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Guest Message by DevFuse

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Typical signal strength?


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52 replies to this topic

#21 OFFLINE   scott T

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Posted 26 July 2006 - 07:37 PM

I ... dish alignment so very critical. Ask yourself, when ever has anyone gone to the trouble of providing the installer with an integral bubble level in every AT9 mast and why do you suppose that is?


Great, My installer took the intergral bubble level and pulled it out and said his trustly level that he has used for years was "better than that damn little bubble thing". Hmmm, I hope my AT9 is align well. :rolleyes:
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#22 OFFLINE   scott T

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Posted 26 July 2006 - 09:37 PM

OK ...
Here is the radar of the weather ...

Posted Image

I'm just alittle above and to the left of the "Y" in Youngstown.

My D* when out for 3 minutes and then returned.

Come on, this does not look that bad. Should I expect a outage over a little rain come through?

The WAF drop again tonight. I don't know if she will let me now put on a 76cm (30") dish nor to I think it will change that much.
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#23 OFFLINE   Cap'n Preshoot

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 05:40 AM

WAF not withstanding, remind her that if/when the cable goes out that it's usually out for hours and sometimes days, depending on what the trouble is. Anything from a simple power outgage to someone digging in the neighbor's garden or an auto accident that takes out a utility pole can inflict lengthy "all channels/all snow" periods.

While 3 minutes of rain fade isn't long, it can be frustrating during the rainy season if it's occurring with much regularity. I would suggest having the dish alignment checked.
The Cable and Satellite TV industry does not hold the patent on alienating its customers, but COMCAST in particular has succeeded in making an art form of it, garnering them the distinction of "Most Universally Despised" of all PAY-TV providers in the industry.

#24 OFFLINE   directvfreak

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 08:47 AM

Is this entire thread trying to explain thet the H-20s signal is okay if it is in the 70s?
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#25 OFFLINE   Cap'n Preshoot

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 06:29 PM

Great, My installer took the intergral bubble level and pulled it out and said his trustly level that he has used for years was "better than that damn little bubble thing". Hmmm, I hope my AT9 is align well. :rolleyes:


Good grief Charlie Brown, what a jerk!
The idea is for the bubble level to remain so that later on if/when dish realignment is ever in question or needs touching up, you need only look at the bubble to see if the mast is still dead-level and plumb.

My .sig would seem to apply in this particular case.
The Cable and Satellite TV industry does not hold the patent on alienating its customers, but COMCAST in particular has succeeded in making an art form of it, garnering them the distinction of "Most Universally Despised" of all PAY-TV providers in the industry.

#26 OFFLINE   Cap'n Preshoot

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 06:35 PM

H20 receivers seem to display 10-20% lower than other receivers on the same dish.


Complete and utter nonsense!! (level of 70 shown for TP #26 in foto is abnormal - the abnormal part is that there's any measurable signal there at all since TP26 I believe is the spot beam for San Antonio)

http://www.dbstalk.c...52&d=1154046735

Attached Thumbnails

  • IMG_1735.JPG

The Cable and Satellite TV industry does not hold the patent on alienating its customers, but COMCAST in particular has succeeded in making an art form of it, garnering them the distinction of "Most Universally Despised" of all PAY-TV providers in the industry.

#27 OFFLINE   Cap'n Preshoot

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 07:19 PM

I'm just alittle above and to the left of the "Y" in Youngstown.

My D* when out for 3 minutes and then returned.

Come on, this does not look that bad. Should I expect a outage over a little rain come through?

The WAF drop again tonight. I don't know if she will let me now put on a 76cm (30") dish nor to I think it will change that much.


What are your signal strength readings for transponders #4 and #20 on the 101 sat? Given your location I would expect these two should be well up there, certainly in the 90s and approaching 100
The Cable and Satellite TV industry does not hold the patent on alienating its customers, but COMCAST in particular has succeeded in making an art form of it, garnering them the distinction of "Most Universally Despised" of all PAY-TV providers in the industry.

#28 OFFLINE   Cap'n Preshoot

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 07:38 PM

Is this entire thread trying to explain thet the H-20s signal is okay if it is in the 70s?



Quite the contrary. If the H-20s signal levels are in the 70s on the 101 bird, you might want to go outside and cut down whatever it is that's blocking it ;) (far northern locales notwithstanding)

#29 OFFLINE   Cap'n Preshoot

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Posted 28 July 2006 - 11:15 AM

Cap'n Preshoot - Where did you find the spec (gain) on the AT9?



Still no specs found on the AT9. However, my satellite guy that does the big commercial systems in town did find some antenna design engineering info which suggests that using the same physical sized reflector and approx same focal length to the LNB that Ka performance would be approx 5 dB greater than at Ku frequencies.

The problem is Ka (20 Ghz) suffers more from atmospheric absorption (rain fade) than Ku (12 Ghz) so we may find out that real world performance is at best equal.
The Cable and Satellite TV industry does not hold the patent on alienating its customers, but COMCAST in particular has succeeded in making an art form of it, garnering them the distinction of "Most Universally Despised" of all PAY-TV providers in the industry.

#30 OFFLINE   Rob67

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Posted 29 July 2006 - 10:18 AM

Does not the distance from the new AT9 dish to the reciever have a big impact? Or so I was told.

#31 OFFLINE   Cap'n Preshoot

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Posted 29 July 2006 - 10:59 AM

No more so than it does for any other dish. Signal is signal. It all suffers from feedline losses which is one of many reasons they recommend RG6. However, in my own installation where you see those 90s and 100 readings on my H20 receiver (photo above), the feedline length between the dish and receiver is approx 100 feet.

#32 OFFLINE   carl6

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Posted 29 July 2006 - 06:20 PM

The AT9 is a bit more critical with regard to cable length due to the DC current draw at the dish. That is why DirecTV recommends/specifies using RG6 with solid copper center conductor for the AT9 - less DC voltage drop than with copper clad steel. If you drop too much voltage in the feedline, the LNB assemblies may not function properly.

As far as the signal from the dish to the receiver, it should be no more critical than with any other dish.

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#33 OFFLINE   D-Bamatech

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 10:04 AM

H-20 WILL show ALOT less. (no Doubt). R-15 ALSO shows about 4 to 5 pioints less ALSO. Same dish same MSW. Same cable run.

Personally here in the southesast. It doesnt matttter if is a P3 18/20 OR the At-9 , If ya get 84% on trans 1 on the 101 with the h-20. YOU ARE MAX-ed!.

Standard ird's(d-11) will show 98% on the same transponder.

Did 2 this week.

PS. you people getting these at-9 put on your roof are Not thinking!> There ARE quite the horror stories over these "wanna be" HSP techs doing this. What about a lady calls and says >" my sig went out".. Then a few min passes.. she calls again= "Hey not only do i not have TV.. i have water running on my head". TRue story and Not the only one of this nature by far!.

IF the techs do NOT use a tri mast support bracket system on the install. Then DO NOT have the thing put on the roof. Pay for a 2" pole mt if ya have too. Trust me. Lol.

Ps. when the H-20 hit the market. I called DTv "insiders" and Excalimed the sig strength depiction (or lack of). From the horses mouth> "its normal and to be expected). he he..

Those of you that have a Tivo AND a r-15. Go check your sig's. You'll see a small variance there also most likely in the sig depiction per IRD.

As for the D-tech post of the At-9 install. Brother you better call and raise Cane. That thing "aint" gonna stay if it doesnt have lag bolts hitting Real attic studs period or dont have the tri mast support brackets. Dont become "that story" above. Another story is a storm came : "dish weight and roof adaption wasnt to par and was another HSP hurry up offense install. = Result> an AT_9 swinging by cble through a large glass window. Lmao.. another true story.

Anybody thinking of getting this thing(at-9). Get a local install outfit and Keep that HSP racket away from your house. History says so trust me.

Untrained, no tenure, and forced to hurry due to overloaded wk schedules or face fines> who suffers. hmmmm.. that would be YOU the cust now wouldnt it.

Funny now that DTV periodically tells its own cust to call "someone else" other than THEIR approved and contract hOlding home service providers.. got a call 2 days ago from this same senerio as a matter of fact. Install date is so far out that DTv told their OWN cust to call me Because of Bruister (HSP) and their well known BS in this area. Public perception IS now in the gutter. DTV has a ******* child as a HSP around here and they Know it!

Quality and time out from order to install is a JOKE. Serv calls from the Bruister racket and All these subs they use is aweful!. heck the HSP's now days are nothing but call centers. The work due to no staff or qualified techs is then subbed to some other fly by night outfit. you dont even have a true HSP tech most of the time at your hm period.

Ive been after 3 Hsp installs in 2 days as a matter of fact. 1 At-9 was also in this mix and debachery!

CALL LOCAL approved DTV authorized dealers. This racket of the HSP is not for any home owner to experience Imho.! I SEE it evey **** day!

Enough rambling of truth... But yeah the H-20 shows 84% at its Max sig in the southeast. Ive never scene it any higher on the 101 trans 1 . Network 99 and the 119 will be higher though. Net 99 will max out at 100% if the thing is done right. Funny i dont ever see what i read here.. wonder why that IS..? hmmmm im paid properly, the job is done way beyond required and the cx smiles and there is NEVER a serv call. = STAY AWAY FROM THE HSP & Get a technicians not just "some installer".. there is a great difference in the 2 words of description (tech vs installer = night and day).

#34 OFFLINE   Cap'n Preshoot

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 10:31 AM

H-20 WILL show ALOT less. (no Doubt). R-15 ALSO shows about 4 to 5 pioints less ALSO. Same dish same MSW. Same cable run.

Personally here in the southesast. It doesnt matttter if is a P3 18/20 OR the At-9 , If ya get 84% on trans 1 on the 101 with the h-20. YOU ARE MAX-ed!.


How do you explain the 94 on TP 1 and the other 90s and 100s shown on the H20 snapshot posted above in this same thread? That isn't trick photography and I'm not in here schilling for D*. In that photo the H20 is connected to a Winegard DS3101 (1-meter dish) through an A/B switch, proving that if the signal is there the H20 will proudly display it.

Agreed, the AT9 does NOT belong on your roof unless the installer hits a main attic stud (rafter) with the main foot as well as with both of the strut rods. Three-point contact, all three into studs/rafters, not roof decking material. No exception, period. Please note the period. That dish weighs 32 pounds and has 5-1/4 square feet of wind load surface area. It has absolutely got to be anchored solidly.
The Cable and Satellite TV industry does not hold the patent on alienating its customers, but COMCAST in particular has succeeded in making an art form of it, garnering them the distinction of "Most Universally Despised" of all PAY-TV providers in the industry.

#35 OFFLINE   D-Bamatech

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 11:13 AM

Dont know where a got the 90 from lol... Ive never scene it. BUT i do notice your "shot says" 101 net (0)..

I just print what my HANDS see and feel. I dont want to be tooooo cocky here but bro you are talking to a 12 yr DTV (and every sat dish made for that matter) TECHNICIAN. From 3 weeks after DTV hit the sky as a matter of fact.

And FYI the dish doesnt weigh 32 lbs. Try in the upper 40"S. Ups stamps it at 45 lbs in the ship. its closer to 50 lol..


Heck this thread made me just check the diff readings from the Old Hughes gxe tivo i have and the r-15 hooked to the same tv. (i use i piority AV switch + turn off one the other appears. No buttons. nothing).. And the r-15 shows 93-94 and the OLD tivo shows 97/98 trans 1. So my conclusion IS every advanced rec DTV makes now days as new production market to cust shows less than ANY stand rec or old rec made period> end of sentence. .

I have No idea how ya got the 90 reading. You must BE the only one in the country or something. An thats a H-20 with a at-9?. I dont doubt ya.. I just KNOW what i SEE tangibly every week. Ive done 4 At-9's in about 7 days. Nothing over 84% trans 1 and never saw any higher since the induction of the H-20 even when we were still on the P3 18/20> Like i said doesnt matter what dish is attached. It freaked me out when the 2nd H-20 i ever saw did the same. I pulled a string and went to talking. Answered w/ the measuring software included within the H-20 and considered normal. Since then i walked on. And every d-11 will be (when IM trough w/the at-9) at 98% here trans 1.

Also, BTW not to be grandious. But you just may be talking to the first tech in the central part of this state to ever touch a AT-9.

Roof > Nada.. > of all of them ive done ive only put 2 on a structure period. ALL i do (75$ extra charge though) are on 16 guage 2' poles. The pole has 2 holes in the bottom about 6 inches up that i put a Dial pin through. (usually a 1/2 long bolt w/ nut). This is when the concrete set completely there IS NO twist(or spin) to occur withi the footing/ concrete. ITS THERE!. If there is No dial pin of sorts in the pole... well a round pole will spin now wont it. the installers now days are a pure joke dude. they have no clue. (lmao). the 2 on the structures = 1 car port (non living space and only reason was to obtain Line of site in a forest) with support struts from a FTA 1.8 > Real supports in other wards. The other on a barn. Each has/had. REaL roofing bul consuming the WHOLE foot and at each support bracket penetration.

The rest go on a pole... Lol... But then again i dont get paid this BS of today either. Each At-9 will pay me well over 225$ per .

i WOULD LIKE TO KNOW HOW YA SEE 90 THERE THOUGH. Heck i can peak to 100% on net 99 and 119 even and the h-20 shows 84% on the 101 every single time. he he..

#36 OFFLINE   jdspencer

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 11:20 AM

OK ...
Here is the radar of the weather ...

Posted Image

I'm just alittle above and to the left of the "Y" in Youngstown.

My D* when out for 3 minutes and then returned.

Come on, this does not look that bad. Should I expect a outage over a little rain come through?

The WAF drop again tonight. I don't know if she will let me now put on a 76cm (30") dish nor to I think it will change that much.

Looking at that radar, you have some pretty big thunderstorms to the SW. These are what block the signal from the sats. This is why you can get signal loss before the storm actually gets to your house.
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#37 OFFLINE   D-Bamatech

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 11:51 AM

OH i re-read. your on a wingard dish pointed straight at the local HD's? then using a AB to switch between 2 dishes > (?).

Hmmmmm. Then that says you only have ONE sig coming into the h-20 when the siwch "is clicked".. IS that Your set up?.. If so (one sig at a time>(?) elaberate please). Then ya may have just set a light off in my head. Lol.

So if one sig enters Only on the Ab sw .version then ya may have just found what causes the sig level desenigration when multiple sat inputs are occuring at one time.. hmmmmm.

Im just stabbing here.. hmmmm again.

What are ya pointing at with that w-guard btw.? Are ya a 2 dish solution with the AB sw?

#38 OFFLINE   D-Bamatech

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 12:07 PM

Oh another thing. Just this week ONLY after the download of the software to obtain the h-20 rec of hdlocals/ network ,, the thing wont even recognize the The 99 with a sig display period. (2 this week did this). channels visible w/o a H-20 meter display period on the 99. i fixing to call "that special somebody" again looks like.. But i think DTv is messing around up there some.. who knows.

Had a few other techs from across the country write/call me also this week w/ concern of transponder readings on the 3 nominal sats also. Now i didnt see what they described but its not just coinsidence.. cant be.. too many e-mails and calls to be isolated. i think DTv played with something this week.. Dont know what.. But something anyway... (chuckle)

#39 OFFLINE   scott T

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 12:07 PM

Comparing apples to oranges. :grin:

How do you explain the 94 on TP 1 and the other 90s and 100s shown on the H20 snapshot posted above in this same thread? That isn't trick photography and I'm not in here schilling for D*. In that photo the H20 is connected to a Winegard DS3101 (1-meter dish) through an A/B switch, proving that if the signal is there the H20 will proudly display it.



... I have No idea how ya got the 90 reading. You must BE the only one in the country or something. An thats a H-20 with a at-9?.



The Winegard DS3101 has about 6dB of gain more than the 18". The LNB capture footprint on the AT9 is about the sames as the 18".

Cap'n Preshoot, I love your setup. I'm planning on adding the Winegard 76cm dish. I wish could add the 100cm, but I would have a problem hiding it. I'm on a corner lot. :nono: Its like have three front yards.
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#40 OFFLINE   D-Bamatech

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 12:11 PM

A 18"??? HUH? No kidding (winguard VS a 18) i thought we were talking AT-9 in a compariosn. that 18 vs the Big "swath of the" winguard .. Your right = apples and oranges.

Foot print gain IS close your also right between the 18 and the AT-9


maybe i type faster than i read.. (?) Huh?

What *IS his set up.. Now im lost... .?

i just know that with a production DTV branded dish what happens.. i SEE it every day..




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