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Any ideas on how to fix this? D* dosen't have any?!


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22 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   kay

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 01:41 AM

Current setup:

4x8 powered multiswitch - there are 7 cable runs from this unit of the following lengths in ft: 15, 15, 20, 20, 30, 30, 80. The power adapter is plugged in approximately 30 feet away. All coax is RG6 with properly fitted crimp connectors.

R15 in a bedroom (15 and 15 ft cable runs)
R15 in the living room (30 and 30)
D11 in the garage (80)
(and two unused D11's on the 20 and 20ft runs)

3LNB dish with a full grounding block, grounding is to a water faucet near the mounting though, and I think that might be part of the problem - the actual lines that go into the ground are PVC around here, might it not really be grounded?


The problem:

Every night I get searching for sattelite. The living room always works fine, and while it is sfss (11pm-1am'ish it starts and continues most of the night) the R15 in the living room is either not working or totally out, it varies, but the other two are always out. I can somewhat manipulate it - unplugging and replugging the multiswitch makes the living room R15 work again if it went out, and then turning that receiver on and off makes the bedroom receiver turn on and off (meaning on and off in terms of sfss) - the garage works when the bedroom does. I've checked the following:

-every cable crimp connector in the entire system (that's around 40 or so) has been replaced
-the 4x8 multiswitch has been replaced
-the LNB has been replaced
-the dish has no line of sight obstructions of any kind at any time
-all mountings are secure everywhere

What is going on here? I've taken a few spins with tech support over the phone just to kind of get a second (and third, fourth, etc) opinion, and i've had two service calls and no one can find the problem. Everyone checks everything and says it's fine. At this point i'm looking at somehow regrounding it (they did an ugly job of that) and shortening the long cable run for the power plug of the multiswitch (i'd add a new power outlet a few feet from the box off of a nearby conduit)

edit: To summarize - every night I have to unplug and replug the mult and then turn on (and leave on) the living room R15, or the bedroom and garage ones won't work until the problem goes away in the morning.

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#2 OFFLINE   Proc

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 07:02 PM

Try your post over at D*'s forum http://forums.directv.com I bet someone will give you some sound advice.

#3 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 07:34 PM

How long are the runs from the multiswitch, to the dish.
And does the dish itself have a multiswitch on it?

What brand multiswitch is it?

What are the results if you just leave the two R15s on the switch.

What are the results if you just connect the two R15s to the incomming feeds from the dish?

don't bother with forums.directv.com... you will get better answers here.
:D

My "guess" is that it is the multiswitch.. I know you said you replaced it.
But from what it sounds like, is that it is not getting enough power from the switch to the dish to lock in the 4 signals.
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All comments are my own. Unless specifically stated, my views do NOT represent the views of DIRECTV

#4 OFFLINE   TMullenJr

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 08:00 PM

What kind of extension cords are you using for the 30' on the multiswitch. If you are using cheap zip cord type, there could be too much resistance, and that could be causing your issue. Make sure you try a good heavy duty extension cord.

#5 OFFLINE   kay

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 09:22 PM

[quote name='Proc']Try your post over at D*'s forum http://forums.directv.com I bet someone will give you some sound advice.[/QUOTE]

Nah, the info there is very sparse - as far as I know its just a tech csr or two that does most of the posting there. I'm familiar with that forum :(

[quote name='Earl Bonovich']How long are the runs from the multiswitch, to the dish.
And does the dish itself have a multiswitch on it?[/quote]

The dish is an integrated 3lnb, so yes it has the 4x4 inside of it. It's the normal 4 outputs to 4 inputs on a 3lnb/4x8 setup - no issues with the way it's configured (dosen't matter which one goes to which port on this config)[/quote]

[quote name='Earl Bonovich']What brand multiswitch is it?[/QUOTE]

Can't recall on this one, previous was a Zinwell and it had the same issues

[quote name='Earl Bonovich']What are the results if you just leave the two R15s on the switch.[/QUOTE]

Haven't tried yet - will try tonight.

[quote name='Earl Bonovich']What are the results if you just connect the two R15s to the incomming feeds from the dish?[/QUOTE]

Haven't tried that either - I imagine the result would be the same as the above suggestion, but I can try it to.

[quote name='Earl Bonovich']don't bother with forums.directv.com... you will get better answers here.
:D[/QUOTE]

Agreed

[quote name='Earl Bonovich']My "guess" is that it is the multiswitch.. I know you said you replaced it. But from what it sounds like, is that it is not getting enough power from the switch to the dish to lock in the 4 signals.[/QUOTE]

Could be the length of cable from the power adapter, dunno - i'm going to install a whole new electrical outlet a few feet from the switch from a nearby junction box so that there is no extension cable (the extension is coax right now) from the ac adapter to the mult.

[quote name='TMullenJr']What kind of extension cords are you using for the 30' on the multiswitch. If you are using cheap zip cord type, there could be too much resistance, and that could be causing your issue. Make sure you try a good heavy duty extension cord.[/QUOTE]

Just a coax cable, the AC adapter has a coax end and there is a 30 foot RG6 coax cable from there to the multiswitch's power in port. As stated above i'll be eliminating that soon.

I've also got a HR10-250 coming in around two weeks so i'll be able to possibly rule out more issues at that time by moving things around, but i'm hoping to have this resolved by then :(

#6 OFFLINE   Installer567

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 11:36 PM

Sounds to me like it is either the cable itself that is between the dish and multiswitch or insulation in the connectors.

#7 OFFLINE   Igor

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Posted 28 February 2006 - 12:58 AM

15' and 30' are not long runs. If you have an issue with power plug to power the switch, I would replace the switch by a WB6x8; it does not require any power.

Something is not smelling good :-) I wonder if you have an antenna hardware issue and we are focusing on the switch.

Besides the suggestions to connect two R15s directly to the antenna ports, I would suggest to disconnect everything from the antenna and connect the D11, one antenna port at a time to make sure all ports work. Once connected you should make sure you can tune to several channels to cover both polarizations.

#8 OFFLINE   fullcourt81

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Posted 28 February 2006 - 02:26 AM

I'm voting for the cable. I've seen it screw up the signal strength

#9 OFFLINE   mkmhr

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Posted 02 March 2006 - 09:57 AM

Since all receivers are along the same platform line, or in another words if all receivers are the same model ( just not specificlly) at that point all cables do need to be at least 50ft. This has use partly to each receivers ability to sustain polarization in the lnb's.

#10 OFFLINE   kay

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 01:22 AM

Since all receivers are along the same platform line, or in another words if all receivers are the same model ( just not specificlly) at that point all cables do need to be at least 50ft. This has use partly to each receivers ability to sustain polarization in the lnb's.


This was what i've been leaning towards... But I resolved the issue! And of course it was something stupid:

There is a light switch just outside of the closet area that leads to my attic (and my multiswitch) - my living room is a converted garage, so this is all in the living area. Every time I would get ready to go to bed i'd flip off the light switch, go lay down, and find the bedroom searching for sattelite. I'd come back in the living room to check things out (turning on the light of course) and things would be fine in both rooms, but when I turned off the living room tv (and yes, the light when I left the room) everything would be down.

There is an outlet in the attic just above the living room that the multiswitch is plugged into. This outlet is on the same line as the switch, and it gets the power cut off every time I switch off the light. I'll be running the power adapter elsewhere.

#11 OFFLINE   JLucPicard

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 02:24 AM

OMG! That's funny, but it's not. I'm glad you solved that mystery!

#12 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 10:37 AM

Are you serious?

I will have to add to the list of make sure it is plugged in...

Funny.... Glad you found it...
Earl - Gotta Love Karma

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All comments are my own. Unless specifically stated, my views do NOT represent the views of DIRECTV

#13 ONLINE   carl6

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 04:49 PM

This is the second problem I have seen in the various forums that was directly related to household electrical power. The other one had something to do with the outlet the receiver was plugged into - when he ran an extension cord to another outlet, the problem went away, and the symptoms there were also very unusual ones that just didn't make a whole lot of sense.

Lesson to be learned: Never overlook the obvious, and check EVERYTHING.

Carl

#14 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 05:16 PM

Now can you blame D* for not figuring out the problem?

;)

#15 OFFLINE   fullcourt81

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 09:14 PM

Like I said, it was the cable................the ELECTRICAL cable :D

#16 OFFLINE   kay

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 10:14 PM

Now can you blame D* for not figuring out the problem?

;)


Yes :P

I suppose this was something they wouldn't have known... Still, i'm glad it was resolved. And I did get a lot of potential problems (several really poorly done crimp connectors) fixed in the process.

#17 OFFLINE   Mike500

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Posted 04 March 2006 - 07:05 AM

You have a power quality fault in your home called a "floating ground" or a "bootleg ground."

Since there is a ground fault, turning on one appliance causes a draw that results in a voltage drop on one side of the cuircuit and an overvoltage on the other. Overvoltage or undervoltage causes the certain receivers that you mention to shut down. It is also likely that power in the circuit is using the case of the particular receiver, the shield on the coax to return to the panel or the ground. This voltage would corrupt the signal to the multiswitch or lnb.

You meed a good experienced electrician.

#18 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 04 March 2006 - 10:16 AM

Mike500, he had an issue with his powered multi-switch being plugged into a switched outlet that he switched off, and not figuring it out for awhile, nothing more.....

#19 OFFLINE   kay

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Posted 04 March 2006 - 09:42 PM

Yeah it had to do with the light switch I installed in my living room, My living room has a computer on one side and the entry way on the other, and I added a second light switch (3 pole x2 setup - fairly basic) and in doing that I accidentally chained the wire that piggybacks to the outlet to the switched side and not the hot side.

I'm going to get it fixed when I have time, i'll probably deal with it in a couple days. Right now i'm just leaving the living room light on at night :P I just feel really dumb because i'm rather experienced when it comes to electrical issues.

#20 OFFLINE   CCarncross

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 08:25 PM

You're even more experienced now..

;)




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