the second SWM32? Isn't one of the power supplies on the first SWM powering the LNB?

 

If we don't get a good signal on the secondSWM32, should we add an amp or a polarity locker?

From this example of two cascaded SWiM-32s in an MDU installation (connected to the right side outputs of an MST-774 on p.2 of the document), no, you do not need the 20 vdc LNBF power supply on the second cascaded SWiM-32.

 

But I guess you should terminate the cascade outputs on the second SWiM-32 as the illustration shows.

Attached Files


DIRECTV sub. since Sep. of '95


#6 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 01:21 PM

 

... If we don't get a good signal on the secondSWM32, should we add an amp or a polarity locker?

Well given the low signal loss on the cascaded outputs of the first SWiM-32, if you have adequate signal strength on the first -32 you should have it on the second.

 

However if you do not, its not a polarity locker, but a "satellite line trunk amplifier" like the SA-6 AL in the document my be used before the first -32.

 

Like other powered multiswitches the first SWiM-32 uses it supplied power (the 20 vdc supply in this instance) to provide polarity locking signals at its dish inputs for the upstream LNBF.      


DIRECTV sub. since Sep. of '95


#7 OFFLINE   hbwallace

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:26 AM

OK. Sounds right. My remaining question regarding power supplies, doesn't the VDC 20V on the PI-6S power the LNBF? So, in this install depicted, it looks like they are using a 20V on each of the SWMs first in line. Is that to power the 774? Am I seeing that right?


Edited by hbwallace, 09 May 2013 - 10:29 AM.


#8 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 11:26 AM

OK. Sounds right. My remaining question regarding power supplies, doesn't the VDC 20V on the PI-6S power the LNBF? So, in this install depicted, it looks like they are using a 20V on each of the SWMs first in line. Is that to power the 774? Am I seeing that right?

Not sure why or if the MST-774 tap off unit actually needs LNBF power from the first SWiM-32. But the point here in your case is if the first SWiM-32 is connected to the dish LNBF it certainly requires the 20 vdc supply while a second cascaded one should not.  


DIRECTV sub. since Sep. of '95


#9 OFFLINE   AntAltMike

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Posted 11 May 2013 - 11:13 AM

Who is going to pay for a replacement SWM32 if something goes wrong with it?  What if a problem is reported by some units but not others? 

 

Several years back, when I had to seriously contemplate bringing SWM capability into a 170 unit highrise where there would not be a readily obtainable consensus among subscribers if problems might be experienced by some but not others, I told the building that I recommended that they have me put in a backbone that could support splitter fed, add-on SWM8s such that each subscriber would have to pay for his own SWM breakout and be the sole resident connected to his own SWM8.

 

I got the HOA to agree to pay me $7,600 for the backbone (two, actually, as there were two "towers" involved), but between the time that the HOA accepted the contract proposal and the time the parts came in, FOUR of the residents there did things that pissed me off enough that I decided I was unwiling to assume the responsibility of being "exclusive installer for life" for this building and so I withdrew my offer.  Making a few thousand extra dollars on this one overpriced job was not enough to inextricably wed me to these people.



#10 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 11 May 2013 - 12:05 PM

Who is going to pay for a replacement SWM32 if something goes wrong with it?  What if a problem is reported by some units but not others? 

 

Several years back, when I had to seriously contemplate bringing SWM capability into a 170 unit highrise where there would not be a readily obtainable consensus among subscribers if problems might be experienced by some but not others, I told the building that I recommended that they have me put in a backbone that could support splitter fed, add-on SWM8s such that each subscriber would have to pay for his own SWM breakout and be the sole resident connected to his own SWM8.

 

I got the HOA to agree to pay me $7,600 for the backbone (two, actually, as there were two "towers" involved), but between the time that the HOA accepted the contract proposal and the time the parts came in, FOUR of the residents there did things that pissed me off enough that I decided I was unwiling to assume the responsibility of being "exclusive installer for life" for this building and so I withdrew my offer.  Making a few thousand extra dollars on this one overpriced job was not enough to inextricably wed me to these people.

Two 170 unit high rises potentially served by SWiM-8 backbones (that is two MFH-2 systems)?

 

I'm surprised the IP based MFH-3 is not more practical for DIRECTV service in such a case. 


DIRECTV sub. since Sep. of '95


#11 OFFLINE   hbwallace

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Posted 19 October 2013 - 01:51 PM

Who is going to pay for a replacement SWM32 if something goes wrong with it?  What if a problem is reported by some units but not others? 

 

The switches and dish equipment belong to the HOA and the board contracts for the installation and maintenance. We have 2 x swm32s installed now using one dish on each. Will add another switch next year and hope to be able to use the signal from the pass-through ports on an existing switch.



#12 OFFLINE   JosephB

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Posted 19 October 2013 - 06:38 PM

Two 170 unit high rises potentially served by SWiM-8 backbones (that is two MFH-2 systems)?

 

I'm surprised the IP based MFH-3 is not more practical for DIRECTV service in such a case. 

 

You're already going to have a wiring closet on each floor, so you really don't need fiber. Using SWM makes it simpler for DirecTV (drop development of IP-enabled boxes), enables customers to get all of the services that non-MDU customers can get (Genie, whole home), and not necessarily something DirecTV would say is a "positive" but it would leave the units in such a state that you could easily offer multiple providers (cable and DirecTV) since you could physically move a unit from the SWM switch to a CATV tap in the closet.






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