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When Directv goes all mpeg4 will they still use 101,110 and 119?


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145 replies to this topic

#121 OFFLINE   Laxguy

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 03:00 PM

Providing SD in MPEG4 is possible (see the PI channels on "HD" satellites). So the complaints from customers not wanting to downconvert 16x9 can be met by continuing to deliver the 4x3 feeds. DISH does this with their MPEG4 "Eastern Arc" service. SD in MPEG4 doesn't take up a lot of room on a satellite. But getting customers to change equipment when there is a financial incentive in place NOT to change equipment is an uphill battle.

Quite so on the disincentive!

 

Heh: There will be complaints! "The picture is much clearer than before, but I don't like it....."


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#122 OFFLINE   JosephB

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 03:24 PM

I think the evidence will be in the next generation of receivers. There was talk about a Lego system they use in Latin America here in the us. I'll bet it's significantly cheaper than the current h24 and HR24 etc. but time will tell.

 

I think the foundation for an all-MPEG4/Ka system comes with the next generation of receivers. The cost of just giving everyone an HD-capable box that will down convert can't be that much higher, if it is at all, than developing two lines of boxes again, especially factoring in costs over the life of the boxes.

 

Also at some point the savings in warehouse space and administrative costs to have two (or three) satellite dishes in inventory will push them to install SL3/SL5s for everyone regardless of service level.



#123 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 03:38 PM

DIRECTV has reduced the quality of SD to the point that it is approaching insufferable on HD displays, the government decreed standard television for seven years.


No such decree. Absolutely not. FCC standards for broadcast television include SD and other less than HD formats.

ATSC tuners must be able to tune the approved formats for OTA broadcasting, which includes SD. But there is absolutely no standard or regulation decreeing that TV be transmitted in HD or displayed in HD. Period.
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#124 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 03:44 PM

Quite so on the disincentive!
 
Heh: There will be complaints! "The picture is much clearer than before, but I don't like it....."


Some networks have decided to stretch their SD to fill a HD screen. The stretch is not always proportional and can include a crop causing a situation where it cannot be "unstretched" for a 4x3 display. Having the original 4x3 is preferable.
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#125 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 07:56 PM

 install SL3/SL5s for everyone regardless of service level.

You are getting somewhere....


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#126 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 08:40 AM

Well you may consider it "foot-dragging" harsh;

A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.

I think it will ultimately reflect badly on the company that they're delivering such a non-excellent product to some new subscribers for a measly monthly savings ($10?).

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#127 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 08:48 AM

No such decree. Absolutely not. FCC standards for broadcast television include SD and other less than HD formats.

While there is no decree regarding broadcast TV signals, there was a decree back in the last decade that all TVs of a certain size be capable of handing HD content in some fashion to be sold in the US market. It was phased in over two or three years starting with large TVs in 2005 as I recall.

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#128 OFFLINE   slice1900

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 02:06 PM

A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.

I think it will ultimately reflect badly on the company that they're delivering such a non-excellent product to some new subscribers for a measly monthly savings ($10?).

Bean counters often don't evaluate such difficult concepts as goodwill particularly well.

 

Directv's SD may look pretty bad on a HD set, especially when we're mentally comparing it to HD. How does it look on a CRT TV that's probably at least 10 years old, maybe more? There's going to be much less difference between crappy SD and good SD on an old analog set that doesn't have all that great of a picture in the first place. Yes, you could buy high end CRTs that had a pretty good picture, but people willing to spend money on a better picture have converted to HD by now, so the SD sets still in use are mostly low end.

 

Crappy SD quality is more of a problem for SD only channels that HD customers are watching on a HD TV. Presumably they'll address that when the new satellites launch, either by carrying those channels in HD (if available) or converting them to MPEG4 as Directv may already be doing on a small scale (see the thread on JLTV moving from MPEG2 on 119 to MPEG4 on 103 recently)


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#129 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 03:53 PM

While there is no decree regarding broadcast TV signals, there was a decree back in the last decade that all TVs of a certain size be capable of handing HD content in some fashion to be sold in the US market. It was phased in over two or three years starting with large TVs in 2005 as I recall.


Your statement was "HD displays, the government decreed standard television". The tuner requirement on TVs, which was phased in from large to small, DID NOT require a HD display. A HD display is *NOT* a government decreed standard.

(And, as previously explained, non-HD formats remain part of the tuner requirement.)
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#130 OFFLINE   Diana C

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 03:58 PM

While there is no decree regarding broadcast TV signals, there was a decree back in the last decade that all TVs of a certain size be capable of handing HD content in some fashion to be sold in the US market. It was phased in over two or three years starting with large TVs in 2005 as I recall.

Do you have a link to that ruling?  I know of laws that require TV's larger than 13 inches to have V-Chips and to support closed captions, and all TVs have to have ATSC tuners (which means they must RECEIVE SD, ED and HD formats), but I know of no law that requires them to have an HD display.  It is perfectly legal to build a 32" 640x480i TV as long as it downconverts any broadcast signal to that screen. (Of course, good luck getting anyone to buy it)


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#131 OFFLINE   slice1900

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 04:37 PM

Do you have a link to that ruling?  I know of laws that require TV's larger than 13 inches to have V-Chips and to support closed captions, and all TVs have to have ATSC tuners (which means they must RECEIVE SD, ED and HD formats), but I know of no law that requires them to have an HD display.  It is perfectly legal to build a 32" 640x480i TV as long as it downconverts any broadcast signal to that screen. (Of course, good luck getting anyone to buy it)

 

Given that I have a couple 42" Panny plasmas purchased in 2005 that have a 480p display, pretty sure you're absolutely correct!

 

They cost $1700/ea, and the next step up model that did 720p was nearly $4000 at the time.  You had to go to 50" to get their 1080p model, but I have no idea what it cost.  How quickly things have changed...


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#132 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 02 April 2014 - 12:34 PM

Do you have a link to that ruling? I know of laws that require TV's larger than 13 inches to have V-Chips and to support closed captions, and all TVs have to have ATSC tuners (which means they must RECEIVE SD, ED and HD formats), but I know of no law that requires them to have an HD display. It is perfectly legal to build a 32" 640x480i TV as long as it downconverts any broadcast signal to that screen. (Of course, good luck getting anyone to buy it)


Yep, that was about receiving, not displaying.

#133 OFFLINE   bobnielsen

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Posted 02 April 2014 - 08:21 PM

Directv's SD may look pretty bad on a HD set, especially when we're mentally comparing it to HD. How does it look on a CRT TV that's probably at least 10 years old, maybe more? There's going to be much less difference between crappy SD and good SD on an old analog set that doesn't have all that great of a picture in the first place. Yes, you could buy high end CRTs that had a pretty good picture, but people willing to spend money on a better picture have converted to HD by now, so the SD sets still in use are mostly low end.

 

Crappy SD quality is more of a problem for SD only channels that HD customers are watching on a HD TV. Presumably they'll address that when the new satellites launch, either by carrying those channels in HD (if available) or converting them to MPEG4 as Directv may already be doing on a small scale (see the thread on JLTV moving from MPEG2 on 119 to MPEG4 on 103 recently)

I used a HD receiver with a 21 in. SD CRT TV for several years (I finally replaced it a few months ago).  The difference between the MPEG2 SD channels and the HD version of the same channels  on that set was quite noticeable.  One of our remaining SD locals is MPEG4 and it looked nearly as good as the HD channels, being less starved for bandwidth than the channels on 101.



#134 OFFLINE   Dude111

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Posted 09 April 2014 - 02:36 PM

Being able to downconvert to SD at the box helps. It still leaves DirecTV with the task of replacing every receiver that is not capable of receiving the HD feeds. And changing out every dish that doesn't pick up the HD satellites. But once every SD customer can get the channels they subscribe to through HD downconvert the SDs can go.


Ya buddy and if this ever does happen that will be the time I cancel.... I hardily watch it now Jim.... They keep suspending my service I think because I am not paying them for a box! (I have my own) -- Its really strange as THEY FINALLY SAID OK THEY WOULD REACTIVATE IT FOR ME... (In january) Now they are doing this BS.. (Its happend 4 times so far since February)

I dont like greedy people and it just shows how they want everyone renting thier crappy boxs!! (They cant stand someone like me who has thier own mind and is holding out -- They want me to pay the monthly fee and I really dispise that!!)

I already pay 53 dollars AT LEAST per month and I hardily watch anything on it!!

I love DirecTV James,i have been with them since 1997 :)

Edited by Dude111, 09 April 2014 - 02:41 PM.


#135 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 09 April 2014 - 02:54 PM

 They keep suspending my service I think because I am not paying them for a box! (I have my own)

Owning or leasing a box does not determines if you pay a monthly fee.  first box is included in the package and any other after the first carries a fee wether leased or owned.


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#136 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 09 April 2014 - 02:55 PM

 (Its happend 4 times so far since February)

 

Loks like you don't take the hint....


Here’s to the crazy ones.
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The round pegs in the square holes.

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They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


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#137 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 02:34 AM

He's got an mpg box.

#138 OFFLINE   studechip

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 09:04 AM

Regardless of the type of box he has, the first one carries no monthly charge. Even if they swapped out his old one and gave him a new dish, I doubt Directv would charge him for the new equipment, much less charge him monthly. Some people are only happy when they are miserable.



#139 OFFLINE   HoTat2

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 10:41 AM

Its probably the activation system which keeps kicking Dude's receiver off after doing routine management and housekeeping scans as its instructed since those old MPG boxes are obsolete and should be turned off. DIRECTV should never have relented and reactivated it in the first place and the system should have been designed to prevent it.

 

Dude is just being unnecessarily difficult on this issue, to put it mildly.  


Edited by HoTat2, 10 April 2014 - 10:42 AM.

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#140 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 02:39 PM

Yep. We know he has no guide data so now there's no way he can say the guide is better in his old box or anything if that nature. It's quite humorous.




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