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Superdish and Poor man Superdish


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125 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   alebowgm

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Posted 12 June 2004 - 10:04 PM

Hey,

Hopefully you can help me. I have been doing a lot of reading but I still have 2 pretty basic questions that hopefully you can fill me in on

1) What is the Poor Man Superdish many people here are refering to?
2) In regards to the actual Dish Network Superdish, what is the Difference between Superdish3, Superdish4 and Superdish Full (as it says in my 2800 Dish Pointing Screen)? Is there a DNET Superdish forthcomming that will be able to recieve 105,110,119 and 121 (and if not, wouldnt that make scense especially if they aren't coming out with an equivalent to a Legacy/DP-300 Dish?)?

Thanx

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#2 OFFLINE   Mike123abc

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Posted 12 June 2004 - 11:03 PM

Well poor man's superdish is using a regular Ku satellite dish to pick up 105 or 121. With a switch 64 you can feed 119, 110, plus either 105 or 121 to 4 recievers (or 8 if you get fancy). It is not a dish pro solution, but since a lot of people had old dishes lying around with standard Ku-FSS LNBs (like primestar) dishes they were able to just hook it up and get it to work without having to have superdish installations (this saves the commitment and waits, you can just have your locals turned on instantely by Dish).

If you are not handy with dishes and do not want to be bothered by it, I would reccomend taking dish up in their free install with a programming commitment. If you want to play around with it, have some adventure and fun, and have a dish lying around or can arrange to get one, go for it. You can always just call for the SuperDish if you get in over your head. It took me about 15 minutes to mount the dish but took me a long time to get it locked in on 105. You can read all about my experience with photos at http://www.dbstalk.c...ead.php?t=20648

Maybe someday Dish will release a Ku-FSS LNB that is DishPro. If they do that you could put up 2 Ku-FSS dishes and use DPP44 to get all 4 sats at once. You can kind of do it with SW64/SW21 as I did in the above post, but it has its limits.

#3 OFFLINE   larrystotler

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Posted 13 June 2004 - 08:16 AM

I wonder if a dishpro adapter can be used in reverse?

#4 OFFLINE   SimpleSimon

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Posted 13 June 2004 - 10:20 AM

I wonder if a dishpro adapter can be used in reverse?

I could be wrong, but I think a DP Adapter is a voltage-switched unstacker. No way to reverse it.

I'm thinking you want a device that will stack the transponders so the LNBF output looks like DishPro. That sounds doable, and a stacker already exists - but I don't know if it's stacking method is the same as DishPro's.
"I agreed with Bogy thrice in 5353 posts. That means he's wrong 99.94% of the time."
----------
DishDVR 921, B: 120B, F: F051, V: L211HECD-N@04-Dec-07, L212@05-Mar-01, L213@Apr-01, L215@Jun-29, L216@Jul-23, L218@Jul-28, L219@Aug-11, L270@Sep-14, L272@Oct-28, L273@Dec-08, L274@Mar-08, L275@Mar-23, L276HECD-N@06-Mar-31.
DP-Twin=110/119, DP Single=148, into a DP34, DP Dual=61.5, into DP21s to add 61.5

#5 OFFLINE   Mike123abc

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Posted 13 June 2004 - 10:46 AM

I could be wrong, but I think a DP Adapter is a voltage-switched unstacker. No way to reverse it.

I'm thinking you want a device that will stack the transponders so the LNBF output looks like DishPro. That sounds doable, and a stacker already exists - but I don't know if it's stacking method is the same as DishPro's.


It is close, but I do not think close enough... Too bad dish does not come out with a stacker like this that is compatible with DP, it seems like it could solve a lot of problems for them.

From Dish: http://www.dishnetwo...ochure_3-03.PDF

• Bandstacking (950-2150 MHz): combines the signals onto a single cable. The odd transponders are in the 950 to 1450 MHz frequency range; the even transponders are in the 1650 to 2150 MHz frequency range. Bandstacking simplifies installations by using only one cable per orbital location to an external switch.

From Sonora: http://www.sonorades.../Spec_uS575.pdf
Gain (odd transponders 950-1450 <Hz) ........................ 2 dB
Gain (even transponders 1550 to 2050 <Hz) ................ 6 dB

The even transponders are off by 100mhz

#6 OFFLINE   SimpleSimon

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Posted 13 June 2004 - 11:08 AM

Mike: I missed that - thanks for the info, as bumming out tho it is.

Maybe someone should talk to Sonora Design. :)
"I agreed with Bogy thrice in 5353 posts. That means he's wrong 99.94% of the time."
----------
DishDVR 921, B: 120B, F: F051, V: L211HECD-N@04-Dec-07, L212@05-Mar-01, L213@Apr-01, L215@Jun-29, L216@Jul-23, L218@Jul-28, L219@Aug-11, L270@Sep-14, L272@Oct-28, L273@Dec-08, L274@Mar-08, L275@Mar-23, L276HECD-N@06-Mar-31.
DP-Twin=110/119, DP Single=148, into a DP34, DP Dual=61.5, into DP21s to add 61.5

#7 OFFLINE   alebowgm

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Posted 13 June 2004 - 05:54 PM

How big would suggest that the KU Band Dish be with a KU FSS LNB? I was doing some reading and someone was saying they were unable to get a signal with their 18' Pizza Dish, that was using a KU FSS instead of a KU DSS.

I have a bunch of 18' dishes just sitting around, if I were to go get a KU FSS LNB, would it work or do I need something bigger?

#8 OFFLINE   SimpleSimon

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Posted 13 June 2004 - 06:18 PM

An 18" dish is going to be problematic. Might you get a signal? Yes, until it looks like it might rain 2 or 3 states away. :D

If I remember right, the old Primestar dishes were FSS - at least they're big enough to be used for it.

P.S. To avoid confusion, single-quote means feet, double-quote means inches. :)
"I agreed with Bogy thrice in 5353 posts. That means he's wrong 99.94% of the time."
----------
DishDVR 921, B: 120B, F: F051, V: L211HECD-N@04-Dec-07, L212@05-Mar-01, L213@Apr-01, L215@Jun-29, L216@Jul-23, L218@Jul-28, L219@Aug-11, L270@Sep-14, L272@Oct-28, L273@Dec-08, L274@Mar-08, L275@Mar-23, L276HECD-N@06-Mar-31.
DP-Twin=110/119, DP Single=148, into a DP34, DP Dual=61.5, into DP21s to add 61.5

#9 OFFLINE   larrystotler

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Posted 13 June 2004 - 08:30 PM

FSS Sats are medium powered. I know that DBS is 50 Watts, but not sure what the FSS is. It's also a lower freq. The higher the freq, the smaller the signal. Starband and Directway both us FSS for there systems, and both use a 36x24 eliptical dish(sizes may vary depending on model). A P* dish would work if you had the right coordinates. Remeber that you have to ajust the barrel for the particular polarity as well as the azmuth and elevation. I'm getting ready to try that out here near DC. When I get the right specs, I will post.

#10 OFFLINE   Mike123abc

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Posted 13 June 2004 - 09:17 PM

FSS Sats are medium powered. I know that DBS is 50 Watts, but not sure what the FSS is. It's also a lower freq. The higher the freq, the smaller the signal. Starband and Directway both us FSS for there systems, and both use a 36x24 eliptical dish(sizes may vary depending on model). A P* dish would work if you had the right coordinates. Remeber that you have to ajust the barrel for the particular polarity as well as the azmuth and elevation. I'm getting ready to try that out here near DC. When I get the right specs, I will post.


Some of the Dish satellites (E6-8) can put out 240+ watts per transponder. FSS like the new echostar 9 put out 120 watts per channel. It is the spacing between the satellites that dictates the larger dish size for Ku-FSS. Ku-FSS has satellites spaced 2 degrees apart, the larger dish focuses on a smaller section of the sky. Ku-DBS are spaced 9 degrees apart.

#11 OFFLINE   Mike123abc

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Posted 13 June 2004 - 09:20 PM

Mike: I missed that - thanks for the info, as bumming out tho it is.

Maybe someone should talk to Sonora Design. :)



Yeah I finally gave up trying to find a Ku-FSS DP solution, and bought a used superdish to get a Dish DP Ku-FSS LNB...

#12 OFFLINE   James Long

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 02:02 AM

I'm not sure that the term "Poor Man's SuperDish" really applies when qualified subscribers can get a real superdish for free with a committment ... homebrew seems to be a more expensive way to go. Perhaps it is "Poor Man's" because it makes you poor? Or because the price of a dish without a committment is too high.

Then again the content on 105 and 121 really isn't good unless your locals are there or you subscribe to internationals. 900 and 7000 are only so cool. It seems to be a more of a bragging point of "I can see all the birds!" than actual high value watching. But that can be fun too!

JL

#13 OFFLINE   Jacob S

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 01:07 AM

A poor man's superdish is a cheaper solution than having to pay full retail price for the superdish if you do not take the superdish promotion that Dish Network offers.

#14 OFFLINE   Sonnie Parker

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 10:06 PM

I only receive Birmingham, Alabama locals on Dish right now at either 110 or 119 (not sure which)... once my locals are up and running in Montgomery, Alabama I'll switch to them. Can I simply take my current Dish 500 with the SW44 switch and point it at either 105 or 121 (whichever my locals will be on) and it work?

#15 OFFLINE   Mike123abc

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 11:06 PM

I only receive Birmingham, Alabama locals on Dish right now at either 110 or 119 (not sure which)... once my locals are up and running in Montgomery, Alabama I'll switch to them. Can I simply take my current Dish 500 with the SW44 switch and point it at either 105 or 121 (whichever my locals will be on) and it work?


No, 105 and 121 require a larger dish and a different LNB on the dish to recieve them.

#16 OFFLINE   music_beans

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 11:48 PM

I only receive Birmingham, Alabama locals on Dish right now at either 110 or 119 (not sure which)... once my locals are up and running in Montgomery, Alabama I'll switch to them.


I think you should stick with the Birmingham, Alabama locals to save you the SuperDISH troubles.
Do you DVR?

#17 OFFLINE   Sonnie Parker

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Posted 16 June 2004 - 11:50 AM

I definitely want the Montgomery locals once they are available... which E* tells me will be July.

I can understand how if I needed both 105 and 121 to receive them that I would need a larger dish but the locals should be on one or the other. Why would I need such a large dish to receive just one satellite? Seems like the Dish 500 would be big enough if I just used a the different LNB. No?

I don't think E* is gonna give me a free install just for locals so if I end up having to have a new dish I suppose I'll have to go the poor mans dish route. What price are those?

#18 OFFLINE   gor88

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Posted 16 June 2004 - 02:36 PM

Sonnie,

The reason for the bigger dish is that the FSS signals naturally have a lower signal strength. The SuperDish is bigger to compensate for this.

E* will give you the dish free as long as you commit to AT60 or higher WITH locals for one year. Remember, they want you to subscribe to locals. Besides, it's not your fault that your locals will be on a different satellite.

The only issue you might run into is a wait for the Superdish.

Good luck in whatever you decide to do.

#19 OFFLINE   Sonnie Parker

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Posted 16 June 2004 - 05:08 PM

I'll have to figure which is less expensive... buying the necessary equipment and installing it myself or paying for AT60 for a year... also taking into consideration how long I'll have to wait to get it installed if I let them do it. I've always installed my own satellite equipment so that's not a problem.

Thanks!

#20 OFFLINE   Jacob S

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Posted 16 June 2004 - 09:36 PM

I wonder if a 24" dish would be big enough to receive a signal once the new 105 FSS satellite is launched, even if it would be a weaker signal but strong enough to pick up the signal to watch tv when it is not raining. I am able to achieve an 80-90% signal strength with the SuperDish if I have the dish peaked just right so the new bird should be even stronger.




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