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Doctor Who Christmas Special


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51 replies to this topic

#41 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 08 January 2014 - 05:15 PM

It's a choice to stay who he is,  yes, but it is NOT a choice to choose each and every feature of his face or body.


You're fighting a strawman argument. You said "The Doctor doesn't choose what he looks like." I replied "The 10th Doctor regenerated and kept looking like the 10th Doctor because he "had vanity issues"." Now it seems that you agree with my statement and are misunderstanding what I wrote.

Perhaps you just want to argue ... but it seems that you're agreeing with me angrily.
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#42 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 08 January 2014 - 07:08 PM

IT is just a TV show after all...  but when something happens on the show and someone says "that doesn't count because it was not meant that way" then you can't use anything else that ever happens on the show as proof of anything.  You either have to accept it all or none of it to my mind.

 

So... several examples have been given of in-show proof of choice during regeneration.  There's actually no proof of the counter... that being that there can be no choice during regeneration...  in fact, absence of proof tends to prove the opposite... so by all accounts one must reach the conclusion that the Doctor and other Timelords may not usually choose their appearance either because they don't care OR because they have other things on their mind at the time... but there's clear evidence that personal choice can be incorporated.

 

One chose to stay the same... He also was given a choice not once, but twice... (War Games regeneration and Night of the Doctor regeneration)... and another clear made choices in her regeneration.  That seems like enough proof to me.


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#43 OFFLINE   Red Orc

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Posted 08 January 2014 - 07:15 PM

This is what some one posted on another forum.

Basically he/she thought that maybe Romana had better control over her regenerations. He said that maybe it was something they taught in school on Gallifrey and the Doctor skipped that class.

Or maybe some Time Lords naturally have better control over their regenerations than others. Like how some people can wiggle their ears while most can't.



#44 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 12:29 PM

You're fighting a strawman argument. You said "The Doctor doesn't choose what he looks like." I replied "The 10th Doctor regenerated and kept looking like the 10th Doctor because he "had vanity issues"." Now it seems that you agree with my statement and are misunderstanding what I wrote.

Perhaps you just want to argue ... but it seems that you're agreeing with me angrily.

 

Again....  He didn't choose each and every feature of his face/body therefore he CANNOT choose what he looks like.   <--- If you don't understand that perhaps google's translator can put it in a language you better understand.  :D


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#45 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 12:33 PM

IT is just a TV show after all...  but when something happens on the show and someone says "that doesn't count because it was not meant that way" then you can't use anything else that ever happens on the show as proof of anything.  You either have to accept it all or none of it to my mind.

 

So... several examples have been given of in-show proof of choice during regeneration.  There's actually no proof of the counter... that being that there can be no choice during regeneration...  in fact, absence of proof tends to prove the opposite... so by all accounts one must reach the conclusion that the Doctor and other Timelords may not usually choose their appearance either because they don't care OR because they have other things on their mind at the time... but there's clear evidence that personal choice can be incorporated.

 

One chose to stay the same... He also was given a choice not once, but twice... (War Games regeneration and Night of the Doctor regeneration)... and another clear made choices in her regeneration.  That seems like enough proof to me.

 

Again, and when I said this before it was conveniently passed over (gee, I wonder why), if he could choose what he can look like he'd have been a "ginger" by now.


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#46 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 05:23 PM

Again....  He didn't choose each and every feature of his face/body therefore he CANNOT choose what he looks like.   <--- If you don't understand that perhaps google's translator can put it in a language you better understand.  :D

 
Again ... you're not arguing against me. You're just posting angry words in response to what I have written.
Perhaps Levar Burton could step in and offer some reading assistance?


He CAN choose his appearance otherwise he could not have chosen to stay the same.
Perhaps he hasn't become ginger because somewhere deep inside he is repressing the request?

BTW: How many times has he finished regeneration and complained about not being ginger? This latest time he complained about the color of his kidneys. I seem to recall him complaining about that before (or was it his liver?).
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#47 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 06:13 PM

Again, and when I said this before it was conveniently passed over (gee, I wonder why), if he could choose what he can look like he'd have been a "ginger" by now.

That doesn't equate.

 

You're equating one particular change and saying he hasn't done that so he must not be able to...  Where is the evidence that he can't?  There is none.

 

You might as well say that because earlier today I wanted a hamburger and I didn't get one, that I am therefore unable to ever get a hamburger.

 

It doesn't compute.

 

For that matter... IF he truly wanted to be a "ginger" there is hair dye...  also, he showed his shaved head and yet clearly chose to wear a wig that looked like his normal hair.  Are you also concluding that he was unable to choose a red-hair wig too?  That's pretty much the same stance you've taken...  so he was bald, and still got a wig that matched his normal hair, therefore he is unable to choose his wig?  :scratchin


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#48 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 08:51 PM


He CAN choose his appearance otherwise he could not have chosen to stay the same.
Perhaps he hasn't become ginger because somewhere deep inside he is repressing the request?

 

 

No, he can't...  I really can't see how you don't get that choosing to stay the same is NOT choosing each and every feature of your face/body.   Saying "I don't want to change" is NOT NOT NOT the same as "I'll have that nose, that hair, those ears, etc."

 

And as far as your comeback for "ginger", seems like you're just making things up now to TRY to support your theory.   The fact that he's disappointed that he's not yet "ginger" just proves that he doesn't get what he wants.   


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#49 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 08:52 PM

That doesn't equate.

 

You're equating one particular change and saying he hasn't done that so he must not be able to...  Where is the evidence that he can't?  There is none.

 

You might as well say that because earlier today I wanted a hamburger and I didn't get one, that I am therefore unable to ever get a hamburger.

 

It doesn't compute.

 

For that matter... IF he truly wanted to be a "ginger" there is hair dye...  also, he showed his shaved head and yet clearly chose to wear a wig that looked like his normal hair.  Are you also concluding that he was unable to choose a red-hair wig too?  That's pretty much the same stance you've taken...  so he was bald, and still got a wig that matched his normal hair, therefore he is unable to choose his wig?  :scratchin

 

Like I said, when presented with facts you'll still argue.   Please put me on ignore.


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#50 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 10:45 PM

No, he can't...  I really can't see how you don't get that choosing to stay the same is NOT choosing each and every feature of your face/body.


I don't know who you are arguing against. Please slow down and read my posts. If you have a problem with someone else quote their posts, not mine.
 

And as far as your comeback for "ginger", seems like you're just making things up now to TRY to support your theory.   The fact that he's disappointed that he's not yet "ginger" just proves that he doesn't get what he wants.


One offhand comment about not being ginger and you're making it sound like the most important point of the show. "11" may have been the only doctor wanted to be ginger. Do you have any proof otherwise?

I know that in the storyline The Doctor has made choices in more than one of his regenerations. The vain one made a choice not to change. The ninth one (with assistance) chose to be a warrior.

The second doctor (with assistance) was given a choice - he chose too slowly but he was given a choice.

@1:55 "I maintain that I have the right to decide what I look like."

From his lips to the BBC's microphones.

Like I said, when presented with facts you'll still argue.


Take a step back. You're arguing the cannon of a fictional TV show ... not facts.
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#51 OFFLINE   RunnerFL

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Posted 10 January 2014 - 07:32 AM

I give up.  You guys will just keep piling on crap to try to make yourselves look right, even after proven wrong time and time again.  Enjoy the thread you've ruined...


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#52 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 10 January 2014 - 12:43 PM

So... one thing the main character says in-show is to be taken as irrefutable fact while another thing the main character says in-show is "crap"?

 

Someone smart once said... "when presented with facts you will still argue."

 

Prophetic words.


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