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Guest Message by DevFuse

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Another failed Painful Install of a Dish 1000 and a 622


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20 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   ts937km

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Posted 15 April 2006 - 04:47 PM

Just spent 4 hours waiting for the tech and then 2 with the tech.... Curious if this sounds right.


Short story:

The 129 LNBF would register 7.4 on his meter but when he put his hand in between it and the dish it would continue to register 7.4. Is that normal or did he have a bum LNBF?

Long story

1. Been waiting over a month for the install. The 622 has been setting deactivated for 3+ weeks
2. After talking to Dish support for the 3rd time they finall remembered to schedule the Dish 1000 install and added another 2 weekdelay to the install date.
3. Waited on my Saturday 12-5 install slot and the technician showed around 4
4. Did a quick and excellent job of mounting the dish 1000, installing a switch 34 and aiming it.
5. 622 couldn't see it no matter how many reaims and different cables. His meter showed a 7.4 (except for the weirdness of blocking the signal with his hand yet still receiving a 7.4
6. Tried to obtain a replacement Dishpro LNBF but no luck.
7. Tore down the dish per his companies order and replaced with my dish 500
8. We called Dish to try and activate 622 the lady said she could, then she couldn't then she could then she couldn't then she could but it wouldnt change until the ticket was closed.
9. Ticket was modified to delay another week and try to put another 1000 up and if that didn't work put a 61.5 up.....
10. My 622 is still sitting useless....
11. My frustation as a long standing dish customer (with the everything pack) is growing.....

...Ads Help To Support This SIte...

#2 OFFLINE   device manager

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Posted 15 April 2006 - 06:16 PM

Sorry about your frustration. I am surprised that these techs do not come with additional equipment in case something goes wrong. This is the main reason I deal with a local "Dish & DirecTV" shop.

1) I assume 110 & 119 were ok?

2) Did he try running the coax lines from the Dish 1000 Twin LNBF directly to the 622? You could have a faulty DP34 switch.

3) If you are only aiming at 3 birds the Dish 1000 DP Plus Twin has a built in switch and you wouldn't need to use a DP34 unless you had multiple receivers.

4) Aiming a Dish 300 @ 61.5 may be better depending on your location. If you still want to use a Dish 1000 just leave the 129 LNBF disconnected and run the Dish 300 LNBF to the 1000's DPP Twin input.

#3 OFFLINE   ts937km

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Posted 15 April 2006 - 07:54 PM

Sorry should have been a little more thorough...

I have an existing 522, 508 and 811. The 622 is replacing the 508 and 811.

110 and 119 were and are still functioning on both

I don't think he ran direct without the switch. I questioned whether it could be the switch and he kind of suggested that it couldn't. When you did a switch test it showed 110 and 119 were connected and 129 had X's. Also when you pressed detail it showed the kind of LNBF's that 110 and 119 were connected. 129 said Not connected. Again he said that was normal until it correctly saw the satellite.

And finally he had to put everything back the way it was. He said the new guy would reinstall everything (again). That seemed really stupid to me....


Thanks for your help!

#4 OFFLINE   device manager

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Posted 15 April 2006 - 11:36 PM

Actually you won't need to use the DP34 since it is not compatible with the DPP Twin on the Dish 1000.

http://sadoun.com/Sa...NBF/dpptwin.pdf

Since you will only have the 522 & 622 the cleanest install will be to run a cable from the Dish 1000 to each DVR location, then connect the line to a separator, then to Sat1 & Sat2 inputs on the DVR's.

Hopefully the next tech is able to get you up and running. If you have more than 2 receivers, or decide that you want to connect to 4 satellite locations, you can use a DPP44 switch.

#5 OFFLINE   ts937km

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Posted 16 April 2006 - 05:04 PM

Thanks for your help. I'll let you know what the next tech does....

And just to confirm a Dish 1000 with the DPP Twin (110 and 119)and a DP single 129 should not have been hooked to a switch 34?

If so that makes me even madder!

The tech and their dispatch also kept telling me that the highdef additional channels were on 129 only and not 61.5!

You have to wonder if they give these Dish approved techs any kind of training at all?

#6 OFFLINE   device manager

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Posted 16 April 2006 - 05:56 PM

Here's the Dish 1000 Quick FAQ's that also confirm that you cannot use a DP34 w/ the DPP Twin:
http://www.satellite...Quick_Facts.pdf

However if you have the installer swap out the DPP Twin for a DP Twin then you can use a DP34 switch. Even then I would only do that if you have more than 2 receivers, and if they refused to give you a DPP44 switch.

Here are the Dish channels @ 61.5:
http://www.dishchannelchart.com/

As far as the knowledge of certain techs, it's a hit or miss with any company. I am sure they all go thru some type of training, but one thing you need to remember is that Dish is contracting "local" installers to perform these installations. This is one of the reasons that it pays to educate yourself so you know right from wrong. By no means am I an expert, but I have learned a lot from visiting this forum and taking advantage of the search feature.

#7 OFFLINE   brad1138

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Posted 16 April 2006 - 11:22 PM

As far as the knowledge of certain techs, it's a hit or miss with any company. I am sure they all go thru some type of training, but one thing you need to remember is that Dish is contracting "local" installers to perform these installations.


You are mostly correct. I work for a company in Olympia, WA that sells and installs Dish, DTV, Wild Blue. We have also sold/installed, DirecPC, Starband, DirecWay and others. We also do contract work for about a dozen Co's including DNSC (E*'s name for there Installation/service division).

We handle overflow from the local DNSC and are part of there Referral program (only available to Co.s that have a 98.5% or high customer retention rate over the first contract year). In the old day Dish would subcontract to anyone, they were desperate when locals 1st became available. They contracted with some crappy installers/companies. Now they are very strict, we are one of two or three Co.s in western WA that Dish contracts with.

Dish has many more installers in there DNSC than there are subcontractors. They have about 15-20 Vans in there Oly. location and 50-100 in there Seattle area location (those figures are a few years old but I think they are still current). We have 4 installers. But generally the local Places (like mine) are the more sought after jobs, (pay better and have the more experienced installers). Usually Dish will have the newbies, we get a lot of them looking for jobs with us. That being said there are still a lot of cheesy private installer outfits out there, places that make them drive there own vehicles and don't supply tools etc....

If you do get a DNSC or DNSC Subcontracted installer you should have a fairly knowledgeable installer. Where you should be careful is buying from a small retailer that might be using his nephew to do the installs, or some telemarketers that look for the cheapest installers they can find.

Brad
Professional Dish Installer since Jan, 2000
Working in Home AV sale/service since 1990
----------------------------------------------
Dish ViP622 (110, 119, 61.5)
61" Scenium DLP (720P) HDMI
PS Audio 4.6 Preamp
BIAMP Eminence 300 AMP.
SoundStream/Krell DAC-1 D/A converter
Definitive Technology BP-10 Spks.
AudioControl 520 series B E.Q.
************************
www.stophdlite.com

#8 OFFLINE   ts937km

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Posted 17 April 2006 - 09:52 AM

This is a fairly big outfit that provides trucks, etc. My frustation is that Dish requires these guys to roll no matter what. If I buy a new receiver like a 522 and need no wiring, dish changes. They still have to come to the house and install it. And of course they give you a 5 hour window when they will be there.

Oh well I have plenty of ammo now for the new guy.

I've now owned my 622 for 5 weeks and all I can watch on it is the FYI channel. The High Def locals won't even work because of activation.

Thanks for all of your help

#9 OFFLINE   The intimidator

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Posted 17 April 2006 - 10:26 AM

He is right I am a dnsc field manager for an rsp. There has been so much confusion with this dish 1000. This dish is capable of accomidating two dual tuners or two single tuners all by itself. The next tech that comes out inform him all he needs is one single coax from the dish pro plus twin to the 622 vip with a seperator at the reciever location. Should come in the box the receiver came in. This tech must not have known that dpplus twin can not be ran through a dp 34 switch. Trust me it is not as though the dnsc updates and memos inform us techs of these things we have to learn on our own!!! It was rediculous what we had to go through just to find azimeth,skew, and elevation angles for this dish.

#10 OFFLINE   brad1138

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Posted 17 April 2006 - 11:22 AM

"There has been so much confusion with this dish 1000."

"It was rediculous what we had to go through just to find azimeth,skew, and elevation angles for this dish."



It surprises me that any installer couldn't read the instructions that comes in the box w/DPP lnbs, read instructions on the net ( http://www.satellite...Quick_Facts.pdf ) or watch the latest Charlie Chat that probably covers it. When you understand how they work with separators and diplexers they make installs so much easier. Not having to run 2 or 3 lines to every dual tuner receiver. As far as finding the azimuth, skew and elevation we had a printed list referencing all zip codes, We either printed it from the net or it came in the D1000 boxes, can't remember. The settings on the D1000 or D500 don't change significantly for our entire install area so I only have to remember 1 set of numbers (154a, 87s, 35e for D1000 or 148a, 83s, 35e for D500)
Professional Dish Installer since Jan, 2000
Working in Home AV sale/service since 1990
----------------------------------------------
Dish ViP622 (110, 119, 61.5)
61" Scenium DLP (720P) HDMI
PS Audio 4.6 Preamp
BIAMP Eminence 300 AMP.
SoundStream/Krell DAC-1 D/A converter
Definitive Technology BP-10 Spks.
AudioControl 520 series B E.Q.
************************
www.stophdlite.com

#11 OFFLINE   ts937km

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Posted 13 May 2006 - 09:19 PM

After much pain and an additional 2 weeks of waiting. I finally got installed today after numerous phone calls to local installer and dish. The tech today actually understood everything and got it all working in a short amount of time.

So far so good Dish 1000 and 622 performing very well!

#12 OFFLINE   dpd146

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Posted 14 May 2006 - 08:54 AM

After much pain and an additional 2 weeks of waiting. I finally got installed today after numerous phone calls to local installer and dish. The tech today actually understood everything and got it all working in a short amount of time.

So far so good Dish 1000 and 622 performing very well!


2nd try at install. First guy didn't have right dish. Second guy doesn't have a 1000 either so I am going with a second dish. He is on the roof now. I am little concerned, he has never heard of a 622. :confused: He asked if I was getting Voom package. Got my fingers crossed and holes in my roof. Wish me luck.


All hooked up and working. :)

#13 OFFLINE   Gramps

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Posted 14 May 2006 - 12:15 PM

... My frustation is that Dish requires these guys to roll no matter what. If I buy a new receiver like a 522 and need no wiring, dish changes. They still have to come to the house and install it. And of course they give you a 5 hour window when they will be there...


As an 8-plus year DISH customer, I am also getting frustrated with the process. Some of us are capable and competent enough to swap a receiver or antenna and correctly point it. I have a 622 in a box awaiting an "HD trained" installer to do a box swap with an existing working 942. There is an automatic upgrade from my DPP 500 antenna to the 1000. In my setup, I have no need for a switch, so what's the big deal? Weekends are booked for months so I have to take a vacation day to be here for the installer who I really expect to be here less than 1 hour.

In "2001 A Space Odyssey", the HAL9000 took over and man was left out. Too many companies are falling into this trap and designing a rigid system that ignores common sense. Sometimes the customer is right, let him have what he wants and if he breaks it or needs assistance, charge for it.

I'm in this boat now because I was tempted by HD and as a "long time customer in good standing" I was offered a discount for the 942 hardware if I obtained it directly from DISH. Had I simply bought the hardware from a local DISH retailer I would have had a lot less aggrivation with its install, and now I'm hooked into the 942-622 upgrade and I sit and wait with a 622 in a box next to my TV.

If GE says they have to send an installer to change my light bulbs, I'm checking out! :nono2:

#14 OFFLINE   Gramps

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Posted 14 May 2006 - 12:18 PM

... I am little concerned, he has never heard of a 622...


Hmm :confused: DISH tells me I'm having to wait so long for the install because they require an "HD trained" installer to do this. Doesn't that give you a warm fuzzy? :rolleyes:

#15 OFFLINE   dave1234

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Posted 14 May 2006 - 01:07 PM

It surprises me that any installer couldn't read the instructions that comes in the box w/DPP lnbs, read instructions on the net ( http://www.satellite...Quick_Facts.pdf ) or watch the latest Charlie Chat that probably covers it.

What? Read the instructions?? What a novel idea..... :) :)

#16 OFFLINE   dlhuse

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Posted 14 May 2006 - 01:58 PM

Hmm :confused: DISH tells me I'm having to wait so long for the install because they require an "HD trained" installer to do this. Doesn't that give you a warm fuzzy? :rolleyes:


My installer MAY have seen HD prior to the install. But my 622VIP was the VERY FIRST one he ever saw. So exactly how can these guys be trained if they've never seen the unit????:confused:

#17 OFFLINE   markyd21

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Posted 14 May 2006 - 08:12 PM

My installer MAY have seen HD prior to the install. But my 622VIP was the VERY FIRST one he ever saw. So exactly how can these guys be trained if they've never seen the unit????:confused:

I think the problem with the population of field personnel (at least with DNSC) is that these guys get paid peanuts and with any low paying entry position there is a high turn-around in the personnel. Knowing how DNS/Echostar brings these new guys in and trains them, it is no suprise that they are all coming out and messing up these installs/upgrades. 1 of 2 things happen when some of these guys get brought into the tech position:
1. They get overeducated and completely swamped in details. No doubt details are nice and needed, but at one time the Level 2 field tech training had a whole section on Windows operating systems!! It may have changed since I was in this environment a year ago, but this is not applicable to what they do in the field. This is an example of how some of these techs are being trained with the wrong info.
2. They are not trained enough. After they get flooded with a weeks worth of miniscule details, they are stuck in a van with an existing tech, who may or may not know what they are doing, and a long line of bad habits, misunderstandings, and myths lives on in a new employee.

#18 OFFLINE   GrumpyBear

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Posted 16 May 2006 - 02:54 PM

I just don't get sometimes, with all the new equipment the installers have nowadays, installing a Sat Dish, should be a breeze. I don't do the work, since getting out of the Marines, but back in the day the only way we had to test for a signal was a bounce back on a power meter(dating myself, but I am not that old). I installed my own Dish1000 here in Carlsbad and in Post Falls, using no more than a compass, 2 Wrenches, and me 12 year old reading off signal strength to me. Some of these kids, just need to take it slower, and check thier all knowing ego's.

#19 OFFLINE   mwsmith2

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 07:26 AM

Just FYI, my install is composed of 3 DP Dual LNBFs and a DP34 switch. I was a bit concerned when the installed pulled all that gear out, but he hooked it all up and it worked perfect the first time. Of all the install photos, mine is the only one i've seen that way...all the others i've seen have been composed of a DP Plus twin + DP Dual. when I asked him about that, he told me that it can't be done that way because it's not compatible with the DP34 switch, so he did know his stuff. I have only the 622 in my house, nothing else.

Now I'm not sure what having the DP34 setup buys me, but it works just fine! :D

Michael

#20 OFFLINE   Buffalo Bill

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 08:31 AM

I thought it was just my luck with the kid showing up and literally saying, "I've never even seen one of these receivers before..." This happened a year ago when I bought the 942 and in March this year when I got the 622. The youngster who installed the 942 said he wasn't really sure how to feed TV2, etc. So, he ends up installing 3 diplexers and a bunch of short jumpers to a pair of DP34 switches. It looked at that point like rocket science to me. But, it worked and I was okay with that. The 622 kid shows up to install the Dish 1000 and the 622. Everything is fine with the new dish install (he seems to know how to wire to which LNB, etc.) I then lead him inside and show him the 622. He just stares at it and admits he has never installed one. I urge him to just hook it up the way the 942 was and he did. He left, with the message that the receiver was "downloading program information" on for over an hour and no progress. He had no clue why it was not downloading and rather than him calling tech support and getting it resolved, he simply left. I had to call tech support to complete the install. After joining this forum, I discovered that all of the diplexers and jumpers were completely unnecessary as was having two DP34's. I simplified to one DPP44 and removed all of the jumpers and diplexers. Things are much simpler now.

Bottom line is that I know E* is scrambling to get new stuff sold and installed, but for goodness sake, let's have those kids go to receiver school every now and then to get better at what they do. Also, in sales we tell our reps to never give the customer the "I have no idea what this is" look to customers. It just doesn't instill a lot of confidence...




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