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Guest Message by DevFuse

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Did Dish dish out an ECM 8/15?


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48 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   TNGTony

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 09:24 PM

I've learned that Dish may have sent out an ECM on 8/15 in the afternoon. Anyone know anything about this? I wonder how many receivers fried this afternoon.

See ya
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#2 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 09:36 PM

Hoepfully a BUNCH of 'em. All with those magic cards.
The Pump Don't Work 'cause the Vandals Took the Handles.

#3 ONLINE   SParker

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 09:42 PM

maybe all the hackers will be seathing in alt.dbs.echostar.hack awwww poor guys :hurah:

#4 OFFLINE   J Rath

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 09:58 PM

Not sure if it was related or not but I did get a "smart card not authorized" message on my 3900 today (don't recall what time it was though). I get that message occasionally where it will pop up for about 5-10 seconds, then it goes away and back to the program I was watching. Gets annoying sometimes.

#5 OFFLINE   DRJDAN

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 10:06 PM

What is ECM ?

#6 OFFLINE   bkwest

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 10:09 PM

Electronic Counter Measure... if I recall correctly.
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#7 OFFLINE   MarkA

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 10:21 PM

Correct. To add onto that - it is basically a way to remotely deactivate (and often destroy) receivers and cards for pirated programming. The downside is they always seem to end up hurting some legitimate users - and often, through no fault of their own, they have to pay to resume their service.

#8 Guest_kingc_*

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 10:29 PM

I wonder how many legit users got killed this time? From looking over the hacker boards, it looks like it was a pretty big ECM. While I am not defending hacking, everyone always points out that hackers cost the DBS company money. I wonder how much their ECM's cost from development time to killing legitimate users?

Also, what is the procedure at the DBS company if a legit user is hit?

#9 OFFLINE   Jacob S

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 10:30 PM

Maybe this is why the last three customers did not pay their first bill and I got backcharged on them all. One of them told me that someone was trying to sell them pirating cards but dont know who it is. I told them that if I find out about this that it costs me and Dish money and I would turn them in and I would enforce my contract full force. If I find out a customer shuts their set off, its in my contract to pick up the equipment, that it belongs to them after a period of one year. This helps against piracy as well. I have to go after some sets. If they do not work then I will find out real fast if that is what they have in fact done.

#10 OFFLINE   MarkA

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Posted 15 August 2002 - 10:44 PM

"Also, what is the procedure at the DBS company if a legit user is hit?"

Well, a friend of mine had her card die - and I suspect it was an ECM. She was charged for a replacement card ("shipping" but it was many many many times the actual shipping cost - I think about $15), and they said it just wore out. I wouldn't have tolerated that, but she didn't care that much to fight.

#11 OFFLINE   Jacob S

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 12:00 AM

Sounds like they are so cheap that they would lie to their own customers to try to get out of the shipping for the card, and even try to make off of the shipping, because it does NOT cost $15 to mail out a card. It is a LOT cheaper to mail out a card than it is to ship out a satellite receiver/system in which they charge $15 as well for that, and it dont cost that much for that either, let alone a smart card.

#12 OFFLINE   jrjcd

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 05:33 AM

in the worst case, sometimes legit customer's equipment gets fried and E* generally treats them pretty ugly, pretty much taking the stance that if your machine went up in smoke, you were probably doing something wrong to begin with, even tho it's easy enough to prove on their side if the customer is legit or not...

i hate piracy in any form, but it's just as wrong when E* sends down a software update that disables a perfectly good operating receiver just because it's a "legacy" model and forces the customer to pay for an upgrade they don't want. Another problem is the mysterious PPV activations that many dealers thought were just deadbeat customers trying to welsh on their porn habits, UNTIL IT STARTED HAPPENING TO SOME OF THE DEALERS!!! E* shouldn't use these methods to wring extra bucks out of their customer base-it's a snarky way to do business.

back on subject, i hope the ECM screwed up folks out their who pay big bucks to get their tv "free" thru pirate cards-and i also hope E* takes the time to check out a legit customer's complaint if their equipment went down also and treats a good customer the right way because of a problem the front office may have inadvertantly caused them....

JMHO
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#13 OFFLINE   PeterB

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 07:16 AM

Actualy, dish hasn't attacked the cards themselves, since they control all the software, they can give the reciever commands outside of the access card. Its a lot different from the way directtv does things.

What dish did last night and pretty much every other time, is tell the reciever to look for a specific charisitic in the access card, if it finds it, it sets the reciever's firmware to only display ch 101 and nothing else..

If you had an access card die in the last 1-2 years, its actually becuase the card died. :)

#14 OFFLINE   Darkman

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 12:01 PM

Not completely true,
this time it was Firmware i hear....

But in the not so far back past - the actual cards ("the programmed" ones were targeted also)

Tony: Did you have to open up this can of worms....lol

#15 OFFLINE   Scott Greczkowski

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 12:44 PM

From what i understand the other days ECM was just part 1. There is a part 2 coming. Those pirates who were not zapped last time will get it this time.

If you have ever watched the pirates fight the DBS Companies it is actually interesting to see how things work.

I say avoid the headaches and pay to watch TV.

#16 OFFLINE   Jacob S

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 04:43 PM

I just hope they do not get that many or any of the legitimate customers. If I find out that any of my customers got hit and Dish goes and tries to charge them for the set and I lose my commissions as a result, there is going to be some extreme action to occur as a result.

Why would someone be paying their bill if they were pirating the system? Wouldnt they shut the system off then pirate it? That dont make sense.

#17 Guest_kingc_*

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 05:51 PM

IMO, even getting one legit customer is not acceptable. With these ECM's, Dish is basically killing equipment they do not own. They speculate you are stealing service and instead of going through proper channels, they screw up your equipment. Seems like there should be some law against this type of ECM.

What is sad is we will never know how many dollars an ECM cost Dish and even more important, how many innocent people have to pay because of Dish Network's probable stone-walling tactics.

#18 OFFLINE   MarkA

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 07:46 PM

kingc, ECMs are sad but true. I can understand an occasional dead receiver or card, but they should replace it right away (FedEx overnight) at no cost.

#19 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 08:17 PM

instead of going through proper channels

Tell me, what are the "proper channels"?
The Pump Don't Work 'cause the Vandals Took the Handles.

#20 OFFLINE   J Rath

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Posted 16 August 2002 - 09:43 PM

With these ECM's, Dish is basically killing equipment they do not own.


They may not own the equipment, but they do own the smart card.




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