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Pac-12 Networks confident, even without DirecTV


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#1601 OFFLINE   jw_rally

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 07:01 PM

So ... lets add a dedicated channel for each and every school. There doesn't have to be any major content on each school's channel. Just link the channel to better content that carriers cannot pass on carrying. :(

 

The big time football & basketball programs could fill up about 10 minutes of programming a day showing their star players attending class. Then they could show several hours of late night, adults only programming showing them attending clubs and assorted parties. :bink:



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#1602 OFFLINE   tonyd79

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 07:29 PM

The big time football & basketball programs could fill up about 10 minutes of programming a day showing their star players attending class. Then they could show several hours of late night, adults only programming showing them attending clubs and assorted parties. :bink:


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#1603 OFFLINE   BlackDynamite

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 11:00 PM

So in this thread:
http://www.dbstalk.c...on-Directv-DVR?

It's discussing ways to get a cable box output recorded into a Directv DVR. The reasoning is, like most of you, there's no way I'm giving up my NFL Sunday Ticket, so I can't switch providers. Not to mention the fact that I have 7 DVRs, so it would be pretty expensive to switch providers.

So I was thinking maybe I'd keep Directv, and also sign up for cable from the local provider, or Dish Network. I'd obviously want that to be as cheap as possible, so the cheapest package that will give me the Pac 12 Network, on only 1 receiver. If I could somehow get the cable box output to record into the Directv DVR, then I could use my whole home DVR service to watch it on whatever receiver I want.

I'm posting this here in case anyone from the Pac 12 lurks this thread, and it's a good idea for any fans that want to watch their college team and still watch their NFL team.

I went to the Pac 12 Network website and there is a "Directv Answers" section.
http://pac-12.com/ge...etworks-directv

Almost every answer is just telling us to switch providers. Well, it's not that easy if you have 7 DVRs like I do. It's also pretty difficult to do if you want the NFL Sunday Ticket, like I do. So, instead of putting all of your energy into trying to get everyone to switch, why don't you offer a solution for those who want to stay with Directv? Offer the channel streaming online, like Netflix. And also offer a cheap kit that includes everything we need to get that video stream into a Directv DVR. It could be something like a Roku box, with an ATSC modulator, and an AM21. If such a package were available, I'd happily pay a couple hundred bucks for it plus pay $10 or so per month for the service.

I'm sure there must be at least a million people (or more) who would also love to do this. With that kind of revenue, surely you can get some Chinese company to mass produce the electronics for cheap.

The website indicates there are no negotiations, and the network won't be on Directv anytime soon. So let's think outside the box and come up with a solution for all the sports fans and businesses who just can't leave Directv.

#1604 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 09:06 AM

So, instead of putting all of your energy into trying to get everyone to switch, why don't you offer a solution for those who want to stay with Directv?


It is better for Pac-12 to get a contract for delivery to all DirecTV customers (or as many as possible) than to work against themselves and satisfy the customers most likely to continue to put pressure on DirecTV to complete the deal.


Offer the channel streaming online, like Netflix.


Online content is part of their carriage arrangements with providers. Offering it without a cable/satellite subscription would undercut their partners.


And also offer a cheap kit that includes everything we need to get that video stream into a Directv DVR. It could be something like a Roku box, with an ATSC modulator, and an AM21. If such a package were available, I'd happily pay a couple hundred bucks for it plus pay $10 or so per month for the service.


A couple of hundred bucks? More like a few hundred bucks or over $1000 ... Where are you finding ATSC modulators (not demodulators or tuners, but a device that creates an ATSC signal) for a couple hundred bucks?

It would also create the same problem as the first proposal ... if Pac-12 makes you happy would you keep complaining to DirecTV and help get Pac-12 delivered to all of DirecTV's subscribers (whether they want the channels or not)?

Pac-12 is not looking to make $10 here and $10 there on their network. They are looking to make $20 million or more by being added to DirecTV. If Pac-12 was willing to accept $10 per month for a relatively few subscribers they would sell their channel a la carte via DirecTV. They do not want to offer their channel that way.


I'm sure there must be at least a million people (or more) who would also love to do this. With that kind of revenue, surely you can get some Chinese company to mass produce the electronics for cheap.


Those million people would be better off telling DirecTV to accept Pac-12's offer or telling Pac-12 to lower their price. I believe you have overestimated the market ... while you may find a million DirecTV customers who want Pac-12, finding a million who would pay hundreds of dollars for additional equipment and subscription fees is more difficult.
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#1605 OFFLINE   Laxguy

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 09:28 AM

I'm among that million. I'd like Pac-12 added, but only at a nominal cost, and no real effort on my part  (such as by adding equip or even going online). 


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#1606 OFFLINE   jagrim

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 09:33 AM

I'm sure there must be at least a million people (or more) who would also love to do this. With that kind of revenue, surely you can get some Chinese company to mass produce the electronics for cheap.

The website indicates there are no negotiations, and the network won't be on Directv anytime soon. So let's think outside the box and come up with a solution for all the sports fans and businesses who just can't leave Directv.

 

Get your million people together, have them call their schools and start withholding their donations until the network is available for those that want it.  Money, or lack of it, can bring things back into focus for those negotiating the deal.



#1607 OFFLINE   BlackDynamite

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 10:16 AM

It is better for Pac-12 to get a contract for delivery to all DirecTV customers (or as many as possible) than to work against themselves and satisfy the customers most likely to continue to put pressure on DirecTV to complete the deal.



Online content is part of their carriage arrangements with providers. Offering it without a cable/satellite subscription would undercut their partners.



A couple of hundred bucks? More like a few hundred bucks or over $1000 ... Where are you finding ATSC modulators (not demodulators or tuners, but a device that creates an ATSC signal) for a couple hundred bucks?

It would also create the same problem as the first proposal ... if Pac-12 makes you happy would you keep complaining to DirecTV and help get Pac-12 delivered to all of DirecTV's subscribers (whether they want the channels or not)?

Pac-12 is not looking to make $10 here and $10 there on their network. They are looking to make $20 million or more by being added to DirecTV. If Pac-12 was willing to accept $10 per month for a relatively few subscribers they would sell their channel a la carte via DirecTV. They do not want to offer their channel that way.



Those million people would be better off telling DirecTV to accept Pac-12's offer or telling Pac-12 to lower their price. I believe you have overestimated the market ... while you may find a million DirecTV customers who want Pac-12, finding a million who would pay hundreds of dollars for additional equipment and subscription fees is more difficult.

Of course the Pac 12 Network would be better off if Directv agreed to a deal. But on their own website they say that is not going to happen. So getting this out there, while not as good as a deal with Directv, is certainly better than nothing.

A quick online search is all it took to find this HD modulator:
http://www.hometech..../cp-5415hd.html

It's about $800, but it's also being sold by people who are in the business of making money by selling electronics that they bought from someone else. That money changes hands several times over between the manufacturer and the end user, with everyone taking a sizable cut.

The Pac 12 would be more interested in the monthly fee, so they wouldn't have to make any money on the hardware. Kind of like Microsoft when the first Xbox came out. The PS3 was significantly more expensive while made of fewer and cheaper electronics. Microsoft figured they'd make it up in fees collected from Xbox Live, and it was a smashing success.

The electronics themselves are not very expensive to manufacture. You simply go to the universities, tell them to have their students design a working model, and take that design to a Chinese manufacturing company. It could be done for a couple hundred bucks.

You could also tell Dish Network to make it and give Dish a few bucks per subscriber. They make the Slingbox so they have virtually everything in place already. I'm sure they'd be happy to take the money.

The point is, this late in the game, anyone willing to leave Directv over this has already left. There is no more pressure on Directv. It's more expensive to leave (for some, me for example with 7 DVRs) than the Pac 12 Network understands. And what they are apparently downplaying is the importance of NFL Sunday Ticket to most sports fans. The NFL is the most popular sport in the nation, and you can't get the NFL Sunday Ticket anywhere else. There are plenty of Pac 12 players in the NFL that Pac 12 fans would want to follow, in addition to their own favorite team and fantasy football players.

There's an old saying in sales, "50% of something is better than 100% of nothing." The Pac 12 has come to grips with the fact that their network won't be on Directv. Their own website says so. So here is their opportunity to get at least some revenue, and get their schools available to be seen in millions of additional homes.

Edited by BlackDynamite, 10 August 2014 - 10:21 AM.


#1608 OFFLINE   tonyd79

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 10:31 AM

You can't modulate anything into a directv box. It is not using any if the broadcast standards. It uses unique encrypted streams.
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#1609 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 11:08 AM

You can't modulate anything into a directv box. It is not using any if the broadcast standards. It uses unique encrypted streams.


He's thinking of using a DirecTV box with an ATSC tuner to tune the $800+ ATSC modulator ... his own private TV station.

As for the economies of scale ... it sounds more like wishful thinking than a solid business plan. The BEST business plan for Pac-12 is to push for delivery to 20 million customers ... and settle for nothing less than what they want. If DirecTV doesn't want to carry Pac-12 under Pac-12's terms there are plenty of carriers that will. And as the title of this thread states ... Pac-12 is confident even without DirecTV carriage.
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#1610 OFFLINE   BlackDynamite

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 11:29 AM

He's thinking of using a DirecTV box with an ATSC tuner to tune the $800+ ATSC modulator ... his own private TV station.

As for the economies of scale ... it sounds more like wishful thinking than a solid business plan. The BEST business plan for Pac-12 is to push for delivery to 20 million customers ... and settle for nothing less than what they want. If DirecTV doesn't want to carry Pac-12 under Pac-12's terms there are plenty of carriers that will. And as the title of this thread states ... Pac-12 is confident even without DirecTV carriage.


I'm sure the Pac 12 was confident without Directv 2 or 3 years ago. But I'm also confident that they don't want to be the only major conference not available to the millions of Directv customers.

I'm quite confident that this could all be made for a couple hundred bucks. They could make a free chromecast/roku/xbox/apple tv app and charge for the service that way too if they wanted.

After 3 or 4 years, the pressure is no longer on Directv. They've lost all the customers they're going to lose over this. The pressure is all on the Pac 12 to justify why they didn't cave sooner, or why they think they can get by without Directv.

The Pac 12 website is going all in on the strategy of encouraging their fans to switch. This strategy has already proven to be a failure. It's time for their next move in this chess game.

#1611 ONLINE   slice1900

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 12:16 PM

The Longhorns are the only Big 12 team who have a dedicated team channel.

 

Not true. Iowa State has the Cyclone Network. I get it on cable (Mediacom) I'll bet they all have one, you just haven't heard of them because who outside of Kansas is going to hear about the Kansas and KSU channels, etc.


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#1612 OFFLINE   tonyd79

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 12:17 PM

Not true. Iowa State has the Cyclone Network. I get it on cable (Mediacom) I'll bet they all have one, you just haven't heard of them because who outside of Kansas is going to hear about the Kansas and KSU channels, etc.


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#1613 OFFLINE   BusterAvis

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 03:13 PM

If you're wanting to record Pac 12 programming and play it on any TV (as you can't on your DirecTV DVR) then the easiest thing to do is the get the cheapest package with your local cable company that has Pac 12 Network.

Next, purchase the software Replay Video Capture from the company called Applian Technologies.  It's the most high quality video (screen) capture program that records right from your computer's desktop screen, as it records in HD quality and HD sound, if the product is produced in HD on your screen.  Login to Pac 12 networks video website (through your cable company's login) and you have to watch their games live (they don't store them "on demand" on their site such as ESPN3 does).  When you watch the Pac 12 game live on your computer screen, it should be streaming in HD quality (if your computer has the specs to stream it at that speed).  Open up Replay Video Capture and highlight the part of your desktop that you want to capture (i.e. the rectangular video box on your desktop playing the Pac 12 game).  Click record, and it's recording it in HD quality to your computer's hard drive.  Now you can burn it to a Blu ray disc, or to any DVD disc, depending on what quality you want.  Now you have it saved to both your computer's hard drive, and to a blu ray or DVD disc as backup, and you can watch them on any Blu ray or DVD player, etc. (on any TV).

 

http://applian.com/r...-video-capture/


Edited by BusterAvis, 10 August 2014 - 03:15 PM.

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#1614 OFFLINE   BlackDynamite

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 07:46 PM

If you're wanting to record Pac 12 programming and play it on any TV (as you can't on your DirecTV DVR) then the easiest thing to do is the get the cheapest package with your local cable company that has Pac 12 Network.
Next, purchase the software Replay Video Capture from the company called Applian Technologies. It's the most high quality video (screen) capture program that records right from your computer's desktop screen, as it records in HD quality and HD sound, if the product is produced in HD on your screen. Login to Pac 12 networks video website (through your cable company's login) and you have to watch their games live (they don't store them "on demand" on their site such as ESPN3 does). When you watch the Pac 12 game live on your computer screen, it should be streaming in HD quality (if your computer has the specs to stream it at that speed). Open up Replay Video Capture and highlight the part of your desktop that you want to capture (i.e. the rectangular video box on your desktop playing the Pac 12 game). Click record, and it's recording it in HD quality to your computer's hard drive. Now you can burn it to a Blu ray disc, or to any DVD disc, depending on what quality you want. Now you have it saved to both your computer's hard drive, and to a blu ray or DVD disc as backup, and you can watch them on any Blu ray or DVD player, etc. (on any TV).

http://applian.com/r...-video-capture/

This is good info, but it's not really what I'm trying to do.

I actually already have a Hauppauge High Definition Personal Video Recorder. But I'm trying to watch the games live on my tv, not archive them to watch later. The only reason I wanted to get them recorded onto the DVR was so I could use the whole home DVR feature to watch them in whatever room I happen to be in, while only paying for 1 cable box.

What would be awesome is if they had a chromecast app and someone gave me their login. I really don't want to go through the trouble of trying to get a live game from my computer screen to a TV screen. But if I could get it on a chromecast, I'd be happy.

#1615 OFFLINE   shyvoodoo

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 12:09 AM

Looks like poor Mr. Larry Scott is crying over spilled milk now.. Lololo

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#1616 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 12:16 AM

Well if he really wants the same dollars in and out of market, he's an idiot. If he'd go for in market in choice and out of market in sports pack with same fees, then he might be closer to realistic. But still, it should be far cheaper out of market. He needs to blink.

It makes me think the cable companies may have picked up the station in out of market areas only as an advantage to directv not having it, not because it makes monetary sense by itself.

#1617 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 12:40 AM

"According to a report Monday by the Salt Lake Tribune, subscriber fees are at the heart of the Pac-12 Network/DirecTV stalemate.

The Pac-12 Network insists on identical subscriber fees (usually a few dollars per month) for each cable/satellite customer, regardless of whether or not that household is in the conference's six-state "footprint" (California, Oregon, Washington, Arizona, Utah and Colorado)."

Yet the referenced report in the Salt Lake Tribune states:
"The Pac-12 Network insists on one set fee for all cable/satellite companies."

There is a difference. The claim on AL.COM is not the same as the claim in the Salt Lake Tribune. Hopefully they have another source for the claim and are not simply misreading "one fee for all" as the same fee in and out of market.

(IIRC: Other reporting has given separate in market and out of market fees.)
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#1618 ONLINE   slice1900

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 01:00 AM

Well Dish is probably paying them the same price for all subscribers, but Dish only includes it in a sports pack outside the Pac 12 region so far less than all of Dish's 12 million subscribers actually receive it.

 

The question is: is Pac 12 insisting on national carriage on Directv like BTN has, instead of in-region coverage only like Dish has, but sticking to their guns on the same price for all subscribers? Who knows if that's the case, but if it is I could see why Directv told them to pound sand.


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#1619 OFFLINE   tonyd79

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 07:10 AM

This is good info, but it's not really what I'm trying to do.

I actually already have a Hauppauge High Definition Personal Video Recorder. But I'm trying to watch the games live on my tv, not archive them to watch later. The only reason I wanted to get them recorded onto the DVR was so I could use the whole home DVR feature to watch them in whatever room I happen to be in, while only paying for 1 cable box.

What would be awesome is if they had a chromecast app and someone gave me their login. I really don't want to go through the trouble of trying to get a live game from my computer screen to a TV screen. But if I could get it on a chromecast, I'd be happy.


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#1620 OFFLINE   BlackDynamite

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 06:51 PM

Put a sling box on your cable box and use a sling player on the other end.

If there was a slingplayer on chromecast this would probably be a winner. Supposedly there is one in the works. Here's to hoping it gets here before college football season starts!

Wait, there's a slingplayer on Roku right? It's a little more cumbersome than chromecast, but I might have to grab a Roku streaming stick. Thanks for the idea man!

Edited by BlackDynamite, 11 August 2014 - 07:02 PM.


#1621 OFFLINE   coolman302003

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 02:48 AM

Wait, there's a slingplayer on Roku right?

 

There is but it requires an iOS or Android device with the SlingPlayer mobile app installed to utilize this. The most recent update to the mobile app provides full hand-off to the Roku so you can send the video to the Roku from the mobile app and close the app if you want (previously it required the mobile app running at all times while utilizing Roku). You can't control or change channels with the Roku remote you must use the SlingPlayer app on the mobile device for this. The SlingPlayer app for mobile devices is a one time $14.99 fee, but no additional fee for the SlingPlayer channel you add to the Roku.

 

http://support.sling.com/KB/KB-2000582

 

http://www.sling.com...playerApps.aspx


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#1622 OFFLINE   Contra

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 09:00 AM

So is the Pac-12 Net really asking DirecTV for a lot more money than the SEC Net got.....? 



#1623 OFFLINE   Laxguy

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 09:09 AM

Most likely, yes. At least more money per subscriber who'll actually watch the channel. 


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#1624 OFFLINE   jw_rally

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 09:20 AM

I am just repeating what I have heard or read.

 

SEC: $1.40 per subscriber in SEC states; $0.25 per subscriber outside of SEC states

Pac-12: $0.80 per subscriber in Pac-12 states, and $0.80 per subscriber outside of Pac-12 states

 

Along with the pricing model differences, SEC fans have been VERY vocal about switching providers if the SEC Network was not picked up. There was nowhere near the outcry from Pac-12 fans.

 

And, of course, the leverage the SEC Network has with the ABC/Disney affiliation plays a lot into this.

 

Larry Scott is now (and has been for awhile) using the tactic of insulting DirecTV. Of course it is always wise to use insults while you are pursuing a business deal.


Edited by jw_rally, 14 August 2014 - 09:21 AM.

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#1625 ONLINE   slice1900

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 10:20 AM

Directv has a different situation than other providers as far as the impact of not carrying Pac 12 Network. They have NFLST, and there are a lot of people in Pac 12 states that are more into pro sports than college, so given a choice between getting Pac 12 Network and losing NFLST, or forgoing Pac 12 Network and keeping NFLST, they choose the latter. The hold NFLST has on those subscribers limits how many subscribers Directv loses over not carrying Pac 12 Network, and makes that network less valuable to Directv than it might be other providers. Not to mention, at this point Directv has lost all the subscribers they're going to lose over not carrying Pac 12 Network since it has been a couple years now.

 

If Directv hadn't carried SEC Network, they'd lose a lot more subscribers because fans in the south are much more likely to be about college sports first, and pro second, so they'd be a lot more likely to drop Directv and give up NFLST. But similarly, if Directv went a year or two without carrying SEC Network, they'd have lost all the subscribers they were going to lose over it, and would feel it is less valuable to them at that point.


Edited by slice1900, 14 August 2014 - 10:20 AM.

SL5, PI-6S, SA-6AL, 3xSWM16; 21 H20-100, 1 H20-600, 7 H24-700/AM21





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