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MPEG-4 Receivers-When? Beta yet?


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#1 OFFLINE   Raymond Simonian

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Posted 22 April 2005 - 04:49 PM

Doesn't it take at least a year of Beta testing to get a receiver ready for the public? I just can't see how Dish's expectation of a Fall start for MPEG-4 HD channels can be done. Not only does the receiver and hopefully the DVR be ready but there are a multitude of receivers that have to be put in place.

Is anyone aware of any that are being Beta tested. Are there any model numbers or pictures avalable?
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#2 OFFLINE   Mark Lamutt

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Posted 22 April 2005 - 05:57 PM

No, it usually takes around 3-4 months if the beta program works the way it's supposed to.
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#3 OFFLINE   Jim Parker

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Posted 22 April 2005 - 06:15 PM

Mark
Are you referring to only the software beta test period? Since the 942 is not upgradeable to MPEG4, I figure that a new box will have to be designed first. Then the software will have to be written before it can be beta tested.

To make Rays question a little bit broader, has anybody heard of the new box or of a software development program for it or of the beta test period?

I certainly don't have any insider knowledge, but there was plenty of notice before the 921 and 942. Personally, I don't expect any results of the MPEG4 development that we can actually use until well into 2006. And that means no new HD until then as well.
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#4 OFFLINE   Jordan420

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Posted 22 April 2005 - 06:42 PM

I thought they started the beta testing after the receivers are in wide spread use? :hurah:
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#5 OFFLINE   rocatman

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Posted 22 April 2005 - 07:23 PM

Mark,

I know you dropped a hint about a MPEG-4 receiver during the last online Charlie Chat. I would expect that you are either currently beta testing a receiver or will be shortly perhaps with a dish pointing at 148 W. I know you have a Non-disclosure Agreement with Dish related to this but I was wondering if this MPEG-4 unit will be a DVR and if it is a DVR is it a spinoff of the 942? Will Dish have it on display at the Team Summit? Will they also have the new 110/119/129 triple dish on display as well? Thanks in advance for any information you can provide.

#6 OFFLINE   jollygrunt

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Posted 22 April 2005 - 07:56 PM

Does anyone have any further information on the 2wire Mediaportal? All I know is that it's supposed to be ready sometime this year.

http://www.2wire.com/?p=95&pid=104

http://www.2wire.com/?p=13
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#7 OFFLINE   Jacob S

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Posted 22 April 2005 - 09:41 PM

I'm sure whatever product there is that Charlie and Jim have had it for a while now.

#8 OFFLINE   larrystotler

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 10:07 AM

Nope. They have C-Band or cable instead. Probably C-Band.
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#9 OFFLINE   Mark Lamutt

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 11:42 AM

They may very well have a new triple dish (110/119/129) on display at Team Summit.

They most likely won't have MPEG4 receivers on display yet. If they do, they'll probably be mockups.

As for what MPEG4 receivers will be available from Dish, think about what Dish currently offeres for HD recievers, and then add an MPEG 4 in front of that. Seems to me they'd offer a DVR version and a non-DVR version at the very least. Also seems to be that they'd build on their most successful software platform (which happens to be the 522/942 platforum).

And yes, there's a lot that can't be talked about yet...but, in my opinion, the future is looking pretty good to me. :)
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#10 OFFLINE   David_Levin

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 12:53 PM

Here's my guess....

The company making the current mpeg2 decoder makes a new mpeg4 version that is at least programmable/command compatible (or even pin-4-pin compatible). At best Dish just switches chips on the current motherboards. Or, minor motherboard design changes for the new pinout.

The box could get to the end user very guickly since the needed software/hardware changes are minimal.

Probably the biggest problem is that Charlie said (2 chats ago), that the new decoders (or was it encoders) are late. If a silicon respin is needed, the hit could easily be 3-6 months.
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#11 OFFLINE   normang

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 04:33 PM

Even if there is alot that isn't known, I still don't think we'll see any mpeg4 receiver until later next year. If am wrong, so be it. I think Dish needs to get more bandwidth into orbit, then worry about mpeg4 to go along with it..
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#12 OFFLINE   SimpleSimon

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 07:19 PM

... I think Dish needs to get more bandwidth into orbit, then worry about mpeg4 to go along with it..

Well, I think they've got more bandwidth than anybody else already. They just won't use it for what Americans want. Can't blame them I guess - when you can charge 1,000s of foreigners $20-30+ a month for some international drivel (same type of crap as we watch - just from THEIR home).

Then, on a guess, to finish the utterly ridiculous, bandwidth-wasting build-out of local DMAs, they need another 20 transponders or so. Enter Rainbow-1. :)
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#13 OFFLINE   BFG

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 07:27 PM

Are the 4 channels being tested at 148 TP 31 MPEG4 or heavily compressed MPEG2?
TP14 also is testing HD of some sort also I think

#14 OFFLINE   JohnGfun

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 07:34 PM

This may sound stupid...but...Can consumers be testers for receivers and how?

#15 OFFLINE   kwajr

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 07:43 PM

i am still beta testing my 522 i think its close to being a stable version soon

#16 OFFLINE   Cyclone

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 08:04 PM

I still think that the First MPEG-4 Dish HDTV receiver will simply be a 942 with a MPEG-4 chip in it. No need to reinvent the wheel to just upgrade decode processing.
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#17 OFFLINE   Ron Barry

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 08:29 PM

Does anyone have any further information on the 2wire Mediaportal? All I know is that it's supposed to be ready sometime this year.

http://www.2wire.com/?p=95&pid=104

http://www.2wire.com/?p=13


My understantind is that this is an SBC project and It is unclear if it will be available for Dish customers. Looking at it, not sure if it will be Dish MPEG-4 compatible either. Just because it has MPEG-4 in the description does not necessarly mean it will be able to decode the MPEG-4 Stream dish is providing. This could just mean it is cable of doing your MPEG-4 from you camera or digital cam.

Hard to say at this moment, I like what I saw when I read the specs but more info is needed on this one and hopefully Dish it will be available to dish customers at some point. Time will tell.
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#18 OFFLINE   normang

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 08:32 PM

Well, I think they've got more bandwidth than anybody else already. They just won't use it for what Americans want. Can't blame them I guess - when you can charge 1,000s of foreigners $20-30+ a month for some international drivel (same type of crap as we watch - just from THEIR home).

Then, on a guess, to finish the utterly ridiculous, bandwidth-wasting build-out of local DMAs, they need another 20 transponders or so. Enter Rainbow-1. :)


Fortunately, or unfortunately, depending on your perspective. Selling those spendy internationals may mean a lot to some of those people to sort of keep track of what maybe happening back at the old home town and if they keep our costs down a little, more the better.. And those SD locals for all those DMA's, add to the sub list, which should somehow help keep costs down. And of course, they all take bandwidth..

Right now with the top 180, you've got several news channels, several shopping channels, several discovery like channels, several music video channels, I could go on, not many of those things are going to convert to HD well.

I don't need HD news, though eventually just because, it will start coming that way. I don't need HD Shopping channels, Offering more HD sports maybe cool, but with local HD and ESPN, how much more does one need? It maybe just me, but HD music videos aren't going to make any difference. Some of the Science channels maybe cool in HD, but its going to freak someone out when something really gross comes across so realistic..:D Lets see HGTV in HD.. the flowers on the landscaping shows would look really good..:lol: I don't think they could do much in HD for Cartoon network, I am not sure I want to see HD Nick either... all that slime...:hurah:

As for what American's want, I know what people here want, most people I think are clueless, which is why there isn't much of a rush yet to make the switch.. However I think its going to start accelerating. the Govt really wants that spectrum back to sell and they aren't going to get it until everyone is watching some sort of digital TV, HD or not.
Norm


#19 OFFLINE   SimpleSimon

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 09:29 PM

... And those SD locals for all those DMA's, add to the sub list, which should somehow help keep costs down. And of course, they all take bandwidth..

Ever hear of the law of diminishing returns? They're starting to get down into the DMAs with 40 people and 10,000 cows. But the bandwidth requirements are similar to some bigger DMAs. ENOUGH (waste) IS ENOUGH! :(

#20 OFFLINE   Ron Barry

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Posted 23 April 2005 - 11:15 PM

Simon you make a good point, though I do see what the international programming does. For my household it is the deal breaker of moving to DirecTV or Cable. Without JapanTV, my other choices are ruled out end of discussion. I am sure that is why a lot of other people are with Dish too. Internationals draw people in and they purchase the rest of the services. I see DirecTV does something similar by being sports strong. I have always told people, sports top priority go directTV, if you need international support Dish will most likely meet your requirements.

As for continuing to expand DMAs, you might be right about diminishing returns.

Dish at some point will have to turn its guns on the HD market because you don't want to be too late to the new playing field. At this point with DirecTVs current offerings and what I have seen from most cable companies it is by no means too late. In the next 6 months to a year, I feel all content providers are going to have to step up. Will be interesting to see.
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