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The Walt Disney Company and DISH Network Sign Groundbreaking Long-Term, Wide-Ranging Agreement


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#51 OFFLINE   SayWhat?

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 05:47 AM

 

Charlie Ergen, Dish Network Corp. chairman, hinted at the underpinnings of the deal last month, when he admitted that the traditional pay-TV business model — charging customers $80 or $100 a month for hundreds of channels, many of which they never watch — is not appealing to younger people.

 

“We're losing a whole generation of individuals who aren't going to buy into that model,” he told analysts. “Obviously you'd like to kind of have your cake and eat it too, and make sure that you come up with products that can engage that new generation.”

 

The new service will bypass Dish's 14 million-customer satellite system and offer content via the Internet in much the same way that Netflix delivers video.

 

No start date has been announced. Dish will probably have to cut similar deals with other programmers to make such a service attractive.

 

Dish would not say how much the service might cost, except that it would probably be cheaper than current packages.

http://triblive.com/...sh-service-deal

 

If I'm reading that right, it almost looks like Dish may be offering a separate service.  Maybe a web-based Dish package where you won't need a dish and DVR box?


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#52 OFFLINE   tsmacro

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 07:39 AM

I could be wrong... but these two press releases today sure make it sound like Longhorn Network and SEC Network will be in AT120+ and above for everyone... as opposed to being in MultiSport like Pac12, and BigTen.

That's the way I read it too, however if I'm remembering correctly when Big Ten and Pac12 first came out they also were available nationwide for a while before going to their current arrangement of being available as an RSN in their regions and available in the Multi-Sport for everyone else.




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#53 OFFLINE   david_jr

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 08:09 AM

ABC will accept AutoHop after the C3 period ... apparently the value of those commercials has lessened after C3 - so it is a compromise. That is, until DISH and ABC work out a way to insert current ads in replayed ABC content. (That thought is also buried in the press release.)
 

I still don't see where one is forced to watch ABC/ESPN/Disney commercials on the DVR. The skip buttons will still work and AutoHop will work on ABC after C3.
 

Agreed.  Keep in mind that DISH is being sued by all 4 networks over auto-hop.  For once Charlie chose to compromise instead of fight all the way to the supreme court.  It really is a win-win even though it may seem not.  Di$ney DROPS its litigation and DISH gets to keep autohop after the C3 window on ABC.  Autohop is great.  Most who use it LOVE it.  The best thing about autohop is that you only have to enable PTAT for one channel on one day and ALL primetime networks shows, EVEN OTA, get autohopped.  Having to give up AH for a 3 day window is better than having to give it up if some judge (lawyer who is a freind of a highly placed public official) decides against it, or so Charlie seemed to think or he wouldn't have agreed to the window.  I also agree that you may see that in future agreements as well due to precedent. 

 

Phrelin, Don't give up on the Hopper over this deal, it is a wonderful piece of equipment most of the time.



#54 OFFLINE   tsmacro

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 08:32 AM

 

ABC will accept AutoHop after the C3 period ... apparently the value of those commercials has lessened after C3 - so it is a compromise. That is, until DISH and ABC work out a way to insert current ads in replayed ABC content. (That thought is also buried in the press release.)
 

I still don't see where one is forced to watch ABC/ESPN/Disney commercials on the DVR. The skip buttons will still work and AutoHop will work on ABC after C3.
 

Agreed.  Keep in mind that DISH is being sued by all 4 networks over auto-hop.  For once Charlie chose to compromise instead of fight all the way to the supreme court.  It really is a win-win even though it may seem not.  Di$ney DROPS its litigation and DISH gets to keep autohop after the C3 window on ABC.  Autohop is great.  Most who use it LOVE it.  The best thing about autohop is that you only have to enable PTAT for one channel on one day and ALL primetime networks shows, EVEN OTA, get autohopped.  Having to give up AH for a 3 day window is better than having to give it up if some judge (lawyer who is a freind of a highly placed public official) decides against it, or so Charlie seemed to think or he wouldn't have agreed to the window.  I also agree that you may see that in future agreements as well due to precedent. 

 

Phrelin, Don't give up on the Hopper over this deal, it is a wonderful piece of equipment most of the time.

Meh I don't get what the big deal is over auto-hop anyway. I use it on occasion but it doesn't improve my life in any significant way, I mean if I don't use it I push my skip button a few times, whoop de frickin doo. I remember thinking that when I saw the lawsuit over it that we live in a world where we're all puppets for lawyers, just one more stupid lawsuit that the only good it does it fatten lawyers bank accounts at the expense of the rest of us. Anyway yes I do love my Hopper too most the time, other than the odd on again off again glitch it seems to have picked up recently with the OTA signal occasionally just going "black", I've had to be careful with that otherwise I miss recordings.




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#55 OFFLINE   sregener

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 10:04 AM

All I know is that when I went to ESPN3 this morning, it didn't list Dish Network as one of the possible providers to have access to the service.

 

Granted, the French Open is still over a month away, so I can afford to be patient.



#56 OFFLINE   Paul Secic

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 10:22 AM

^ This part is great. It should light a fire under the collective a**es of the DirecTV people to deliver "Fusion, ESPN Goal Line, ESPN Buzzer Beater, as well as Longhorn Network and the upcoming SEC ESPN Network." (That's not to say when. But that, from the position of remaining a competitive business, it must … happen from DirecTV. )

What is "Fusion?


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#57 OFFLINE   sigma1914

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 10:25 AM

What is "Fusion?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=fusion+network+


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#58 OFFLINE   Paul Secic

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 10:40 AM

I rarely watch shows within a week of when they aired.  It's often weeks, months or years later.  I have several first run episodes on my HTPC from early last year I haven't watched yet.

 

I never watch amateur hour game shows.

Me either!


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#59 OFFLINE   Paul Secic

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 10:56 AM

When does it end?  (Sorry, Paul, I couldn't resist :)

 

Every time I hear of one of these "wonderful" deals, it makes me sick because I know that I am going to end up paying through the nose for something that I don't use.  I don't watch any of the ABC/Disney/ESPN channels (except occasionally I can receive WPVI OTA and I watch their 70s style Action News - it's the best thing that ABC does - I'll hum the theme for days afterwards).

 

I wouldn't mind if the programming was better, but it seems to be going downhill fast.  I'm getting closer and closer to cutting the cord; if it wasn't for Al Jazeera America, I think I might have already.

I don't watch ABC, ESPN et all. But I'm waiting for  ABC Family Channel. :)


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#60 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 11:38 AM

Forcing people to subscribe to cable/satellite to be able to watch programs on the web without use of cable or satellite will ultimately cost them viewership. Maybe not this year or next, but in the not too distant future. This sounds like nothing but an effort by the cable/satellite companies to try and keep people from going IP only. It's an attempt to protect the company at the expense of the public.

And it will likely hurt both the carriers and the content providers.


You seem to be missing the point if they don't do that they would lose all their customers in the cable and sat fields and raise prices on ip delivery that equalled what they get today.

Hollywood will never decrease the amount I money they get. Not going to happen.

Ip deliver will never be cheaper than cable or sat for a full package. The only reason it might be for a very few today is because so few use it today and Hollywood is taking its time to concern themselves with it but they are never going to just let it be.

#61 OFFLINE   Satelliteracer

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 11:45 AM

 

 

The tradeoff is going to be you will pay a TON more for that channel than you do today.  Or a better way to say it, Disney is still going to get theirs.  Either through millions of customers having it bundled in their base package at $X per sub, or from individual customers paying $2X (or $3X or  $4X).  They are on the hook for billions of dollars to the NFL, NCAA, SEC, Texas, NBA, etc, etc.  They have to make their money one way or another.    It is going to be infinitely harder for them to gather all the customers to sell direct at a higher price point than to go through 10 major television distributors.  Plus, they will have to staff up to handle customer service, more marketing, etc....all of which have enormous marketing and operational costs associated with them....that will flow down also to the price they are charging.


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#62 OFFLINE   SayWhat?

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 11:57 AM

Ip deliver will never be cheaper than cable or sat for a full package. The only reason it might be for a very few today is because so few use it today and Hollywood is taking its time to concern themselves with it but they are never going to just let it be.

Unless ...

 

http://www.dbstalk.c...thout-the-dish/

 

If Dish were to follow through with that, they would have no hardware costs at the subscriber end, so monthly rates could be somewhat lower.


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#63 OFFLINE   mwdxer

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 01:32 PM

Right now we don't even have that option. We sub to Dish or Direct and using a Roku, Dish or Direct are not even listed as providers on the Disney site, just cable and fibre. So we are losing out.I hope once the contracts are signed, Dish ends up on that list of providers for Disney and ESPN 3. I guess the 211k I cannot do VOD, or at least Dish will not allow it, even though I am using a 500K hard drive, so the Roku will do VOD on Disney, if I can gain access to the channels. I tried using Charter Cable as a provider with Roku as I have them for High Speed and phone, but it only gave me limited access to Disney.



#64 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 01:45 PM

It bears me repeating myself...  I see the AutoHop compromise as a win for Dish.  I never believed they could actually win long-term with it without paying for it through the nose...  so Dish using it as a tool to negotiate always made sense to me.  Without AutoHop, the negotiations would be "We want money" vs "We don't want to pay that much"...  With AutoHop the game was changed...  more nuances...  Dish might pay more money but skip commercials and then the channels lose that revenue source...  but Dish agrees to hold back the auto-skipping part for a few days so the channel can collect commercial revenue and it keeps the price down.

 

Some always have the "my bill went up, so thanks for nothing" response...  but you aren't seeing the whole elephant here.  You can't prove a negative... so there's no way to prove how much your bill might have gone up if the playing field were different.

 

I have always viewed AutoHop as a "cute" thing anyway...  I can skip commercials myself... I don't "need" an automatic feature to do it for me...  so it was a bonus to me... so I have no problems with them using it to get a better deal.  Whether they pass that "savings" directly to me or not, in the long run it does help keep their costs down which does translate to savings for me even if it isn't exactly quantifiable right now.


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#65 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 02:07 PM

 ABC will accept AutoHop after the C3 period ... apparently the value of those commercials has lessened after C3 - so it is a compromise. That is, until DISH and ABC work out a way to insert current ads in replayed ABC content. (That thought is also buried in the press release.)
 

I still don't see where one is forced to watch ABC/ESPN/Disney commercials on the DVR. The skip buttons will still work and AutoHop will work on ABC after C3.

 

Perhaps in my initial exasperation with the deal, I didn't express well and concisely my view of the long term, big picture meaning of this agreement. So let me begin again, first with the history.

 

It all began in the first half of the 20th Century with the 100% advertising-supported local broadcast channel model. Those channels were awarded licenses from the FCC to broadcast a signal over the public airwaves which viewers, after acquiring the right equipment, could view for free.

 

But in some areas, folks just couldn't get a decent signal. From Wikipedia:

 

The abbreviation CATV is often used for cable television. It originally stood for Community Access Television or Community Antenna Television, from cable television's origins in 1948: in areas where over-the-air reception was limited by distance from transmitters or mountainous terrain, large "community antennas" were constructed, and cable was run from them to individual homes.

 

So for about 25 years, some people paid the cable system the cost of obtaining the broadcast channels signals which much of the audience paid only for equipment like an antenna and a TV.

 

Then came the HBO "premium" channel model. This was a channel on cable systems only. The model was to charge a "high" subscriber fee in lieu of advertising to cover the cost of content. Per Wikipedia:

 

HBO is the oldest and longest continuously operating pay television service (basic or premium) in the United States, having been in operation since November 8, 1972.

 

Four years later Ted Turner added what we now know as the basic cable channel model - the channel we now know as TBS. That model theoretically and in practice included a very low subscriber fee most of which presumably went to the cost of cable delivery and advertising most of which presumably went to cover the cost of content. Of course, both revenue sources cumulatively were to help generate profits for the channel's owner and the cable company's owner.

 

Then, in 1992 the broadcast folks lobbied Congress to adopt the Cable Television Protection and Competition Act which established the "must carry" rule which seemed at worst innocuous and at best beneficial. It basically assured that all the competitors, satellite and cable, would carry all the local channels in each DMA. That set an expectation that ultimately resulted in retransmission fee disputes.

 

Since 2000, while chanting the mantra "greed is good" we've watched two international media conglomerates destroy this three-legged stool economic model - (1) ad supported FCC-licensed broadcast channels, (2) high fee subscription supported premium cable channels, and (3) low fee subscription plus advertising supported basic cable channels.

 

Before dealing with the two conglomerates let me first create a basis for comparison. HBO has not been given any government licenses. Cable/satellite customers do not have to pay for HBO in order to watch TV. I estimate that by around 2020, those who subscribe to HBO will pay to HBO about $5 billion a year for content they desire to watch and pay for.

 

Now on to the "greed is good" international conglomerates.

 

There's Rupert Murdoch's News Corp which noticed that the broadcast Fox Network wasn't making a satisfying amount of money from advertising. Welcome Americans to the high broadcast network "retransmission fee" which is basically a tax imposed on most Americans. You see, you and I cannot opt to watch HBO and Showtime without paying the tax to News Corp. And that tax will be relatively high by 2020 - generating for News Corp from the Fox Network and the 28 owned-and-operated local Fox and MyNetworkTV channels $4± billion annually, in addition to advertising which up to that point was to support the FCC license holders.

 

Then in the "greed is good" group there is The Walt Disney Company which owns not only the Disney cable channel group, but also the ESPN cable channel group and the ABC broadcast network plus 8 owned local ABC channels.

 

Dispensing with the broadcast-network-and-channel tax first, by around 2020 ABC will generate for The Walt Disney Company about $3± billion which we American capitalist ideologues will pay if we want to watch HBO and Showtime.

 

And here's the rub about the Dish-ABC deal. When we started paying the "free to air" FCC-licensed-taxpayer-subsidized broadcast channels as much as, or more than, we pay for cable channels, Charlie came up Autohop so it would be easy to not have to watch commercials. That seemed like a fair trade from the viewer standpoint. They get to keep their government licenses, we pay retransmission fees, and we don't even know there are commercials making them more like HBO.

 

The fact is Charlie just gave that viewer benefit away forever for all broadcast channels and for all cable channels.

 

But that wasn't enough taxation for the Disney Folks. My estimate is that by 2020 the ESPN content tax in the typical lowest package will generate $9± billion which we will pay if we want to watch HBO and Showtime.  Then there's the Disney Channel cable channel content tax which I estimate that by 2020 will generate $3± billion which we will pay if we want to watch HBO and Showtime. And we will see ads (nobody is fast enough with the FF or skip button to not see that there are ads).

 

Much is being made of the streaming deal, a really successful spin. This sounds really cool to the naive young generation. Let's go to the LA Times "Company Town" media conglomerate news page for a reality check that doesn't depend on my opinion:
 

 As part of the deal, Dish customers also will be able to access Disney-branded video-on-demand products, including the Watch ESPN and Watch ABC applications, in their homes and on mobile devices. Those offerings do not allow viewers to fast-forward through commercials, part of the industry's strategy of attempting to preserve the lucrative economics of television.

 

...But if and when it arrives, Dish's Internet service might look a lot like what Dish offers now — a set package of channels — and not the "a la carte" service that some consumer activists have been demanding from the industry.

 

"This is not a la carte in any way, shape or form," Bernstein & Co. media analyst Todd Juenger wrote in a report.

 

Nathanson agreed.

 

"No one is going to agree to provide their channels separately for an unbundled product," he said.

 

In other words, the agreement basically concedes that viewers will pay a lot - fees that could rival premium services like HBO - plus they'll have to put up with commercials. The agreement institutionalizes a new combined retransmission fee/ad viewing model with the "must-carry" taxation system fully incorporated.

 

And don't for one moment think this is not going to set the standard across the board. From that same article:
 

The Disney-Dish deal is expected to serve as a template for other entertainment companies haggling over new carriage agreements with pay-TV distributors.

 

At an investor conference Tuesday, CBS Chief Executive Leslie Moonves praised the Disney-Dish accord.

 

"This is a great preliminary step for everybody," Moonves said, adding that CBS is scheduled to negotiate a new distribution deal with Dish by the end of this year. "It's going to be an interesting conversation."

 

Let's not kid ourselves. In the long run, this deal is a win for international media conglomerates, not for Dish, and it is a significant loss for viewers, particularly Dish customers who lose the effectiveness of the Autohop feature.

 

 The multi-channel record feature PrimeTime AnyTime remains intact.

 

What the Hopper box offers is the ability to record three shows during about 21 hours of the day. Yes during the three prime time hours the you have the capability to record six shows, but this is a reality only if you are interested in everything on ABC, NBC, CBS, and Fox. That may or may not be competitive with a DVR that is capable of simultaneously recording any five programs at once at any time like the DirecTV Genie or four programs at once at any time plus an incredible on-demand streaming selection which does not get "charged" to your internet use like the Xfinity X1 Platform .

 

IMHO this deal is a major loss for Dish customers and for all viewers who would prefer (1) not to have to pay high monthly fees for channels they never watch and (2) not to pay high monthly fees for channels where they must deal with commercials. And by the way, it's a blow to Echostar's investment in Autohop that apparently nobody else recognizes.


Edited by phrelin, 05 March 2014 - 02:22 PM.

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#66 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 02:47 PM

Unless ...

http://www.dbstalk.c...thout-the-dish/

If Dish were to follow through with that, they would have no hardware costs at the subscriber end, so monthly rates could be somewhat lower.


See the article linked in Pherlins post.

That service is not going to be cheaper if it ever gets off the ground. And I mean in costs to provide as well as receive.

#67 OFFLINE   Orion9

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 03:13 PM

So let me begin again, first with the history.

You got me thinking about history and prices.

Using my (questionable) memory (and checking google to make sure I'm not way off base) our 25" color TV, external antenna, and antenna rotor in ~1963 plugged into an inflation calculator comes out to be around $5000 in today's dollars. For that we got CBS, ABC, NBC. (And years later PBS.) No remote control and if you wanted to channel surf, you had to wait for the rotor on the roof to realign the antenna. NO recording ability. (I did actually make some audio recordings of Star Trek.)

Around 1975ish we added cable, Now my memory of the cable bill is kind of fuzzy but I'm thinking it might have been $18. That works out to be around $75 today. We got a box that I think had 3 rows of 12 channels per row but many of those slots were unfilled or reserved for premium stuff. I think this got us about 14 usable channels - all with commercials. I think adding a single premium channel back then was about $10 or about $40 today. (That's one channel - not all of HBO.) We never did add any of those. In fact my father was never convinced of the price/performance of cable back then. Still no remote. No recording. Commercial skipping meant leave the room. Same 25" SD CRT. Same little mono speaker.

Somewhere around 1980ish we sunk a couple of grand (pre-inflation) into VCRs and "good" tapes were about $20 but the picture quality was still a huge step down from the original so you didn't really want to watch them. We had a different cable system back then. The Sci-Fi channel appeared in the 90s but it was nearly unwatchable here. The cable guy that came to investigate said: well sorry our cable system was designed for 36 channels so it's a miracle that channels in the high 40s get through at all. We switched to Dish a few years later.

Today we have a $700 46" HDTV and pay less than $60/month to get Discovery, History, SyFy, and about a dozen other channels that we watch on a fairly regular basis. Still no premiums. With the included DVR (that doesn't degrade the picture quality) and premium previews we may never manage to catch up with all the commercial-free movies we've stuck on cheap disks. We're currently nearly 5 terabytes behind! Commercial skipping is now: press the advance button about 5 or 6 times and then pop a couple more back/forwards as needed. I feel a little guilty and leach-like for doing this but, hey - I have limited time. ;)

Overall it doesn't seem all that awful compared to the old days. So far at least. The major problem these days is trying to keep up with the DVR. Just too many other activities these days like posting stuff on the interwebs. :)

Edited by Orion9, 05 March 2014 - 03:14 PM.


#68 OFFLINE   Stewart Vernon

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 03:59 PM

I never thought AutoHop had any real value except as a negotiation tool.  We can skip commercials on any channel with any DVR that Dish has.  AutoHop was a one-button solution, but it really didn't provide you with anything that you couldn't already do.  Heck, before DVRs you could go to the bathroom, get a snack from the kitchen, go check the mail, take a quick phone call, or have a short conversation, and ignore commercials.

 

To my way of thinking... Dish found a way with AutoHop to monetize this thing that viewers were already doing on their own... Prior to AutoHop there was no wedge for Dish to exploit in contract negotiations.  The channel would say "people want to watch us, pay for us or lose us and possibly lose customers"...  Dish responded with AutoHop and said "we will let them skip commercials more easily than before OR you can cut us a break"...

 

AutoHop, to my thinking, only had value in what it could head-off in contract negotiations.  It didn't otherwise provide you with something you couldn't do before.

 

PTAT, however, the auto-recording of primetime every night AND sharing a single tuner to record those 4 LiLs... THAT was a huge thing and a big feature for the Hopper...  That value still remains intact as do the Sling features for various Dish receivers.


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#69 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 04:35 PM

You got me thinking about history and prices.

 

Your observations are accurate based on my memory. And yes, current technology offers a lot of features and has created that same level of backlog on my EHD's. But to me what you are saying is "kind of" comparable to saying a basic refrigerator is so much cheaper (using comparable dollars) than in 1960 that it's ok if your monthly food bill is significantly more. And I do understand that in this context, the temptation is to say this is not about food it's only TV.

 

IMHO there's a cumulative pernicious side effect to the cumulative combination

That pernicious side effect can be defined as a cumulative impact upon those less fortunate. We are creating a class of people who do not have affordable, ready access to communication technology, some because they live in rural areas, some because they are poor, and some because they are the rural poor. If this technology wasn't critical to a young person's economic future, it would not be of concern. But the fact is if from the day you are born you can't get ready access to a phone, to high speed internet, and to television content, you're pretty much at a disadvantage.

 

I can afford to pay Comcast for high speed internet but am acutely aware it is my only real option. I can afford to use an alternative to copper wires for my home phone and have numerous options I am now considering. I can afford basic cable TV through a cable or satellite company and have three options, or I can choose to stream TV with numerous options available. In fact, In every way but total income, we are in that American upper middle class that can access all the essential, and a lot of non-essential, services and devices to keep us informed. It is fairly reasonable for me to think I probably will never experience the pernicious side effect. But it is a possibility for me and for anyone who is not a Warren Buffet.

 

IMHO we need a technology component to our economic safety net and we needed to put it in place before Netflix started putting servers in Comcast buildings.

 

But that is only my opinion.


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#70 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 04:47 PM

 AutoHop, to my thinking, only had value in what it could head-off in contract negotiations.  It didn't otherwise provide you with something you couldn't do before.

 

PTAT, however, the auto-recording of primetime every night AND sharing a single tuner to record those 4 LiLs... THAT was a huge thing and a big feature for the Hopper...  That value still remains intact as do the Sling features for various Dish receivers.

 

I've had a Slingbox HD for years and with my 722 and 612 can record those 4 channels, or any combination of 4 channels any time of day. Also, if my 722 goes haywire I still have the 612 until the new 722 gets here and vice versa. If one's Hopper dies you have to wait without TV until the new one arrives.

 

If the loss of Autohop can readily be dismissed because you can push the skip button over and over again as I do, so can not having that 4-channel autorecord feature be dismissed because I can just set the DVRs to record what I want by pressing buttons. And with the Hopper you have to press buttons to break up your recordings unless there is something I don't understand about it.

 

To me the only really desirable difference on the Hopper was the Autohop. But that's just my opinion.


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"Always poke the bears. They sleep too much for their own good."

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#71 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 05:24 PM

Let's not kid ourselves. In the long run, this deal is a win for international media conglomerates, not for Dish,


Perhaps you misunderstood ... DISH (and DirecTV and many of the cable operators) part of the international media conglomerates. This deal sets DISH up with a path into the future that does not rely on a dish. It isn't a battle of DISH vs the conglomerates ... it is a challenge of how the companies can work together to make money.

What the Hopper box offers is the ability to record three shows during about 21 hours of the day. Yes during the three prime time hours the you have the capability to record six shows, but this is a reality only if you are interested in everything on ABC, NBC, CBS, and Fox. That may or may not be competitive with a DVR that is capable of simultaneously recording any five programs at once at any time like the DirecTV Genie or four programs at once at any time plus an incredible on-demand streaming selection which does not get "charged" to your internet use like the Xfinity X1 Platform .


The four major networks can be recorded at any time of the day while using only one tuner for up to four networks. Even though it is outside of PTAT hours one can record or watch Kimmel, Letterman, Fallon and Arsenio at the same time ... or whatever those four channels are airing while leaving the other two tuners free.

If you think DirecTV has a better product we can provide the phone number to sign up. There is even a link at the top of every forum page for DISH and DirecTV. But don't expect anything different from the aspect of big bundles of channels where one buys channels they do not want to get channels they want. It is the nature of the industry.

And by the way, it's a blow to Echostar's investment in Autohop that apparently nobody else recognizes.


It is a limitation to Autohop ... but if one was watching same night programming that is no loss (AutoHop usually does not work until sometime after 1am). I like the feature and will continue to use it as long as it is available, but I have lived without it.
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#72 OFFLINE   Orion9

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 06:00 PM

Your observations are accurate based on my memory. And yes, current technology offers a lot of features and has created that same level of backlog on my EHD's. But to me what you are saying is "kind of" comparable to saying a basic refrigerator is so much cheaper (using comparable dollars) than in 1960 that it's ok if your monthly food bill is significantly more.


Yes, that's a fair assessment. Essentially I can buy an HDTV and watch about 7-8 years worth of Dish TV for what the TV alone cost in 63. And that's ignoring maintenance on the TV which was fairly frequent. (Tubes after-all.) And then the Dish bill today is like the cable bill of the 70s.

So the overall cost to be entertained (mostly) was pretty similar and the quality (from a technical standpoint - image/sound) is much greater now as is the variety.

I agree that the poor are at a disadvantage - always have been - and in general things seem to be getting noticeably worse for them. Likewise America has been falling behind in manufacturing - a common way for the poor to advance, schools are getting more expensive etc. etc. But I think that's an issue well beyond the scope of a satellite TV deal. Perhaps if we had a functional government, stuff like this could be addressed in some way.

#73 OFFLINE   phrelin

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 06:54 PM

Perhaps you misunderstood ... DISH (and DirecTV and many of the cable operators) part of the international media conglomerates. This deal sets DISH up with a path into the future that does not rely on a dish. It isn't a battle of DISH vs the conglomerates ... it is a challenge of how the companies can work together to make money.

 

While technically Dish is an international company, I do not see it as an international conglomerate in the way I view Disney/ESPN/ABC, Comcast/NBCU, and others. Yes, I recognize that Dish is creating a new "package selling" opportunity using the internet which might even turn out to be viewed a creative concept by some.

 

But Charlie was my last hope that folks who not watch sports and have no children in the home would have to pay nearly 20% of their TV package bill for ESPN and Disney Channel.

 

The four major networks can be recorded at any time of the day while using only one tuner for up to four networks. Even though it is outside of PTAT hours one can record or watch Kimmel, Letterman, Fallon and Arsenio at the same time ... or whatever those four channels are airing while leaving the other two tuners free.

 

Hmmm. I stand corrected. I apparently missed that PTAT isn't really limited to PT except for the AutoHop feature. I'd still be stuck having only three tuners for those hours when I now record four cable channel shows at the same time, but I guess I could chase down repeat airings that are common on cable channels. Now if they'd let me keep my 612 operating....


"In a hundred years there'll be a whole new set of people."
"Always poke the bears. They sleep too much for their own good."

"If you're good enough, they'll talk about you." - Tom Harmon
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#74 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 12:05 AM

While technically Dish is an international company, I do not see it as an international conglomerate in the way I view Disney/ESPN/ABC, Comcast/NBCU, and others. Yes, I recognize that Dish is creating a new "package selling" opportunity using the internet which might even turn out to be viewed a creative concept by some.


Multi-billion dollar companies ... not charities ... despite the comments of the leaders of the companies. DISH is a smaller multi-billion dollar company than DirecTV and the bigger content providers, but they are still huge companies.

Bringing package tiers to IPTV is not exactly an innovation (although CES may give DISH another best in show award for the offering :rolleyes: ). But it helps bridge the gap between the way the media companies like to sell their content (large bundles) and the new marketplace that wants mobile/portable content.

 

But Charlie was my last hope that folks who not watch sports and have no children in the home would have to pay nearly 20% of their TV package bill for ESPN and Disney Channel.


You're not the only one who believed Charlie when he said he was on our side. He isn't evil, but he is running a business.


Hmmm. I stand corrected. I apparently missed that PTAT isn't really limited to PT except for the AutoHop feature. I'd still be stuck having only three tuners for those hours when I now record four cable channel shows at the same time, but I guess I could chase down repeat airings that are common on cable channels. Now if they'd let me keep my 612 operating....


I remember having one TV in the home and no DVR/VCR. We watched what was on when it was on and compromised on channel selection. Eventually we got second or third TVs so others in the house could watch something else in another room. (Is the dividing of the family into separate viewing spaces part of the general downfall of the family? Is television really to blame for this social problem not because of the violence or evil suggesting content of the shows but simply because multiple TVs drives families into their own personal cocoon of programming?)

10 years ago we would have scoffed at people who complained that they could only record five or six things at the same time. 10 years ago being able to watch something while something else recorded on the same receiver was amazing! It seems that the more technology advances the less we enjoy it. :)
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#75 OFFLINE   acostapimps

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 12:49 AM

Funny some are saying that Dish blinked and caved on this deal,  So what if they didn't and started removing ABC/Disney and ESPN channels?  How you feel then?


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