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Guest Message by DevFuse

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HR20: Hard Drive Upgrade


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212 replies to this topic

#26 OFFLINE   gr8reb8

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 04:24 PM

Gotchaa,

Any updates? Does it appear that the recorder is using the full 500Gb?

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#27 OFFLINE   Gotchaa

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 04:40 PM

Gotchaa,

Any updates? Does it appear that the recorder is using the full 500Gb?



I should know in 5 hours or so, before leaving this morning I had a warning messaging saying I had less than 10% left, in check MYVOD it reported 0% available yet was still recording. All programs are MPEG2 HD, so I will tally it up and report back.

I do think I am getting the full space of the 500GB drive, but can't know for sure until the 300GB is full as well. I'll post some info from both boxes.

#28 OFFLINE   PoitNarf

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 05:06 PM

Have you tried hooking up the drive back to a PC to look at it's contents? I'm sure you won't be able to play any of the stored shows, but I bet a couple of us are curious about the file system and structure on the drive. Interesting possibilities for archiving with a e-SATA drive if each show has it's own directory or something similar.

#29 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 05:19 PM

Have you tried hooking up the drive back to a PC to look at it's contents? I'm sure you won't be able to play any of the stored shows, but I bet a couple of us are curious about the file system and structure on the drive. Interesting possibilities for archiving with a e-SATA drive if each show has it's own directory or something similar.


That last part of your post; being able to create your own directory structure.
Re-Post that to the "thoughts on how to use the eSATA drive". that is a really good idea
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#30 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 05:21 PM

To everyone (since there are a TON of new people)

A word of warning... as DBSTalk doesn't want to go down the path of discussion of "hacking" and un-authorized extraction... I don't want to see (and can't really allow) any discussions about what the file system might look like and how to work with it for anything remotely close to extracting or accessing the data on the drives.

Sorry......

There are really only three areas we frown on here:
1) Access Card manipulation
2) Obtaining services you are not legally/technically allowed to get (or avoiding paying for)
3) Accessing the encrypted contents of the data stream or the drive...
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#31 OFFLINE   gr8reb8

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 06:03 PM

I like the idea of having the capability to add a new larger drive. Perhaps in a year or two, a Terrabyte drive will be available for less than $100.

#32 OFFLINE   PoitNarf

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 06:10 PM

I like the idea of having the capability to add a new larger drive. Perhaps in a year or two, a Terrabyte drive will be available for less than $100.


I'd say more like 4 years for them to become that cheap

/edit
After just checking current hard drive prices, maybe 2 - 3 years instead, heh

#33 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 06:11 PM

I like the idea of having the capability to add a new larger drive. Perhaps in a year or two, a Terrabyte drive will be available for less than $100.


Heck in a year or two... you will probably have multi-terrabyte units
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#34 OFFLINE   PoitNarf

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 06:29 PM

Anyone have any idea if this could possibly work? It's way overkill for me, but I bet some others would be drooling at this possibility:

http://www.usb-ware....r-enclosure.htm

The disclaimer reads: "Requires a SATA host controller that supports port multipliers"

Does the HR20 SATA controller support this functionality?

#35 OFFLINE   smb3d

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 06:42 PM

Anyone have any idea if this could possibly work? It's way overkill for me, but I bet some others would be drooling at this possibility:

http://www.usb-ware....r-enclosure.htm

The disclaimer reads: "Requires a SATA host controller that supports port multipliers"

Does the HR20 SATA controller support this functionality?


Sweet Jebus, fill that thing up with five 750GB drives and your good for at least 600 Hours of MPEG-4 HD.

#36 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 07:05 PM

I don't think it will support it yet...

But wow... one can hope.
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#37 OFFLINE   Clint Lamor

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 07:41 PM

2) Obtaining services you are legally/technically allowed to get (or avoiding paying for)



Ya we frown upon you getting stuff legally here :lol:

I THINK he meant legally/tech NOT allowed to get.
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#38 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 07:44 PM

Ya we frown upon you getting stuff legally here :lol:

I THINK he meant legally/tech NOT allowed to get.


oops
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#39 OFFLINE   davefred99

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 08:46 PM

To everyone (since there are a TON of new people)

A word of warning... as DBSTalk doesn't want to go down the path of discussion of "hacking" and un-authorized extraction... I don't want to see (and can't really allow) any discussions about what the file system might look like and how to work with it for anything remotely close to extracting or accessing the data on the drives.

Sorry......

There are really only three areas we frown on here:
1) Access Card manipulation
2) Obtaining services you are not legally/technically allowed to get (or avoiding paying for)
3) Accessing the encrypted contents of the data stream or the drive...


I know your just protecting your butt, But I thats why I hate these forums. Because we are all treated like like third world citizens. No Free Flow of Information ! Censorship and big brother telling us what we can talk about. Let the politicians and lawers decide for us. We are just pawns in a big chess game.:rolleyes:

#40 OFFLINE   Gotchaa

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 09:31 PM

Okay since this morning I mentioned I saw disk space available an 0% available, and a disk space warning," The Recorder has less than 10% available disk space"

9 hours later I am still recording, I have approximately 77 hours of HD Mpeg2 programming on this 500GB HD. Looking at the current recordings, I still seem to be chugging away.

One interesting issue, I've been recording HDnet, and Wag the Dog and Simone follow each other, Simone being recorded now. When I went to view Simone, it started at -29 minutes (Wag the Dog), and continued to the play 1:26 minutes into Simone. So it appears with a near full disk, the playback is having some interesting effects on MYVOD's program start/stop time with recordings back to back on the same channel. From Simone, I tried rewinding to the beginning of the program and I was able to go back -1:00, a full hour into the preceding program "Wag the Dog" Very strange. So far it only seems to be the case with this current recording.

Based on what I've seen so far, it appears I am getting around 6GB/hr for MPEG2 based on WolfPack's analysis of previous MPEG2 recordings. If this is correct, I should be at about 462GB, and have about 6 hours of more HD recording time.

So it appears from this layman test, the MYVOD remaining disk space will only indicate the percentage remaining for a 300GB drive, while recording will continue until the actual drive space is full.

Once it does fill up and stop, I will pull the drive out and see if I can figure out actual disk space usage.

I've had a hard time using a SATA sil3144 PCI card with Knoppix 5, and GenToo Linux LiveCD. Ubuntu is next. Can't seem to get the device recognized. Needless to say, this appears to be a SATA RAID card that I picked up, so I am not sure if there are drivers for it. I don't know if I am going to be able to actually look at the drive without another SATA card.

If anyone is curious about SATA support on Linux, I found a good FAQ which I still have to read through:

http://linuxmafia.co...dware/sata.html

#41 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 10:19 PM

I know your just protecting your butt, But I thats why I hate these forums. Because we are all treated like like third world citizens. No Free Flow of Information ! Censorship and big brother telling us what we can talk about. Let the politicians and lawers decide for us. We are just pawns in a big chess game.:rolleyes:



Problem is... once the Politicians and Lawyers get involved.... Forums like this are closed and they never recover.

So for certain topics, we simply can't go down that route.
It has taken years to get this particular forum where it is at today... And years of hard work of those that came before me, and the members that have built this forum to where it is today.... would be gone in a blink.

So at least in this case... this isn't Big Brother persay (in the normal conotation)... this is more of nipping a problem in the bud... before it becomes a problem..

Sorry...
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#42 OFFLINE   Wally_Gator

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 07:57 AM

Gotchaa....
I am very curious about this "Upgrade" test... It will be interesting to see the filesystem it uses. Anyone taking bets? Sounds like the two frontrunners are win32 and NFS..
I doubt that you will be able to pull A recording for archival purposes. Most likely the files are in blobs and or marked using some obscure naming scheme. These are probably cross refrenced to a database stored on the HD.
As far as viewing the files on a PC, I am sure D* will never add that functionality. The reason I say this is that we are told the stream is recorded directly to the HD and only decoded at the time of viewing. In order to allow a person to copy it to a PC, one of two things will have to happen. 1. The streams are decoded and then stored on the HD. 2. D* will have to sell and support decoding hardware and software for PC's..
For now, I just want to know if I can add more Disk space..
But curious about the inner workings as I am a Tech head..

#43 OFFLINE   Wolffpack

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 10:19 AM

Gotchaa....
I am very curious about this "Upgrade" test... It will be interesting to see the filesystem it uses. Anyone taking bets? Sounds like the two frontrunners are win32 and NFS..

I'm betting the filesystem is some *ix variant (ext2 or ext3). However, it wouldn't surprise me to learn it's the same as the R15 which will appear as FAT32. There is an outside chance there may be unrecognizable partitions on the drive such as the MFS on Tivo drives.
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#44 OFFLINE   Gotchaa

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 11:27 AM

Okay it looks like I am maxed out at 82-83 Hours of HD. All programs are kept till I delete.

Weird things start to happen, for example if I try to record anything now, it doesn't tell me can't do it, it will allow it, as well as displaying it's recording three things at the same time, but I can easily flip through channels without warning of recordings taking place. So I can officially call the drive maxed out.

I wasn't able to get the drive recognized with the SATA card I have other than with Maxtor's diagnostic tools, so no luck. I will see about picking up another card to test out, but for purposes of this layman fill up the drive to the max test, I am done.

When someone can confirm how much HD they can squeeze on a 300GB drive, we should have the definitive answer.

What it appears like is the HD upgrade is possible with a 500GB drive, just drop it in and reboot.

FYI, the Maxtor drive I'm using was $179, has 16MB cache and is a SATA II jumpered to 1.5gb transfer speed. It is a slight bit louder than the Seagate, it does not support AMSET, and while it does have SMART enabled, the internal temperature does not read back to the HR20.

I would recommend looking for a Seagate drive if any of this matters to you, my external Seagate drive did register it's temperature, so there must be some specific call from the OS to the drive to read the status.

#45 OFFLINE   cabanaboy1977

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 12:43 PM

Weird things start to happen, for example if I try to record anything now, it doesn't tell me can't do it, it will allow it, as well as displaying it's recording three things at the same time, but I can easily flip through channels without warning of recordings taking place. So I can officially call the drive maxed out.


I wonder if that has anything to do with the buffer. From what I remember people saying about the R15's buffer it takes it's HD space from the MYVOD part of the HD space not the Showcase part. Maybe something in that logic is making it messup and not letting it know that it's full?
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#46 OFFLINE   Wally_Gator

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 01:44 PM

Now, How could you tell the drive temp? Hidden menu?

#47 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 02:05 PM

Now, How could you tell the drive temp? Hidden menu?


Menu->Setup->System Information->Info

Scroll down, System Temperature.
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#48 OFFLINE   P Smith

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 02:06 PM

<..>I would recommend looking for a Seagate drive if any of this matters to you, my external Seagate drive did register it's temperature, so there must be some specific call from the OS to the drive to read the status.

Would be 750 GB disk from Seagate next candidate ?

#49 OFFLINE   Wally_Gator

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 02:41 PM

I am looking at the DB35 series from seagate...

#50 OFFLINE   Gotchaa

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 08:46 PM

I don't see why the 750GB drive would not work.

For me, the price point of $179 for a Maxtor 500GB HD just seemed right. The Seagate 750GB external at Fry's was $479 I believe. It's simple enough to switch ports to use an external drive. I may give it a try, but I am hoping someone else can take up that task, and report back, I've got a bunch of crap to purge now!




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