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All American Direct Ceasing Operations (Feb 25th)

Distant Networks

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#61 OFFLINE   joetex

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Posted 16 February 2014 - 11:55 AM

I will miss them too as I have had west coast feeds since 1999.  On the other hand, just purchased a Roku box on Friday that has fascinated me to say the least.  Oh well, Dish and AAD's loss is someone else's gain.



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#62 OFFLINE   SeaBeagle

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Posted 16 February 2014 - 09:33 PM

I will miss them too as I have had west coast feeds since 1999. On the other hand, just purchased a Roku box on Friday that has fascinated me to say the least. Oh well, Dish and AAD's loss is someone else's gain.


Yes I have a ROKU as well. But, the TV stations are far from what DISH carries. Only certain times are TV stations broadcasting on ROKU.

If these TV stations broadcast like DISH carries them with out interruptions then that would be better than All American Direct.

Then there is Aereo which would be fine but are fussy on which TV market you can receive. So that company is totally useless.


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#63 OFFLINE   cj9788

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 04:17 PM

ImageUploadedByDBSTalk1393366510.603618.jpg

Just got my refund check. I still had 3 more months of service prepaid so I wonder how the prorated amount is only five bucks and change. Oh well RIP distant network service you will be sorely missed....

#64 OFFLINE   Jon Ellis

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 08:20 PM

All American Direct died at 12:08 p.m. PT today while my TiVo was recording the KTVU Noon News.

 

I will miss being able to watch San Francisco news on a real TV (rather than a web stream).  They do a great job!



#65 OFFLINE   Lou

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 09:39 PM

I just think this is a sad day in America.  Today our Emails, Texts and Phone Calls are monitored, but watching a television signal from another part of OUR country, not so much acceptable.  Yes I have heard the argument on the why but to ban an American from accessing any part of America, to me is simply wrong. 



#66 OFFLINE   joetex

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 10:09 PM

Yes, definitely enjoyed the SF news.  KTVU, KNTV and KGO in particular provided very comprehensive news coverage as opposed to the newsmagazine shows we get in NY.  Getting used to the Roku box for out of town news although i will admit to enjoying the out of town commercials as well that I saw from the SF affiliates.  I have probably reached the point with Dish where once the Superstations are gone, I will look at other options.  Surely a sad day when some of us who had distants for over 13 years with the waivers of the local affiliates (and presumably their blessing) are no longer allowed to access them when the technology is certainly there for us to be able to view them.



#67 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 12:16 AM

I just think this is a sad day in America.  Today our Emails, Texts and Phone Calls are monitored, but watching a television signal from another part of OUR country, not so much acceptable.  Yes I have heard the argument on the why but to ban an American from accessing any part of America, to me is simply wrong.


Ban? There has been no recent change in law. DirecTV still offers distants to their qualified customers. DISH offers distants (generally nearby distants to fill in short markets) in many markets. There is no ban.

A company that offered distants service has ceased operating. The demand just isn't there to keep a standalone business operating.
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#68 OFFLINE   cj9788

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 12:11 PM

I

Edited by cj9788, 27 February 2014 - 12:12 PM.


#69 OFFLINE   Lou

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 10:47 PM

James yes, a company ceased operating because demand is low but why is demand low?  The answer: laws have changed, and continued to change, to ensure Americans are restricted from accessing other areas of our Nation.  You can justify it, but the bottom line is the bottom line.

 

I became a Dish customer in 1996 and Subbed to East and West Network feeds with zero restrictions.  That isn’t the case anymore.  While technically someone can still sub to Distants, today very few can qualify and that is by design.  Those restrictive laws are what I referred to when I say, “Banned”.  Again I understand what this is about and why they don’t want us to access other parts of our country but any law that restricts an America from accessing any part of our Nation, I believe is wrong.      

 

In the mean time Canada has taken the opposite approach, Canada offers every Canadian access to every region of their country as part of the most basic package. 



#70 ONLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 12:22 AM

James yes, a company ceased operating because demand is low but why is demand low? The answer: laws have changed, and continued to change, to ensure Americans are restricted from accessing other areas of our Nation. You can justify it, but the bottom line is the bottom line.

I became a Dish customer in 1996 and Subbed to East and West Network feeds with zero restrictions. That isn’t the case anymore. While technically someone can still sub to Distants, today very few can qualify and that is by design. Those restrictive laws are what I referred to when I say, “Banned”. Again I understand what this is about and why they don’t want us to access other parts of our country but any law that restricts an America from accessing any part of our Nation, I believe is wrong.

In the mean time Canada has taken the opposite approach, Canada offers every Canadian access to every region of their country as part of the most basic package.


Can you tell us what laws changed? Because from where I am standing The laws did not change.

First dish was doing some stuff that was illegal In the first place in terms of how try are letting get distant and got caught. But far more important, dish and DIRECTV both have added thousands of local channels which then by law kept them from still offering distant channels in most situations to new accounts.

Bottom line is the sat companies have upgrade their offering to the point the old DNS feeds are no longer needed and the chances of getting exemptions have dwindled because of it.

Sat is the only way anyone has ever really been able to get distant feeds anyway, and that law was added to let them under certain circumstances so they could compete with cable before they had locals. I know of no law dedicated to shrinking what they where allowed to offer.

And remember something else, the law is you have to get waivers. It's the businesses refusing waivers that Denies more DNS than anything, not the laws. It's te complained trying to protect their money not laws banning them from doing things.

Believe me if the industry wanted to be able to offer all channels in all markets it would be so right now today. No question about it.

#71 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 01:14 AM

Can you tell us what laws changed? Because from where I am standing The laws did not change.


No recent changes ... although the laws are up for renewal at the end of this year. The basic qualifications in law for distants have not changed with the past few renewals (they actually improved on the last pass by eliminating out of market affiliates from blocking reception). The only negative change was removing permission for early delivery (eg: NY locals delivered in California). The biggest change affecting distants is the introduction of local television stations that perform the task of delivering the national network content as well as local programming. As more markets got their own affiliates the defined need for distants was met through local stations instead of an imported signal.

In the mean time Canada has taken the opposite approach, Canada offers every Canadian access to every region of their country as part of the most basic package.


The Canadian broadcast networks and stations (not the satellite carriers) have taken a different approach. Here in America the broadcast networks sell their content to affiliates ... the local affiliates pay for the exclusive right to rebroadcast that content on their stations within a defined market area. Providing a station from outside of the market area infringes on that local station's rights. When all the stations on a network are owned by a common owner it doesn't matter which station's feed one watches. Canadian networks ALLOW what Canadian satellite provides.

Here in America the broadcast networks do not allow importing a signal from another market. It would be a violation of the affiliation agreement. But in the narrow case where there is no local affiliate holding the rights a "distant" signal may be imported.

What people forget is that the distants law is a permissive law. When the law expires (unless extended) at the end of the year that permission will end. And the will of the content owners will not be overridden by the law.
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#72 OFFLINE   Lou

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 08:39 AM

Inkahauts, the laws have changed.  I never said they changed this week or even the past year.  As I said in 1996 accessing Distants had no restrictions. Then FOX Miami made an issue of Distants and brought the issue to head. A pivotal decision was made which started restricting access to Distant stations.  Wavers became part of the vocabulary.  Later simply living in White Zone wasn’t reason enough to access Distants.  It didn’t matter that you lived in a deep mountain valley in the Rockies where no signals could reach, you lived in DNA and that is the only DNA were allowed to get.  So yes laws have changed and this week the effects of the law took another toll.

 

James is providing the justification (for the benefit of our reading audience) I referred to. Note the language James used, which I originally referred to as “Banned”:

- “do not allow importing a signal from another market”

 

I get the fact that technology advanced to the point where companies gained the capability to deliver Distants.  In the 90’s Satellite penetration was low, so little attention was giving to the situation.  As the numbers grew, the current situation required a solution.  It did so by creating laws to restrict access.  So we had problem and found a solution.  That solution resulted in Americans being restricted from accessing other parts of America.  It is that bottom line that I object to.  There should be no law preventing American’s from accessing America. So let me pose it this way, is our audience comfortable with American laws, that tell Americans, what licensed American stations we can watch?



#73 OFFLINE   sigma1914

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 08:55 AM

What information are you being banned from accessing that's so vital that it's not accessible online?


If you stop responding to them or put them on ignore, then eventually they'll go away.

#74 ONLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 01:35 PM

Inkahauts, the laws have changed. I never said they changed this week or even the past year. As I said in 1996 accessing Distants had no restrictions. Then FOX Miami made an issue of Distants and brought the issue to head. A pivotal decision was made which started restricting access to Distant stations. Wavers became part of the vocabulary. Later simply living in White Zone wasn’t reason enough to access Distants. It didn’t matter that you lived in a deep mountain valley in the Rockies where no signals could reach, you lived in DNA and that is the only DNA were allowed to get. So yes laws have changed and this week the effects of the law took another toll.

James is providing the justification (for the benefit of our reading audience) I referred to. Note the language James used, which I originally referred to as “Banned”:
- “do not allow importing a signal from another market”

I get the fact that technology advanced to the point where companies gained the capability to deliver Distants. In the 90’s Satellite penetration was low, so little attention was giving to the situation. As the numbers grew, the current situation required a solution. It did so by creating laws to restrict access. So we had problem and found a solution. That solution resulted in Americans being restricted from accessing other parts of America. It is that bottom line that I object to. There should be no law preventing American’s from accessing America. So let me pose it this way, is our audience comfortable with American laws, that tell Americans, what licensed American stations we can watch?

The laws you are talking about where not passed by congress just because. They where pushed though because the local stations felt their product was being hurt illegally after a technical leap changed what could be done. (Distant a could now be gotten via sat)

Those laws where about protecting businesses that had contracts to be sole providers in their area.

Blame the networks for your ban not the people who made the laws. They only made them to make it easier to enforce contracts.

And yes I'm fine with it because it's not banning me from anything as it not a ban. I am not in an area where a product is sold so I don't get it. The laws enforce me from getting it against contracts that have been made.

Other than news there really isn't any show that the majority of people in this country are "banned" from getting in your equation anyway. Almost everything is either delivered via network or in syndication on a channel somewhere in you market.

And you can get most news stations online. You are not banned from any actual information anywhere in this country. And companies decided they ,through contracts, would divi up what source you got them from in certain mediums.

I suppose you think mlb ei and nfl Sunday ticket et al should be free to all as well? Because it's the exact same thing.

I think the main thing is you think the government is the cause for all the rules about distants. It's not. Hollywood is. The rules just made their contracts easier to enforce.

#75 ONLINE   KyL416

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 04:24 PM

The Canadian broadcast networks and stations (not the satellite carriers) have taken a different approach. Here in America the broadcast networks sell their content to affiliates ... the local affiliates pay for the exclusive right to rebroadcast that content on their stations within a defined market area. Providing a station from outside of the market area infringes on that local station's rights. When all the stations on a network are owned by a common owner it doesn't matter which station's feed one watches. Canadian networks ALLOW what Canadian satellite provides.

Exactly, comparing broadcast television in Canada to that of the USA is apples and oranges. In Canada outside of local news and regional NFL and NHL games, the networks have a uniform schedule 24/7. In the USA network programming is limited to primetime, late night, daytime and mornings for the big 3, while for Fox, CW and MyNet it's mostly limited to primetime. The rest of the day it's all syndication where various distributors and studios sell content to various station groups and individual stations. (i.e. Ellen, Dr. Oz, Dr. Phil, Judge Judy, Live with Kelly and Michael, Family Feud, Who Wants to be a Millionaire, Seinfeld, TMZ, Everybody Loves Raymond, Big Bang Theory, Modern Family, etc)

Also in Canada the networks own nearly all of their affiliates. In the USA we have multiple competing companies owning individual affiliates of multiple networks across the country. (i.e. in one market Sinclair may own an ABC affiliate while Nexstar owns the NBC affiliate, in another market it could be the opposite)

#76 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 05:25 PM

As I said in 1996 accessing Distants had no restrictions. Then FOX Miami made an issue of Distants and brought the issue to head. A pivotal decision was made which started restricting access to Distant stations.


A court decision. The copyright owners asserted their rights and a court decided that the satellite companies were infringing on the rights of the stations and networks. In response to the court decision that would have prohibited any rebroadcast without an agreement between the station and the satellite company, laws were written that addressed the copyright concerns and permitted carriage, despite the objections of the stations and networks.

 

James is providing the justification (for the benefit of our reading audience) I referred to. Note the language James used, which I originally referred to as “Banned”:
- “do not allow importing a signal from another market”


You missed it ... "do not allow" is not the same as "prohibits". A ban would come from a prohibition. Permissive laws that allow carriage under certain laws are not a ban.
 

I get the fact that technology advanced to the point where companies gained the capability to deliver Distants.


Actually technology has advanced to the point where companies gained the capability to deliver every local station into each local market. DISH is now able to deliver local channels to all markets - wherever a satellite dish can be installed. Part of the cost is that the locals are delivered by spotbeam ... a limit of the technology that means I cannot watch Seattle locals in Indiana or Florida locals in Wyoming. In order to deliver a set of locals to the entire US the channels must be on ConUS transponders. The more space used on ConUS transponders for locals the less space that is available for other channels.
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#77 OFFLINE   dish556

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 09:47 AM

what a joke Sat TV has became why because when you get one your thinking Sky The F limits then you find out No East coast feed can be show because the F jerk that bet on game can cheat and that why they Cut showing the East coast feeds!

 

I want my East coast WWOR and others back D it Dish we are the people that should get to watch these feeds don't show any sports on the superstations and no sports news on those stations!

 

Superstations available in most areas via Dish Network

Most locations in the US qualify for receiving the 5 Superstations from Boston, Denver, Los Angeles and New York City.

Channels featured:
  • WSBK - Boston, MA
  • KWGN - Denver, CO
  • KTLA - Los Angeles, CA
  • WPIX - New York City, NY
  • WWOR - Secaucus, NJ (part of NYC Metro area)
Pricing and options:
  • $7/month for all 5 superstations

bring them back that why everyone sign up to get out of market news!


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#78 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 02:09 PM

Umm... what?

 

How would an east coast feed of a game allow someone to cheat?  Are they still showing west coast games on tape delay?  I thought that was done decades ago...  I'm not even sure what any part of that rant has to do with this topic actually.


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#79 OFFLINE   thomasingram2nd

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 06:37 PM

what a joke Sat TV has became why because when you get one your thinking Sky The F limits then you find out No East coast feed can be show because the F jerk that bet on game can cheat and that why they Cut showing the East coast feeds!

 

I want my East coast WWOR and others back D it Dish we are the people that should get to watch these feeds don't show any sports on the superstations and no sports news on those stations!

 

Superstations available in most areas via Dish Network

Most locations in the US qualify for receiving the 5 Superstations from Boston, Denver, Los Angeles and New York City.

Channels featured:
  • WSBK - Boston, MA
  • KWGN - Denver, CO
  • KTLA - Los Angeles, CA
  • WPIX - New York City, NY
  • WWOR - Secaucus, NJ (part of NYC Metro area)
Pricing and options:
  • $7/month for all 5 superstations

bring them back that why everyone sign up to get out of market news!

  I wish the super stations were in hi definition.  I do not think Dish will do what was planned since S.T.E.L.A. is the law spot beam locals..  It is true Dish can not provide super stations, since congress passed law in 1992.  The copy right act..  If your getting c.w. 39 WZZZ, then Dish can not sell you super station. These 5 including wgn hd will be grandfathered end of the year and will see at the end what happens.  In the mean time, Dish Is looking at the possible matter of a RV/Truck only waiver for only Dish receiver DVR 211z.  You can purchase that receiver at Camping World.  You must be a RV or truck owner.  The Dish unit must be in the Truck or RV for distant networks.  So far as of Today.  Dish has said, we have no plans yet.  Check back with us in another couple days.. Will see.  Do not get frustrated with this government.  Thanks and you have a blessed day..



#80 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 07:00 PM

It is true Dish can not provide super stations, since congress passed law in 1992.


Not true. DISH can legally provide superstations as defined and permitted in the relevant laws. If a local station complains about syndicated content DISH must black out the content they complain about - and it is easier to black out the entire channel than keep track of per market blackouts on the superstations - but DISH can provide the stations.

These 5 including wgn hd will be grandfathered end of the year and will see at the end what happens.


WGN is no longer a superstation. They ceased being a superstation years ago when they created a special feed just for satellite systems. The channel satellite subscribers receive nationwide is "WGN America". WTBS Atlanta went the same path splitting off their local TV station from the satellite fed "TBS" feed.

The WGN9 feed continues to serve the Chicago market as a local station.
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