Jump to content


Welcome to DBSTalk


Sign In 

Create Account
Welcome to DBSTalk. Our community covers all aspects of video delivery solutions including: Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS), Cable Television, and Internet Protocol Television (IPTV). We also have forums to discuss popular television programs, home theater equipment, and internet streaming service providers. Members of our community include experts who can help you solve technical problems, industry professionals, company representatives, and novices who are here to learn.

Like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community. Sign-up is a free and simple process that requires minimal information. Be a part of our community by signing in or creating an account. The Digital Bit Stream starts here!
  • Reply to existing topics or start a discussion of your own
  • Subscribe to topics and forums and get email updates
  • Send private personal messages (PM) to other forum members
  • Customize your profile page and make new friends
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo

DirecTV 4K UHD plans

DirecTV DTV 4k UHD

  • Please log in to reply
963 replies to this topic

#41 OFFLINE   SomeRandomIdiot

SomeRandomIdiot

    Godfather

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 1,191 posts
Joined: Jan 06, 2009

Posted 17 June 2014 - 12:55 AM

I was speaking in terms of the data delivery, but it wouldn't be a stretch to imagine an STB that was UHD capable in the very near future. To the best of my knowledge, the IPTV system is still in testing stage, but it is the long term plan as it helps ease the dependence on more and more bandwidth, only the requested channel(data) or channels(if more than one viewer) is sent down the line. 

 

The point that people are missing is if there is to be a new 4K UHD STB/IRD in the near future, regardless of the system, it would need to be in field tests now.

 

The whole thing is probably worse than HD was in 2000-2005 with lack of HDMI etc, as Panasonic UHDs out now CANNOT playback Netflix 4k - and see above (HDR) which might obsolete all UHD panels by 2017-2018.



...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#42 OFFLINE   mkdtv21

mkdtv21

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 229 posts
Joined: May 26, 2007

Posted 17 June 2014 - 02:20 AM

I'm just curious if and when Directv will bring uhd broadcasts, will it provide dolby digital truehd or just digital plus 7.1. Since there will be so much bandwidth required for the broadcast maybe we will finally get lossless audio or the addition of 7.1 surround would be nice too even if it's lossy.



#43 OFFLINE   inkahauts

inkahauts

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 16,195 posts
Joined: Nov 13, 2006

Posted 17 June 2014 - 02:41 AM

The HR44 cannot do UHD output.


Why and how do we know? Just point me to a post if I missed the explanation of how that was figured out. We didn't think the hrs could do 1080p or 3d and yet most did. It's not all that far fetched to think there's a chance a hr44 can. I wouldn't think any others could buy an hr44 is new enough it just might have the hardware to do it. It's very very different than an HR34 IMHO.

And that ad... I'll have to go by best buy and see it for myself. That's a bit beyond ridiculous IMHO. No one should advertise content till they have it.

#44 OFFLINE   SomeRandomIdiot

SomeRandomIdiot

    Godfather

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 1,191 posts
Joined: Jan 06, 2009

Posted 17 June 2014 - 04:53 AM

Why and how do we know? Just point me to a post if I missed the explanation of how that was figured out. We didn't think the hrs could do 1080p or 3d and yet most did. It's not all that far fetched to think there's a chance a hr44 can. I wouldn't think any others could buy an hr44 is new enough it just might have the hardware to do it. It's very very different than an HR34 IMHO.

And that ad... I'll have to go by best buy and see it for myself. That's a bit beyond ridiculous IMHO. No one should advertise content till they have it.

 

Look at the chipset in use for the HDMI output and look at it's specs.



#45 OFFLINE   SomeRandomIdiot

SomeRandomIdiot

    Godfather

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 1,191 posts
Joined: Jan 06, 2009

Posted 17 June 2014 - 05:10 AM

Total speculation based on thinking about this for 2 days.

 

According to DirecTV, certain Samsung 2011 HDTV models (D6000, D6400 and D6420) are RVU compliant. All 2012 & 2013 Samsung SMART TVs are RVU compliant. 

 

The 2014 Samsung UHDTVs are SMART TVs, so it seems logical that these Samsung TVs would need to run as an RVU over the network to get 4K programming, bypassing HDMI UHD Color connection.

 

It would seem most likely that this would not support a linear channel (though I could be wrong), but only streaming 4K VOD using the Genie as a passthru for internet data, as HEVC is not available in the Genie, unless DirecTV plans to use .h264 for linear channels, which I doubt they have the bandwidth to use (but they could surprise us I guess).

 

Given ESPN was burned on 3D, as was DirecTV, I imagine they will be more conservative in UHD linear channels this time.



#46 OFFLINE   dpeters11

dpeters11

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 13,501 posts
  • LocationCincinnati
Joined: May 30, 2007

Posted 17 June 2014 - 05:19 AM

I don't think 3D and UHD are comparable. 3D failed for reasons that don't apply here.


  • Rich likes this

#47 OFFLINE   Diana C

Diana C

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 1,952 posts
  • LocationNew Jersey
Joined: Mar 30, 2007

Posted 17 June 2014 - 07:33 AM

'YouTube and Netflix currently have UHD content available to stream. You need to have between 11MB and 15MB internet connection for the UHD content to stream properly...

 

The average broadband speed (including businesses) in the US is still under 10 Mbits/second, so most people can't stream 4K.


Dish Network Customer from 9/1998-11/2001
DirecTV Customer 10/2001 - 7/2014

FiOS TV/TiVo Customer since 6/2014
Moderator, DBSDish.com 1999-2000
Co-Founder and Administrator, DBSForums.com 2000-2006

Current setup:
DirecTV: HR34-700 (1TB) / HR24-100 (1TB) / HR24-500 (1TB) / HR21-700 (320GB) / HR21-100 (1TB) / 2 H25s / C41-500 / SWiM16 / Nomad / CCK

FiOS: 2 Tivo Roamio Pros (6 TB total) / 5 Tivo Minis attached via MOCA


#48 OFFLINE   Rich

Rich

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 21,388 posts
  • LocationPiscataway, NJ
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Posted 17 June 2014 - 07:43 AM

The average broadband speed (including businesses) in the US is still under 10 Mbits/second, so most people can't stream 4K.

 

Well, perhaps a 4K revolution will cause that to be fixed.  Hey, you never know til you try.  

 

Rich



#49 OFFLINE   peds48

peds48

    🙈🙉🙊📡

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 12,292 posts
  • LocationLong Island, NY
Joined: Jan 10, 2008

Posted 17 June 2014 - 07:56 AM

Well, perhaps a 4K revolution will cause that to be fixed. Hey, you never know til you try.

Rich

this takes more than Just a "fix"


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Here’s to the crazy ones.
The misfits. The rebels.
The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


Think Differently 

#50 OFFLINE   slice1900

slice1900

    AllStar

  • Registered
  • 2,940 posts
  • LocationIowa
Joined: Feb 14, 2013

Posted 17 June 2014 - 08:48 AM

If people were surprised that Directv receivers were able to do 3D and 1080p before Directv announced it, they probably weren't aware that those features were included in pretty much every HDMI chipset available for years before that.

 

This isn't the case with either h.265 or HDMI 2.0 support (I think they're going to want HDMI 2.0 to support the full 60 fps frame rate with 4K) Neither was available in chipsets when the HR44 was designed. Unless Directv is implementing a half ass version of 4K using MPEG4 compression and 24fps output just to say they're "first" and make the HR44 the HR10 of the 4K world, the HR44 can't do 4K.


SL5, PI-6S, SA-6AL 3xSWM16, 21 H20-100, 1 H20-600, 7 H24-700/AM21


#51 OFFLINE   GregLee

GregLee

    Hall Of Fame

  • Registered
  • 1,617 posts
Joined: Dec 28, 2005

Posted 17 June 2014 - 09:13 AM

Not following you.

 

Dolby Vision is built into the panel....not the STB.

 

 

No, Dolby Vision is built into everything.  In Dolby's phraseology, it is an end-to-end project for greater visual fidelity, requiring of panels greater color depth, wider gamut, and higher brightness.  It requires new processing methods and standards in the movie-making business (it has sponsered the first Dolby Vision movie master of the movie Chicago), new equipment in theaters, new broadcast TV methods for the extra information about brightness and color, new set top boxes to get the enhanced video signals to users' TVs, new blu-ray specs to record the enhanced signals.

 

Dolby Vision is a big, big project.  Google "Dolby Vision".


Greg

#52 OFFLINE   WB4CS

WB4CS

    Legend

  • Registered
  • 128 posts
  • LocationHuntsville, AL
Joined: Dec 12, 2013

Posted 17 June 2014 - 10:45 AM

The average broadband speed (including businesses) in the US is still under 10 Mbits/second, so most people can't stream 4K.

 

 

Well, perhaps a 4K revolution will cause that to be fixed.  Hey, you never know til you try.  

 

Rich

 

Oh sure, it can be fixed. But at a cost. 

 

Unlimited data is almost gone now. I've got a 15 Mbits/second pipeline but a 250GB a month data cap. I could get 30 Mbits if I wanted, with a 350GB a month cap. I think it's about $10 per 1GB over on your bill. 

 

It's one thing to get more people to upgrade to 15+Mbits data for streaming 4K, but it's another thing to change the way ISP's serve up their data. Many ISP's are also TV providers, so they're not going to give you unlimited streaming of 4K unless it's coming from them. 

 

This is the world without net neutrality. You want to stream Netflix or DirecTV 4K? No problem, but it will cost you another $100/mo and you can only stream 200GB a month. Oh, don't like that? Well switch to our digital cable TV package and we'll give you unlimited 4K streaming from our own library. It only costs $199 a month!

 

Again, my opinion is 4K is nothing more than a fad like 3D. Or 4K will be what Laserdisc was in the 1980s - For people with lots of money and high end home theater systems. The average Joe watching Fox News or reruns of "How I Met Your Mother" are not going to care about 4K. 


  • Sackchamp56, Tubaman-Z and fireponcoal like this

#53 OFFLINE   dpeters11

dpeters11

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 13,501 posts
  • LocationCincinnati
Joined: May 30, 2007

Posted 17 June 2014 - 10:57 AM

this takes more than Just a "fix"


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Hopefully more will offer really high speed Internet. Last night I mentioned to my wife that while I don't know that Gigabit really makes sense for most and I'm probably not going to subscribe to that tier, it will hopefully drop the price of the lower tiers. Google fiber is helping, and it's not just those markets where they have put in service.



#54 OFFLINE   SomeRandomIdiot

SomeRandomIdiot

    Godfather

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 1,191 posts
Joined: Jan 06, 2009

Posted 17 June 2014 - 02:17 PM

No, Dolby Vision is built into everything.  In Dolby's phraseology, it is an end-to-end project for greater visual fidelity, requiring of panels greater color depth, wider gamut, and higher brightness.  It requires new processing methods and standards in the movie-making business (it has sponsered the first Dolby Vision movie master of the movie Chicago), new equipment in theaters, new broadcast TV methods for the extra information about brightness and color, new set top boxes to get the enhanced video signals to users' TVs, new blu-ray specs to record the enhanced signals.

 

Dolby Vision is a big, big project.  Google "Dolby Vision".

 

Well aware of what it is. There is the stripped down version that gives better Contrast on Dolby Vision sets (which was shown late last decade) and a total turnkey which 4 Companies are fighting for inclusion of the Second Generation UHD ITU standards (HDR) which I referenced above.

 

That is why I am saying you can not just plug in an external unit to make any display do Dolby Vision as the contrast control of the panel is the most crucial part.



#55 OFFLINE   SomeRandomIdiot

SomeRandomIdiot

    Godfather

  • Topic Starter
  • Registered
  • 1,191 posts
Joined: Jan 06, 2009

Posted 17 June 2014 - 02:25 PM

If people were surprised that Directv receivers were able to do 3D and 1080p before Directv announced it, they probably weren't aware that those features were included in pretty much every HDMI chipset available for years before that.

 

This isn't the case with either h.265 or HDMI 2.0 support (I think they're going to want HDMI 2.0 to support the full 60 fps frame rate with 4K) Neither was available in chipsets when the HR44 was designed. Unless Directv is implementing a half ass version of 4K using MPEG4 compression and 24fps output just to say they're "first" and make the HR44 the HR10 of the 4K world, the HR44 can't do 4K.

 

Winner, Winner, Chicken Dinner.

 

However, you cannot output 1920x1080 from a STB/IRD and get UHD resolution, so no way to even half ass it.

 

3D was easy using side by side that still used a 1920x1080 output. The STB/IRD just passed the 1920x1080 side by side signal to the TV (or 3D Adapter in Mitsubishi's case) which did all the heavy lifting.

 

The H20-100 can do 3D technically for this reason, the chip just had issues with the HDCP standard which is why 3D was not allowed on the H20-100. All the other units had chips that supported HDCP, so it was allowed.


Edited by SomeRandomIdiot, 17 June 2014 - 02:31 PM.


#56 OFFLINE   keenan

keenan

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 531 posts
Joined: Feb 08, 2005

Posted 17 June 2014 - 03:45 PM

Why and how do we know? Just point me to a post if I missed the explanation of how that was figured out. We didn't think the hrs could do 1080p or 3d and yet most did. It's not all that far fetched to think there's a chance a hr44 can. I wouldn't think any others could buy an hr44 is new enough it just might have the hardware to do it. It's very very different than an HR34 IMHO.

And that ad... I'll have to go by best buy and see it for myself. That's a bit beyond ridiculous IMHO. No one should advertise content till they have it.

6q18.jpg



#57 OFFLINE   dpeters11

dpeters11

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 13,501 posts
  • LocationCincinnati
Joined: May 30, 2007

Posted 17 June 2014 - 06:47 PM

That's a pretty big asterisk.



#58 OFFLINE   keenan

keenan

    Godfather

  • Registered
  • 531 posts
Joined: Feb 08, 2005

Posted 17 June 2014 - 07:25 PM

That's a pretty big asterisk.

Haha, yes it certainly is!



#59 OFFLINE   inkahauts

inkahauts

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 16,195 posts
Joined: Nov 13, 2006

Posted 17 June 2014 - 11:03 PM

Total speculation based on thinking about this for 2 days.

 

According to DirecTV, certain Samsung 2011 HDTV models (D6000, D6400 and D6420) are RVU compliant. All 2012 & 2013 Samsung SMART TVs are RVU compliant. 

 

The 2014 Samsung UHDTVs are SMART TVs, so it seems logical that these Samsung TVs would need to run as an RVU over the network to get 4K programming, bypassing HDMI UHD Color connection.

 

It would seem most likely that this would not support a linear channel (though I could be wrong), but only streaming 4K VOD using the Genie as a passthru for internet data, as HEVC is not available in the Genie, unless DirecTV plans to use .h264 for linear channels, which I doubt they have the bandwidth to use (but they could surprise us I guess).

 

Given ESPN was burned on 3D, as was DirecTV, I imagine they will be more conservative in UHD linear channels this time.

 

I actually expect them to start off 4k similar to how they did with hd.  Only a few channels and with MPEG4.  They will have the room with the bss sats.  five channels will not be that hard to set up.

 

I will have to figure out how to figure out what chipsets it uses.  I have never seen that actually published.  People always just say what it is but never cite any source that I have seen. I miss half the posts though, so Im not surprised I missed it. :)

 

And I see no reason they couldn't do it vod and have you download it to the genie, and then play it via rvu as you suggest.  That would allow them to start offering 4k extremely soon, tomorrow if they wanted really.



#60 OFFLINE   inkahauts

inkahauts

    Hall Of Fame

  • DBSTalk Club
  • 16,195 posts
Joined: Nov 13, 2006

Posted 17 June 2014 - 11:06 PM

They better have actual written statements that say that's not a lie that they are going to offer it too!







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: DirecTV, DTV, 4k, UHD

Protected By... spam firewall...And...