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Best way to add Genie to multi HR system


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28 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   dddeeds

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 01:53 PM

I am eligible for an upgrade to a Genie and would have after the upgrade 6 HR-2Xs and the new Genie for 17 Tuners (I plan to use an off air AM21 with the Genie also).  I currently have a Slimline Dish SL5 into a SWM16 hooked up and I have an old WB68 in the closet that I can use in the new setup.  I use Ethernet connections on my whole home system now and it's been working well for me and I'd like to keep it Ethernet if possible. 

 

I saw during research here that you can split the dish feed with 2 way splitters into the WB68 and SWM 16 to get up to 24 tuners right? 

 

What splitters are recommended?

 

I was wondering what would occur if I tried to use the SWM 16 alone with 17 tuners?

 

Are there any issues to using Ethernet for whole home still?

Thanks for the help!



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#2 OFFLINE   dpeters11

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 02:00 PM

To use just a SWM 16 with 17 tuners, you'd need to set one DVR to a single tuner only.

 

Here are some good references for more than 16

http://forums.solids...ers-in-the-home



#3 OFFLINE   dddeeds

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 02:19 PM

Thanks dpeters11

 

To set the HR2x to 1 tuner I just re-run the satellite setup and choose "single tuner" right?.

 

Is there a way to set the Genie HR34/44 to 4 tuners?
 



#4 OFFLINE   slice1900

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 02:38 PM

Since you can only have a maximum of 8 tuners per SWM port on the SWM-16, the SWM port that has the Genie can only take one HR-2x, unless you add a second with a disabled tuner as suggested.

 

If you didn't want to disable any tuners, and were already willing to connect one to a WB68 anyway, you could connect the Genie and one HR2x to one SWM port, 4 HR2x to the other SWM port, and have two coaxes to the remaining HR2x from the legacy ports on the SWM-16. You'd need to reconfigure that HR2x to non-SWM, and it could no longer participate in your whole home network.


SL5, PI-6S, SA-6AL 3xSWM16, 21 H20-100, 1 H20-600, 7 H24-700/AM21


#5 ONLINE   lugnutathome

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 02:58 PM

Actually since the OP is using his home LAN for the Whole Home traffic, your suggested setup would function just fine for him, Whole Home as well. I ran (still run part of my receivers (5 on LAN, 7 on DECA)) on my home LAN long before I brought in SWM.

 

I like your suggestion actually! Using the legacy ports makes it all pretty simple. (assuming they aren't considered in the tuner count on the SWM side)

 

Several SWM's can be leveraged but that adds splitters, likely amplifier, and a host of wires, additional PIs, etc. Using the already present legacy ports to hook up one or two of his existing units as they already are wired for, simplifies the lot nicely. THe only add on your way with his LAN is a BS filter on the HMC so i'ts DECA output isn't flooding back through the splitters and SWM.

 

Of course this side steps DECA and direct TV support for Whole Home issues and the OP should consider that against the DIY approach.

 

Don "wouldn't have even considered those legacy ports. great call" Bolton

 

 

Since you can only have a maximum of 8 tuners per SWM port on the SWM-16, the SWM port that has the Genie can only take one HR-2x, unless you add a second with a disabled tuner as suggested.

 

If you didn't want to disable any tuners, and were already willing to connect one to a WB68 anyway, you could connect the Genie and one HR2x to one SWM port, 4 HR2x to the other SWM port, and have two coaxes to the remaining HR2x from the legacy ports on the SWM-16. You'd need to reconfigure that HR2x to non-SWM, and it could no longer participate in your whole home network.


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#6 OFFLINE   slice1900

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 07:30 PM

You forgot about the legacy ports, I forgot HR2x have ethernet, so I guess we're even :)

 

Would the BSF really be necessary? What does it hurt if there is DECA traffic coming back off the Genie when he's using its ethernet port? The DECA traffic would be useless, but harmless.

 

A BSF wouldn't even be necessary if he plans to diplex OTA onto the same coax connecting his Genie to feed the AM21 (since the SAT ports on the SWM side and Genie side won't pass DECA frequencies)


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#7 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 08:25 PM

You forgot about the legacy ports, I forgot HR2x have ethernet, so I guess we're even :)

 

Would the BSF really be necessary? What does it hurt if there is DECA traffic coming back off the Genie when he's using its ethernet port? The DECA traffic would be useless, but harmless.

 

A BSF wouldn't even be necessary if he plans to diplex OTA onto the same coax connecting his Genie to feed the AM21 (since the SAT ports on the SWM side and Genie side won't pass DECA frequencies)

"DECA" signals are stronger than the satellite signals, and as such, it can cause all sort of problems and in the long run it can even damage the receiver. BSFs were not "invented" for fun


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#8 OFFLINE   dddeeds

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 08:51 PM

If I use the legacy ports, do I lose any channels/HD? What is the BSF you refer to? Are those the b-band filters that I used on each of the two coax feeds into each HR when I used the old WB68?

#9 OFFLINE   longrider

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 09:02 PM

If I use the legacy ports, do I lose any channels/HD? What is the BSF you refer to? Are those the b-band filters that I used on each of the two coax feeds into each HR when I used the old WB68?

No, you will not lose any channels using the legacy ports.  No, the BSF is not the BBC you used on the WB68 and you will need the BBCs on the two HR20 coax connected to the legacy ports. My thought on the networking is as the Genie can function as an ethernet/DECA bridge I would hook your ethernet to the Genie and then use the DECA for everything else except the HR20 on legacy which will still need an ethernet connection.  This way you are supported except for teh HR20.


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#10 OFFLINE   dennisj00

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 09:02 PM

B-Band are NOT BSFs.   Solid Signal or eBay will have BSFs.  Unfortunately, shipping will cost more than the item.



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#11 OFFLINE   dddeeds

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 09:30 PM

Thanks. Time to call in the upgrade. Too bad they say I have to have a tech install.

#12 OFFLINE   slice1900

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 09:47 PM

"DECA" signals are stronger than the satellite signals, and as such, it can cause all sort of problems and in the long run it can even damage the receiver. BSFs were not "invented" for fun

 

 

I thought the DECA signals only damaged older receivers that predate it and didn't account for it, namely the H20 and any SD receivers when using SWM? Don't all the HR2x models support DECA? And wouldn't his HR2x DVRs that are doing whole home already be sending out DECA signals that he's not been blocking?


SL5, PI-6S, SA-6AL 3xSWM16, 21 H20-100, 1 H20-600, 7 H24-700/AM21


#13 OFFLINE   slice1900

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 09:48 PM

Thanks. Time to call in the upgrade. Too bad they say I have to have a tech install.

 

 

If a tech comes out, they'll probably use splitters and add a SWM8, as I recall someone stating that Directv doesn't support hybrid installs that use the legacy ports on a SWM multiswitch.


SL5, PI-6S, SA-6AL 3xSWM16, 21 H20-100, 1 H20-600, 7 H24-700/AM21


#14 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 09:25 PM

I thought the DECA signals only damaged older receivers that predate it and didn't account for it, namely the H20 and any SD receivers when using SWM? Don't all the HR2x models support DECA? And wouldn't his HR2x DVRs that are doing whole home already be sending out DECA signals that he's not been blocking?

all the of the Home DECA adapters have a BSF filter built in.  Since the HR34 does DECA and ethernet at the sam time it is always "sending" DECA signals as opposed to the HR24 that disables the DECA when an ethernet cable is plug in


Here’s to the crazy ones.
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#15 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 07:52 PM

If you are having a tech come install, be prepared, they will want to do deca and get you off your home network, if the guy is following the rules. I say let them, and if you have issues, then mess with it latter. I don't think you will. I will be interested to see what they want to do in terms of hooking it up with that many hrs. I suspect they will say one unit can't be on the home network and use the legacy ports. I'd let them, and then simply plug in the last box to your home network and you will be down as the bbdeca will bridge the network and the unit oustide the deca cloud will work with the ones inside it.or just go to one tuner on one hr.

Oh,and no, you can't make the genie only use four tuners and make that stick permiantly in a settings menu anywhere.

#16 OFFLINE   dddeeds

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 09:56 PM

Why the heavy push from DirecTV to DECA? Is it better? I have had nary a problem with my Ethernet. Scheduled to have install this Sunday. Hopefully I will report a problem free install.

#17 OFFLINE   longrider

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 10:05 PM

Why the heavy push from DirecTV to DECA? Is it better? I have had nary a problem with my Ethernet. Scheduled to have install this Sunday. Hopefully I will report a problem free install.

Having used both I doubt it is any better but from a support standpoint it is light years ahead of ethernet.  There are so many variables in a personal ethernet network support would be almost impossible.  Using DECA you isolate the DirecTV system from the rest of your network


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#18 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 25 May 2013 - 01:07 PM

Why the heavy push from DirecTV to DECA? Is it better? I have had nary a problem with my Ethernet. Scheduled to have install this Sunday. Hopefully I will report a problem free install.

Having used both I doubt it is any better but from a support standpoint it is light years ahead of ethernet. There are so many variables in a personal ethernet network support would be almost impossible. Using DECA you isolate the DirecTV system from the rest of your network
Bingo.

#19 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 25 May 2013 - 04:21 PM

Why the heavy push from DirecTV to DECA? Is it better? I have had nary a problem with my Ethernet. Scheduled to have install this Sunday. Hopefully I will report a problem free install.

Because it is easy to install.  the same coax cable that is feeding your satellite signals are networking your receiver at the same time.  if you go the ethernet route, DirecTV will have two install two cables where applicable.


Here’s to the crazy ones.
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The round pegs in the square holes.

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They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


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#20 OFFLINE   dddeeds

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Posted 26 May 2013 - 03:47 PM

Had the install this afternoon. Two techs came out together (one was in training still I believe).

I had everything ready to go for them. I had already hooked up one HR-23 on two of the legacy ports as suggested above. I asked them to trade out the existing 8 way splitter from a previous install to a 2 way, since I only needed one coax to the new Genie and one coax to the other HR-2x on that leg of the swim 16 and didn't need the signal split that much for just two feeds. They kindly changed it out. On the other leg, there is an existing four way splitter to the other four HR-2x receivers. They let me hook up the box to my other gear and were impressed with my DirecTV knowledge (gained from DBSTalk of course).

They also hooked up a new power inserter to the existing swim 16, so now I have the full 29 volts instead of the 21 volts supply that was used from a previously installed Zinwell WB16 that had run pretty hot compared to this new one. (I had tried to get the original installer of the swim 16 to do that before, but he said it wasn't necessary, the installers today said it should have been switched out, although it never gave me much trouble it was always very toasty feeling).

They didn't mess with putting me on DECA, as I told them I was already set on Ethernet.

I was pleased that things went off without a hitch and the only downer was that I got the HR-34 as per the tech, supposedly the HR44 is not out of beta yet or available for this Huntington, WV/Ashland, KY/Ironton, OH area. Oh well, hard to look a gift horse in the mouth on that, as the Genie upgrade and install was free on the protection plan upgrade and my agreement was extended 24 months.

I was worried at first when the trainer, not the trainee, saw my AM-21 in the AV cabinet where I wanted the Genie placed and he asked what is that? After I had explained it to him, he said, I've never seen one if those before. But they were very nice fellows and I was very pleased with everything despite no HR44. Now I am looking forward to this fall so I can satiate my football addiction with all those tuners :-)

Thanks again for those that helped with their suggestions. I appreciate it.


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