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HR20 & hrs / hard drive question


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26 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   SledgeHammer

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 07:39 PM

HR20-100 -- what size hard drive came with it originally and how many hours did it hold? How many hours can a 1.5TB HD hold? Yeah, I know all MPEG4 boxes have the same MB/hr rate... just asking specifically about what the HR20-100 came with. Thanks!

 



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#2 ONLINE   jimmie57

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:15 PM

http://hr20.dbstalk....ocs/DVR FAQ.pdf


DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM, HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#3 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:15 PM

The HR20 originally came with a 320Gb hard drive


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The round pegs in the square holes.

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#4 OFFLINE   SledgeHammer

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:37 PM

So a 1.5TB drive should hold about 240hrs?



#5 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:42 PM

So a 1.5TB drive should hold about 240hrs?

Going by the linked chart, since the HR34 has a 1TB HDD and it holds 250 HD hours, a 1.5TB should be 275 HD hours.  by this vary widely by the compression method being used.


Here’s to the crazy ones.
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They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


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#6 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 10:36 PM

HR20-100 -- what size hard drive came with it originally and how many hours did it hold? How many hours can a 1.5TB HD hold? Yeah, I know all MPEG4 boxes have the same MB/hr rate... just asking specifically about what the HR20-100 came with. Thanks!

not really correct...bitrate varies based on action content of the show...a talking faces show like a newscast would take much less space than an action or sports show...it is variable bitrate, not fixed.  Most audio is fixed bitrate, but not the video.  the formula you can use is roughly 40 hours of HD per 200GB, 100GB of any HDD is reserved by Directv for PPV, etc...stuff that shows up as watch now. 

 

300GB HDD - 100 Reserved leaves 200GB for between 40 and 50 hours...

500GB -100  leaves 400GB for 80-100 hours

1TB -100 leaves 900GB for around 225-250 hours

2TB -100 leaves 1900GB for around 450-500 hours


Edited by CCarncross, 28 October 2013 - 09:09 AM.


#7 ONLINE   jimmie57

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 12:30 AM

So a 1.5TB drive should hold about 240hrs?

How many hours is always a guess. A 720p and a 1080i take up different amounts of space. I would think the 1.5 Terabyte would do more like 375 hours of HD programming. If you store some SD programming the number of hours goes way higher.

 

Just to be sure you know, if the receiver dies, all programming is lost.


DirecTV customer since 1996 - Current :Slimline 3 SWM, HR24-100 Component cables to 46" Samsung LCD & Optical Cable to Yamaha AVR, H21-200 HDMI to Yamaha AVR & HDMI to 52" Mitsubishi LCD


#8 ONLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 11:04 AM

The HR20 originally came with a 320Gb hard drive

 

Some only had a 300GB drive.  My first HR20-700 was one of those.


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#9 ONLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 11:05 AM

How many hours is always a guess. A 720p and a 1080i take up different amounts of space. I would think the 1.5 Terabyte would do more like 375 hours of HD programming. If you store some SD programming the number of hours goes way higher.

 

Just to be sure you know, if the receiver dies, all programming is lost.

 

And don't forget OTA recordings, they take up more space.


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#10 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 04:50 PM

100% incorrect...bitrate varies based on action content of the show...a talking faces show like a newscast would take much less space than an action or sports show...it is variable bitrate, not fixed.  the formula you can use is roughly 40 hours of HD per 200GB, 100GB of any HDD is reserved by Directv for PPV, etc...stuff that shows up as watch now. 

 

300GB HDD - 100 Reserved leaves 200GB for between 40 and 50 hours...

500GB -100  leaves 400GB for 80-100 hours

1TB -100 leaves 900GB for around 225-250 hours

2TB -100 leaves 1900GB for around 450-500 hours

I was under the impression that the bigger the drive the more DirecTV "borrow" from us.  I am pretty sure that the OS takes another chunks as well.


Here’s to the crazy ones.
The misfits. The rebels.
The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


Think Differently 

#11 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 05:06 PM

I was under the impression that the bigger the drive the more DirecTV "borrow" from us. ... 

Nah, it's a constant 100 GB.

 

 

I am pretty sure that the OS takes another chunks as well.

 

 

Again, "nah" not that I'm aware of;

 

Unlike the older TIVOs did, I understand DIRECTV receivers store the OS in semiconductor flash memory. not on the HDD.

 

In fact I'm told by those in the know, :) that's one of the primary reasons they're so difficult to hack to add or modify unauthorized features.  


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#12 ONLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 06:25 PM

I was under the impression that the bigger the drive the more DirecTV "borrow" from us.  I am pretty sure that the OS takes another chunks as well.

 

It's a percentage.


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#13 ONLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 06:27 PM

Nah, it's a constant 100 GB.

 

 

 

Again, "nah" not that I'm aware of;

 

Unlike the older TIVOs did, I understand DIRECTV receivers store the OS in semiconductor flash memory. not on the HDD.

 

In fact I'm told by those in the know, :) that's one of the primary reasons they're so difficult to hack to add or modify unauthorized features.  

 

No, it's not a constant 100GB, it's a percentage. 

 

Here's what I got for their partition on what I tested, all Seagate drives.

2TB drive, they get 17.86G
3TB drive, they get 27.94G
6TB array, they get 55.89G
9TB array, they get 83.83G
12TB array, they get 95.68G

 

And yes, parts of the OS are stored on the HDD as well.  The recording database, Logs, conf files, etc.  Put a brand new drive on an HR2X then pull it off without recording anything or making any changes.  If you hook it up to a computer you'll already find data on it.  That data is parts of the OS.

 

Here's the partition layout for a 9TB array on a Genie:

 

Partition 1 - 572MB
Partition 2 - 83.83GB (DirecTV's partition)
Partition 3 - 8293.31GB
Partition 4 - 143MB


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#14 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 08:17 PM

No, it's not a constant 100GB, it's a percentage. 

 

 

 

Yup, that was my understanding and it only makes sense…


Here’s to the crazy ones.
The misfits. The rebels.
The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


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#15 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 08:18 PM

 

 

And yes, parts of the OS are stored on the HDD as well.  The recording database, Logs, conf files, etc.  Put a brand new drive on an HR2X then pull it off without recording anything or making any changes.  If you hook it up to a computer you'll already find data on it.  That data is parts of the OS.

 

Here's the partition layout for a 9TB array on a Genie:

 

Partition 1 - 572MB
Partition 2 - 83.83GB (DirecTV's partition)
Partition 3 - 8293.31GB
Partition 4 - 143MB

Yup, again, this is to be expected and was my understanding as well.


Here’s to the crazy ones.
The misfits. The rebels.
The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


Think Differently 

#16 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 10:08 AM

Boy, ... did I take a royal beating on these points  :blackeye:

 

OK, well I humbly stand much corrected here, and glad to see that the amount of HDD space exclusively reserved for DIRECTV is not nearly the constant ~100GB popularly believed by many (like me :( )for years. And in reality is a percentage figure of only .8-.9% of the HDD, and not a fixed amount.

 

Somebody really needs to update russdog's introductory post in eSATA FAQ sticky thread;

 

http://www.dbstalk.c...4280-esata-faq/

 

The chart posted there (which I was actually following) is old and now found out to be wrong.

 

I also should have suspected as much about the OS that it would be more complex that what I believed previously. Where even though it is primarily stored in flash memory, when the DVR system is in operation the OS copies some of its system files to the HDD as well as creates new ones in different partitions this way. :bang

 

More humble pie served up. ...   


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#17 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 10:27 AM

Though I admit to being somewhat surprised by the fact that following these numbers which calculates to only a .8-.9 percentage means that a Genie with a 1 TB stock HDD gives DIRECTV only 8.58 GiB of reserved HDD space.

 

They manage to place all those "Watch Now" VOD programs in that small a space?

 

And where do the "Genie Recommends" (if activated) programs record to?   


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#18 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 11:52 AM

Something is not making sense.....I never heard that there was a change from the 100GB reserved space that we discovered a few years ago.  It doesnt make sense that it would be smaller than 100GB,    because there wouldnt be much room for them to store those movies like Hotat2 states....



#19 ONLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 11:59 AM

Something is not making sense.....I never heard that there was a change from the 100GB reserved space that we discovered a few years ago.  It doesnt make sense that it would be smaller than 100GB,    because there wouldnt be much room for them to store those movies like Hotat2 states....

 

There never was a set 100GB partition for DirecTV.  I know that there was speculation that it was 100GB but no drive that I've ever checked out had a 100GB partition. Think about it, the first HR's only had 300/320GB.  You really think they are going to just take 1/3 of the drive for themselves yet still advertise the recording hours they did?

 

If you don't believe me feel free to run your own tests.


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#20 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 01:54 PM

The 1st HR20's could hold roughly 40 hours of HD, which was about 200GB.  There is no way you could squeeze the amount of PPV they did/do if it wasnt close to that 100GB, it has always been close to 20 hours watch instant PPV on those boxes...



#21 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 02:12 PM

I think the partion is for OS stuff like guide data etc and the on demand stuff is in the regular portion with the recordings and just kept separate via a filing system. At least on the genie because consider genie recommends.

#22 ONLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 02:17 PM

The 1st HR20's could hold roughly 40 hours of HD, which was about 200GB.  There is no way you could squeeze the amount of PPV they did/do if it wasnt close to that 100GB, it has always been close to 20 hours watch instant PPV on those boxes...

 

You're more than welcome to do you own tests but what I found, and others verified, is where it stands.

 

Also...  The HR20's advertised 50 hrs of HD (30 OTA and 200 SD) and keep in mind when they first came out there was no "instant PPV" much less "always been close to 20 hours" of it.


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#23 ONLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 02:18 PM

I think the partion is for OS stuff like guide data etc and the on demand stuff is in the regular portion with the recordings and just kept separate via a filing system. At least on the genie because consider genie recommends.

 

Even if so, which after reviewing what is in the large partition I know it's not, it is NOT a 100GB partition just for DirecTV.   If they had their own 100GB partition then one of the partitions would be 100GB.

 

So do we want to debate that there is a 100GB partition just for DirecTV or debate whether or not they use "our space" for their (Genie Recommends and PPV) recordings?  Those are 2 different debates. 


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#24 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 06:50 PM

You're more than welcome to do you own tests but what I found, and others verified, is where it stands.

 

Also...  The HR20's advertised 50 hrs of HD (30 OTA and 200 SD) and keep in mind when they first came out there was no "instant PPV" much less "always been close to 20 hours" of it.

Boy, you and I dont remember it the same way at all. :cheers2:  Dont forget that the original HR20-700 had the 300GB drive and wasnt everything still MPEG2 back then or had they already launched 103 or 99 with the 1st HD Lils in MPEG4?....I dont think it was until the 320GB drives and MPEG4 sats and non-LiL MPEG4 channels that the claimed capacity went to "up to 50 hours".  I know I couldnt even get to 40 hours of HD when I got my 1st HR20-700 back in the fall of 2006.  I'd certainly like to see what trickery they are using to get that much ready to play PPV on any of my HR's with only 17GB of space.  That would only be roughly 4-5 hours of HD content, and there is way more than that on any of my HR2x's at any given time.  I was also an original H20-600(yes the space heater model) owner as well...got one as soon as it came out.


Edited by CCarncross, 28 October 2013 - 07:02 PM.


#25 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 07:33 PM

About the only thing I can figure is that the ~100 GB D* reserved space is set aside, but as a part of the main user partition and not as a separate partition of its own. 


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