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Ethernet - do I need it connected or not?


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43 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   Steve Rhodes

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 12:29 PM

I have 1 HR34 and 4 HR24s. Two of the HR24s have hardwired Ethernet attached while 2 of the HR24s and the HR34 do not. I am having connectivity issues with the Whole Home.

 

Do I need the Ethernet connected or not? 



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#2 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 12:42 PM

The only unit you can connect directly to Ethernet in this system is your HR34. You can not connect your hr24s directly to Ethernet. Unplug them and reboot them. If you cannot connect your HR34 directly, then you must get a DIRECTV Wired Broadband Internet Connection Kit to connect the system to the Internet.

All this does assume you are using a single dish and a swim16 to connect all your system as well,which is what you should be using.

Oh and you don't need Internet to use Whole Home Service, but you do for all the on demand and other he extra stuff that's available on the all the DVRs.

#3 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 01:08 PM

The only unit you can connect directly to Ethernet in this system is your HR34. You can not connect your hr24s directly to Ethernet.

These are both false statements. You can, as an alternative to the built-in DECA, choose to connect via CAT5.

If it was the TS's intention to use DECA, your disconnect and reboot advice is required to switch to DECA.
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#4 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 02:01 PM

I'm right, his system as implemented needs to have Ethernet disconnected form two units. Then rebooted those dvrs. I did not feel the need to explain in dire detail why that is so, it's not what he asked. He asked a simple question, I gave him a simple answer that will satisfy what he needs to do. Find someone in the dish threads to confuse.
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#5 OFFLINE   lugnutathome

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 02:58 PM

OK. As was initially replied undoing the Ethernet connection from the two that have it and rebooting will rest these to use DECA like the other units already are.

If there are some considerations where these units need be on the switched Ethernet fabric this is possible but complex and not supported.

I run dual SWM16s and have one running a DECA cloud and the other provides service to systems on a switched Ethernet fabric. These two network fabrics bridge transparently through the wireless internet connection kit (running wired only) into a centralized backbone switch. This is not an official configuration and the two fabrics must be completely isolated from one another (with respect to the DECA band frequencies) so they bridge at the single point.

If you have reasons why the two 24s cannot be on the DECA fabric (amplified leg due to excessive length as an example) I can help you privately. But unless you have truly mitigating circumstances, putting them all on the DECA fabric REALLY is your best option!

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#6 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 04:02 PM

These are both false statements. You can, as an alternative to the built-in DECA, choose to connect via CAT5.

If it was the TS's intention to use DECA, your disconnect and reboot advice is required to switch to DECA.

False statements?  Perhaps on Dish Network world.  I let the TS decide if he wants to "listen" to a person who has never have DirecTV® or to one that had had the DirecTV® service for many years.........


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#7 OFFLINE   Drucifer

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 05:41 PM

I have 1 HR34 and 4 HR24s. Two of the HR24s have hardwired Ethernet attached while 2 of the HR24s and the HR34 do not. I am having connectivity issues with the Whole Home.
 
Do I need the Ethernet connected or not?

 

You can't mix & match whole home - it's either all Ethernet or all Coax

 

Plug the Ethernet into the HR34 as Genies are the only HR that have an internal bridge. Or you need to get a DECA/CCK to connect to your home LAN.


Edited by Drucifer, 26 July 2014 - 05:44 PM.

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#8 ONLINE   dennisj00

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 05:58 PM

You can't mix & match whole home - it's either all Ethernet or all Coax

 

 

Our friend Lugnut would disagree with you . . . you can have boxes on Ethernet or the DECA cloud easily.   You just have to know what you're doing.


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#9 OFFLINE   Drucifer

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 06:06 PM

But getting it work faultlessly with DirecTV flaky software is the big Q.

 

You want faultlessly - follow the KISS principle.


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#10 OFFLINE   lugnutathome

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 06:49 PM

It is actually transparent Drew. In order for the "legacy" equipment to work with adapters it has to be the same packets. Smart TVs and the RVU push pretty much ensure that standard will be adhered to going forward.

The interconnection issues arise as most service techs let alone home subscribers do not fully understand what they need to know to make the hybrid beast work. I was brain dead in that matter when I started. switched Ethernet was just fine thank you. Why go back to networking's stone age on coax? :) Actually a complete end to end infrastructure they control and manage is great logic! OMG. My internal dash light came on. :)

People here edumacated me as did my network engineers at work and as such I have a unique understanding of the rules for doing what I have had to do to make my Hacienda del Toro abode work as I want. I'm still no expert on the technical how it works but I get the logical and that is enough.

I am with your thinking for everyone's home deployment though. Unless they have a "Winchester house" like mine. Use what is supported. And if someone has a deployment like mine well I am glad to share what all of you have shared with me.

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#11 OFFLINE   Doug Brott

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 07:27 PM

These are both false statements. You can, as an alternative to the built-in DECA, choose to connect via CAT5.

If it was the TS's intention to use DECA, your disconnect and reboot advice is required to switch to DECA.


Most likely this installation involves a SWM-16 due to the number of tuners in the system. A proper installation would also add a DECA for connection to the Internet. The use of CAT-5 in this situation, while noble, would require one to (1) know what they are doing and (2) go against prescribed installation requirements.

Since the pain point is MRV (whole home), the proper answer is to disconnect all Ethernet connections and restart all receveivers. Whole Home should start working right away (assuming no other oddities in the coax connectivity). To also enable Internet features, a DECA connection would be added.

As stated many times in the past, while CAT5 may work .. it's really not the right way to go for these installations. Bringing it up time and time again only distracts from best practices.
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#12 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 07:53 PM

You can't mix & match whole home - it's either all Ethernet or all Coax

 

 

 

 

Our friend Lugnut would disagree with you . . . you can have boxes on Ethernet or the DECA cloud easily.   

Depends, connect two Genies on ethernet and you have yourself a network loop


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#13 OFFLINE   lugnutathome

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 08:25 PM

Would that be true if there was no secondary DECA connection involved? Seems to me both Genies would function normally on a switched network as long as they weren't also towing DECA networking as well.

Again, I think it could work but it is so far out of standard and for absolutely everyone rather dumb to try:)

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Depends, connect two Genies on ethernet and you have yourself a network loop


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#14 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 08:28 PM

Would that be true if there was no secondary DECA connection involved? Seems to me both Genies would function normally on a switched network as long as they weren't also towing DECA networking as well.

Again, I think it could work but it is so far out of standard and for absolutely everyone rather dumb to try:)

Don "I certainly ain't tryin it thats for sure" Bolton
 

Keep in mind that there is no way to disable the DECA on the Genies, is always ON.  It happened to my two HR44s.  Granted, I did not seem to see any errors on my network, but they reported "network loop" under the "more system info" screen with an exclamation point


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They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


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#15 OFFLINE   lugnutathome

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 08:30 PM

BS filter isolate one Genie to just Ethernet and let the other manage DECA.

Don " Not that I am recommending this" Bolton

Keep in mind that there is no way to disable the DECA on the Genies, is always ON.  It happened to my two HR44s.  Granted, I did not seem to see any errors on my network, but they reported "network loop" under the "more system info" screen with an exclamation point


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#16 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 08:45 PM

BS filter isolate one Genie to just Ethernet and let the other manage DECA.

Don " Not that I am recommending this" Bolton
 

Right, but that would mean going to the van to grab one of these bad boys, I just did the easiest thing, unplug ethernet from one of the Genies.  I was just trying to "illustrate" a point.


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Here’s to the crazy ones.
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The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


Think Differently 

#17 OFFLINE   lugnutathome

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 08:55 PM

Gotchya!

(My spare parts shelves down by the wall-o-SWMs is likely like the stash in one's service truck. As I run a non supportable commercial scale installation on a residential account I have amassed a complete set of replacements fron the slope equalizer down through the SWMs themselves) I wish that on nobody :)

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Right, but that would mean going to the van to grab one of these bad boys, I just did the easiest thing, unplug ethernet from one of the Genies.  I was just trying to "illustrate" a point.


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#18 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 09:00 PM

Hybrid can be done but it's complex and not at all recommend becasue there's virtually no advantage unless you have a massive system.

#19 OFFLINE   peds48

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 09:02 PM

Hybrid can be done but it's complex and not at all recommend becasue there's virtually no advantage unless you have a massive system.

This ^ we can agree on...


Here’s to the crazy ones.
The misfits. The rebels.
The the troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things different.
They’re not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo.


Think Differently 

#20 OFFLINE   lugnutathome

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 09:28 PM

YUP!

This ^ we can agree on...


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#21 OFFLINE   Drucifer

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 09:29 PM

I don't how we got to two Genies, when DirecTV current policy is not allow two. But when they do, it will probably be setup by DirecTV field techs. The Q  is just how many of them wont know how to do a dual setup correctly.


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#22 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 11:40 PM

If it's a swim16 it will be no different than what they do today. It will be simple.

#23 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 04:41 PM

I'm right, his system as implemented needs to have Ethernet disconnected form two units.

Does your monthly bill tell you how the TS's system was initially set up or is it communicated telepathically, subliminally or via e-mail to interested DIRECTV subscribers?

You claimed that only a Genie could be connected to the router via Ethernet or WHDS would not work. That claim is false. As peds pointed out, the caveat is that there should only be one DECA bridge in the system to avoid error messages.

You also claimed that HR24s could not be connected to the LAN via Ethernet and that claim, taken at face value, is also false.

In both cases, as you later admitted, hybrid systems may indeed work just fine. Whether or not the system works is largely independent of what is supported or recommended as the MRV testing phase proved.

He asked a simple question, I gave him a simple answer that will satisfy what he needs to do.

Regrettably you offered reasoning that was technically untrue. Policy, recommendations or common practice should not be construed as being immutable laws of Physics.

The simple answer is that it should have worked the way it was set up and maybe the system just needed a reboot. Converting to DECA may or may not ultimately fix the issues but it would be another, albeit somewhat more involved, troubleshooting step to try.
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#24 OFFLINE   inkahauts

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 06:01 PM

Does your monthly bill tell you how the TS's system was initially set up or is it communicated telepathically, subliminally or via e-mail to interested DIRECTV subscribers?

You claimed that only a Genie could be connected to the router via Ethernet or WHDS would not work. That claim is false. As peds pointed out, the caveat is that there should only be one DECA bridge in the system to avoid error messages.

You also claimed that HR24s could not be connected to the LAN via Ethernet and that claim, taken at face value, is also false.

In both cases, as you later admitted, hybrid systems may indeed work just fine. Whether or not the system works is largely independent of what is supported or recommended as the MRV testing phase proved.
Regrettably you offered reasoning that was technically untrue. Policy, recommendations or common practice should not be construed as being immutable laws of Physics.

The simple answer is that it should have worked the way it was set up and maybe the system just needed a reboot. Converting to DECA may or may not ultimately fix the issues but it would be another, albeit somewhat more involved, troubleshooting step to try.

 

 

Again, everything i said was right.  YOU need to stop.  He wanted a simple solution, I gave it to him.  You are trying to say I am wrong simply because you can try to, not because you should or that I am wrong.  The fact that it can be hooked up in a hybrid way was also discussed and I even chimed in on that.  Everyone but you knows I was right about what the OP should do, regardless of your incessant rattling of trying to say otherwise.

 

He would have to do a lot more work to make a hybrid system work, including likely buying additional equipment, to bypass the way the system is made to work that would work right by simply unplugging his two hr2xs. But from a dish customer, its not surprising you would tell him you can and should maybe do it the hard way.

 

And if you opened your eyes and read this line that I had in the post, it ruins your taken at face value nonsense...  "All this does assume you are using a single dish and a swim16 to connect all your system as well,which is what you should be using." you would realize I made it specific to those conditions."

 

All my reasoning was absolutely technically true and perfectly accurate. 

 

And what the heck are you rambling about physics and such?  

 

You really need to leave this directv forum because you are either wrong or telling peopel to do things the hard way, or far more complex way, and passing misinformation to way to many people when you say things like that. And its just sad that you are trying to do this to people who deserve good help.



#25 OFFLINE   JimAtTheRez

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 08:01 PM

So, the bottom line is that should only have ethernet hooked to my Genie, and let the DECA part handle the rest on the whole home setup?  If so, that would explain why I can't see two of my HR24's on my whole home setup.  Thanks in advance.


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