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Splitters and Rain Fade


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38 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   WaarrEagle

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 09:17 AM

Since my system was installed just over a year ago in Houston, I have experienced more rain fade than I have traditionally been accustomed to.  As a 10+ year customer, I realize that severe rain storms will block the signal, but I get pixelation and complete signal loss during what I would call normal to moderate rain showers.  I got to thinking about my install, and the installer used an existing non-SWM 8 way splitter in my attic to split the signal to all the outlets in my house. I am only using 2 jacks at the moment, so I am wondering if buying a SWM approved 2 way splitter would help with my rain fade issues.  The system works great otherwise - is upgrading the splitter worth pursuing?



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#2 OFFLINE   longrider

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 09:24 AM

While it would certainly help and considering the low cost I would do it I do suspect you have other issues.  Can you post your signal levels on  a clear day?


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#3 OFFLINE   gov

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 09:43 AM

Also, if you have 4 or fewer active lines from the 8 way splitter, it can be replaced with a green label 4 way SWM splitter.

 

I frankly am stunned a D* installer would leave a non D* splitter in an install.

 

:nono2:     :down:     :eek2:    



#4 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 09:44 AM

I think one of your bigger problems is having all of those outputs "open" this is of course assuming the PI as before the splitter


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#5 OFFLINE   WaarrEagle

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 10:26 AM

Appreciate all the replies.  I went ahead and ordered a 4 way SWM approved splitter.  I will install it and post back with signal levels if the problem does not get better.  My PI is wired to an output on my splitter and all outlets in my house are also connected to the splitter.  Obviously this will get corrected when I install the new 4 way and I will cap off the port that I don't use.



#6 OFFLINE   jdspencer

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 11:32 AM

You haven't reported you signal strengths.

This will help determine if you have an alignment problem.


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#7 OFFLINE   gov

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 11:36 AM

And whether the new splitter fixes it or not (might be an alignment or partial obstruction too) just on principle, all installs need to have 100% approved hardware.

 

I am picturing the existing splitter in the OPs attic as some ancient 900 MHz model from the 1980s.

 

{shudder}



#8 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 12:49 PM

I'm going to bet the rainfade comes from the dish not being aligned as well as it could be, over this being a splitter problem.

 

Using the right splitter is a good idea, but I suspect it won't change the rainfade issue.


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#9 OFFLINE   inhd40

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 03:17 PM

I'm having pretty much the same issues without any splitters and signal strengths between 90-100 on about everything.  A few of them are 70-80, don't know if those are spot beams or what.  Back in the day with SD it had to be a torrential downpour to lose signal, now anything over a very light shower knocks it out.



#10 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 03:57 PM

I'm having pretty much the same issues without any splitters and signal strengths between 90-100 on about everything.  A few of them are 70-80, don't know if those are spot beams or what.  Back in the day with SD it had to be a torrential downpour to lose signal, now anything over a very light shower knocks it out.

Well that could be a problem

 

Please post your signal readings

 

You'll find these readings under "Menu" -> "Setup" -> "System Setup" -> Satellite -> "View Signal Strength". Note the "+" and "-" symbols next to the "Satellite" and "Tuner" entries where you can toggle the readings between the various satellites and both DVR tuners. If you have a DVR it's important to check BOTH satellite tuners. 

Fill in your readings for each satellite and tuner on the new post you create, using the example below as a guide. (The example below is only an example and not a form that will appear in your post unless you "cut" and "paste" it.) A properly aligned dish will show 80-90s on most of the relevant transponders (although some will be low or zero):
Satellite transponders (32 total at 101º)
[Most of your standard definition channels are beamed from 101ºW]
1-8 X X X X X X X X 
9-16 X X X X X X X X
17-24 X X X X X X X X
25-32 X X X X X X X X

Satellite transponders (3 total at 110º)
[A few HD channels, also beamed from 99 & 103º]
1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA X
9-16 NA X NA X NA NA NA NA

Satellite transponders (11 total at 119º)
[Local SD channels for some cities, Spanish package]
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA X X X 
25-32X X X X X X X X

Satellite transponders (16 total at 99º(s)) [or 99º(b)]
[Local HD channels for some cities]
1-8 X X X X X X  NA NA
9-16 NA NA NA NA NA NA X X 
17-24 X X X X X X X X
[Note: these can be very slow to appear]

Satellite transponders (14 total at 99º©) [or 99º(a)]
[National HD channels]
1-8 X X X X X X X X
9-16X X X X X X  NA NA
[Note, these can be very slow to appear]

Satellite transponders (16 total at 103º(s)) [or 103º(a)]
[Local HD channels for some cities]
1-8 X X X X X X NA NA
9-16 NA NA NA NA NA NA X X 
17-24 X X X X X X X X
[Note, these can be very slow to appear]

Satellite transponders (16 total at 103º(ca)) 
[National HD channels]
1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA
9-16 X X X X X X X X
17-24 X X X X X X X X

Satellite transponders (14 total at 103º(cb)) [or 103º(b)]
[National HD channels]
1-8 X X X X X X X X
9-16 X X X X X X X X NA NA
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA


Here’s to the crazy ones.
The misfits. The rebels.
The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


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#11 OFFLINE   inhd40

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 04:33 PM

Well that could be a problem

 

Please post your signal readings

 

You'll find these readings under "Menu" -> "Setup" -> "System Setup" -> Satellite -> "View Signal Strength". Note the "+" and "-" symbols next to the "Satellite" and "Tuner" entries where you can toggle the readings between the various satellites and both DVR tuners. If you have a DVR it's important to check BOTH satellite tuners. 

Fill in your readings for each satellite and tuner on the new post you create, using the example below as a guide. (The example below is only an example and not a form that will appear in your post unless you "cut" and "paste" it.) A properly aligned dish will show 80-90s on most of the relevant transponders (although some will be low or zero):
Satellite transponders (32 total at 101º)
[Most of your standard definition channels are beamed from 101ºW]
1-8 X X X X X X X X 
9-16 X X X X X X X X
17-24 X X X X X X X X
25-32 X X X X X X X X

Satellite transponders (3 total at 110º)
[A few HD channels, also beamed from 99 & 103º]
1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA X
9-16 NA X NA X NA NA NA NA

Satellite transponders (11 total at 119º)
[Local SD channels for some cities, Spanish package]
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA X X X 
25-32X X X X X X X X

Satellite transponders (16 total at 99º(s)) [or 99º(b)]
[Local HD channels for some cities]
1-8 X X X X X X  NA NA
9-16 NA NA NA NA NA NA X X 
17-24 X X X X X X X X
[Note: these can be very slow to appear]

Satellite transponders (14 total at 99º©) [or 99º(a)]
[National HD channels]
1-8 X X X X X X X X
9-16X X X X X X  NA NA
[Note, these can be very slow to appear]

Satellite transponders (16 total at 103º(s)) [or 103º(a)]
[Local HD channels for some cities]
1-8 X X X X X X NA NA
9-16 NA NA NA NA NA NA X X 
17-24 X X X X X X X X
[Note, these can be very slow to appear]

Satellite transponders (16 total at 103º(ca)) 
[National HD channels]
1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA
9-16 X X X X X X X X
17-24 X X X X X X X X

Satellite transponders (14 total at 103º(cb)) [or 103º(b)]
[National HD channels]
1-8 X X X X X X X X
9-16 X X X X X X X X NA NA
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA

[Most of your standard definition channels are beamed from 101ºW]
1-8 95 97 95 0 95 99 95 100 
9-16 95 98 96 68 96 100 95 100
17-24 95 0 95 0 96 100 95 100
25-32 94 96 93 0 96 100 95 100

Satellite transponders (3 total at 110º)
[A few HD channels, also beamed from 99 & 103º]
1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA 95
9-16 NA 98 NA 95 NA NA NA NA

Satellite transponders (11 total at 119º)
[Local SD channels for some cities, Spanish package]
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA 99 91 99 
25-32 56 100 100 100 28 100 100 100

Satellite transponders (16 total at 99º(s)) [or 99º(b)]
[Local HD channels for some cities]
1-8 92 87 91 88 92 88  92 89
9-16 91 91 89 94 93 NA N/A 
17-24 X X X X X X X X
[Note: these can be very slow to appear]

Satellite transponders (14 total at 99º©) [or 99º(a)]
[National HD channels]
1-8 92 88 91 88 92 89 92 89
9-16 92 91 91 90 94 94 N/A N/A 
[Note, these can be very slow to appear]

Satellite transponders (16 total at 103º(s)) [or 103º(a)]
[Local HD channels for some cities]
1-8 61 92 61 95 85 95 NA NA
9-16 NA NA NA NA NA NA 95 78 
17-24 90 84 86 80 78  82  95 80
[Note, these can be very slow to appear]

Satellite transponders (16 total at 103º(ca)) 
[National HD channels]
1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA
9-16 95 95 94 95 94 95 95 94
17-24 95 95  95 95 95 94 95 95

Satellite transponders (14 total at 103º(cb)) [or 103º(b)]
[National HD channels]
1-8 95 91 95 90 94 91 95 91
9-16 95 91 95 91 94 91 NA NA
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA

 

Thanks for looking at these peds.



#12 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 05:09 PM

... Satellite transponders (3 total at 110º)
[A few HD channels, also beamed from 99 & 103º]

 

To Note:

 

110 carries no HD channels at all. Only SD ones for Puerto Rico only at present.


DIRECTV sub. since Sep. of '95


#13 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 05:35 PM

Well that could be a problem

 

Please post your signal readings

Poor signal readings would be a sign, but even with good readings off a receiver, there might be room for improvements.

The best would be checking with an AIM for the highest CNR.

Without an AIM, the next best would be the receiver's IV test and any red X that  show.

 

"Rainfade is a bitch" and it all seems to come down to the CNR at the LNB output.

Some LNBs do have a slightly better CNR than others.

 

"I've heard" Aspen Eagle  LNBs are slightly better. 


A.K.A VOS

#14 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 06:15 PM

 

Without an AIM, the next best would be the receiver's IV test and any red X that  show.

 

"

There has been many cases where the AIM reports a failure in a orbital slot but the receivers passes with flying colors.  I agree that the AIM is the best tool for the job, but lacking this tool all we have to go by is the readings on the receiver.


Here’s to the crazy ones.
The misfits. The rebels.
The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


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#15 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 06:16 PM

To Note:

 

110 carries no HD channels at all. Only SD ones for Puerto Rico only at present.

Guess is time to edit my template 


Here’s to the crazy ones.
The misfits. The rebels.
The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


Think Differently 

#16 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 06:19 PM

To inhd40

 

Your 99 could benefit from some improvement.  This is more likely a sign of a poorly level mast


Here’s to the crazy ones.
The misfits. The rebels.
The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


Think Differently 

#17 OFFLINE   inhd40

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 06:48 PM

To inhd40

 

Your 99 could benefit from some improvement.  This is more likely a sign of a poorly level mast

Thanks  I'll look in to that.



#18 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 09:47 PM

There has been many cases where the AIM reports a failure in a orbital slot but the receivers passes with flying colors.  I agree that the AIM is the best tool for the job, but lacking this tool all we have to go by is the readings on the receiver.

Using the AIM is the only way to check how much you're exceeding the min CNR for the IV test.

For the best resistance to rainfade, you need the highest CNR you can get.

 

"It would be nice" if DirecTV added some more gain to the LNA in the LNB.


A.K.A VOS

#19 OFFLINE   JohnBoy

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Posted 14 October 2013 - 07:06 AM

Here in Florida rain fade is a pain in the rear.

 

From July - Sept is thunderstorm season it seems and everytime it pours my good friend 771 shows up.

 

I've checked all my signal levels and everything looks good from mid 90's to 100's.

 

I literally find my self being a reverse indian praying for no rain to show up.The Hd signal is the first to go then I have to go looking through sd channels to see if anything is available,which seems clownish if you ask me.

 

Directv should put all their focus in correcting rain fade issues for people who live in rainy areas (Texas,FL,Seattle) instead of inventing new gimmicks and gadgets.Get the basics correct first.


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#20 OFFLINE   kevinwmsn

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Posted 14 October 2013 - 07:52 AM

Let's just make it the whole Gulf Coast region for the summer afternoon thunderstorms. Where I live we get as much and some years more rain than Seattle.  There is more rain fade issue with the Ka band that is in use primarily with HD than there is with Ku(SD). 


my setup here




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