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HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray War Thread - Update: Toshiba formally announces end of HD DVD


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#21 OFFLINE   Chris Blount

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 12:51 PM

Chris, it's a common misconception that people with hearing losses or inability to hear extreme high or low frequencies won't benefit from high end sound systems. In actuality, the reverse is probably true, due to their more accurate reproduction of sound. You can perform a simple test -- listen to some music with wide dynamic range on a portable radio or common car radio or a low cost sound system, then listen to the same msic on a quality sound system. Although this is an oversimplification, I'd be surprised if you didn't notice the difference.

There's no doubt that there's a difference but for those with hearing loss and tinnitus, is it really worth it? I guess that would be a personal decision.

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#22 OFFLINE   Mavrick

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Posted 01 May 2007 - 07:30 AM

Well I finally bought an HD-DVD player yesterday when my old standard DVD player died and my HD TV was crying for Hidef DVD and I could not see spending more money on and SD Player.

So I choose HD-DVD over Blu-Ray mostly because of the price and I could not be happier with the decision. Now that I have bought the HD-DVD player I look for the announcement any day that Blu-Ray is the format winner for that is just how my luck seems to go. :)

#23 OFFLINE   TheRatPatrol

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Posted 01 May 2007 - 07:41 AM

The HD DVD vs. Blu-Ray format war will not be
won by either format, but by dual-format players.

I agree, just make players that can play all formats and be done with it. :D

#24 OFFLINE   Mavrick

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Posted 01 May 2007 - 07:43 AM

I agree, just make players that can play all formats and be done with it. :D


And under a thousand dollars please for I looked at the LG that will play both formats but was not about to drop $1000.00 for a DVD player.

#25 OFFLINE   Chris Blount

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Posted 01 May 2007 - 08:16 AM

Well I finally bought an HD-DVD player yesterday when my old standard DVD player died and my HD TV was crying for Hidef DVD and I could not see spending more money on and SD Player.

So I choose HD-DVD over Blu-Ray mostly because of the price and I could not be happier with the decision. Now that I have bought the HD-DVD player I look for the announcement any day that Blu-Ray is the format winner for that is just how my luck seems to go. :)

Congrats and welcome to the club. You won't regret your purchase and to tell you the truth, the format war will be a non issue once dual format players become the norm.

#26 OFFLINE   paja

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Posted 05 May 2007 - 07:02 PM

Well I finally bought an HD-DVD player yesterday when my old standard DVD player died and my HD TV was crying for Hidef DVD and I could not see spending more money on and SD Player.

So I choose HD-DVD over Blu-Ray mostly because of the price and I could not be happier with the decision. Now that I have bought the HD-DVD player I look for the announcement any day that Blu-Ray is the format winner for that is just how my luck seems to go. :)


ENJOY! I got a Toshiba XA2 and could not be happier. Not only is the HD stunning(on my MITS 46231) but my SD DVDs never looked better.:)

#27 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 09:22 PM

I bought a Toshiba HD-A2 HD DVD player from Amazon. At the same time, I ordered a HDMI switcher from Monoprice.com, since my Sony HDTV has only one HDMI input, and I also have an HD TiVo. Upon receiving the two units, I hooked them up and loaded up a DVD to see how upconversion would work. Less than 5 minutes into the movie, I was greeted by a black screen and loss of audio. I was going out of town for a week, so couldn't troubleshoot at the time. Today, I received my "Planet Earth" HD DVD's from Amazon and decided to try one out. Same result as with the regular DVD. Apparently, the HDCP handshake fails at times when using the switcher, although I saw no error message on the DVD player display. I connected the HDMI output of the player directly to the HDMI input of the TV and the DVD now played perfectly. I seem to have seen something somewhere (perhaps on the Toshiba web site) that they advise against using a switch box. :(
BTW -- Planet Earth on HD DVD is awesome! It's quite different, hearing David Attenborough do the narration, rather than Sigourney Weaver. :D

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Family Room: Samsung UN60F7100 60" LED 3D TV; Samsung  BD-H5900 3D Blu-Ray DVD player; Yamaha RX-V663 AVR. Paradigm speakers - Focus fronts, CC170 center, PDR-8 subwoofer, Atom surrounds, ADP rear center; TiVo Roamio Plus DVR, Toshiba HD-A3 HD DVD player.
Bedroom: Vizio 42" 3D TV, Pioneer VSX-521-K AVR, Panasonic 3D DVD player, Energy Take Classic 5.1 speakers, Roku 2 XD, TiVo Premiere, Insignia HD radio tuner, Toshiba HD DVD player


#28 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 17 May 2007 - 04:28 AM

$200 In-store instant rebate on HD-DVD+TV combo buy

The Retail Bridge:

Companies supporting HD DVD are currently pushing big spring marketing and retail campaigns, including running in-cinema ads to promote the high def format for DVDs. The endeavor includes showing trailers promoting HD DVD before movie audiences. The trailers will play for four weeks, showcasing the audio and video quality and interactive features available with the format.

According to National CineMedia, the number the trailers are expected to reach about 30 million viewers, running across a network of 932 theaters and 12,000 screens nationwide, including top movie theater chains Regal, AMC and Cinemark. To augment the trailer campaign, Toshiba is offering a spring promotion for an instant, in-store rebate on select HD DVD players, bringing the price of some models down to $299.99. The efforts begin May 20 and end June 16.

Also, during the final week of the promotion, customers can buy any Toshiba HDTV 42-inches in size or larger along with any Toshiba HD DVD player and receive an instant $200 rebate in store on the collective purchase. In addition, consumers who purchase any Toshiba HD DVD player can also get five HD DVD titles for free, choosing from a selection of 15 movies. The offer is available through July 31.

Details on the promotion are available at http://www.toshibahddvd.com.

www.TheRetailBridge.com - used with permission

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#29 OFFLINE   uscboy

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Posted 21 May 2007 - 10:38 AM

Yep. Look at the Best Buy ad this week... sitting one above the other, Samsung
Blu-Ray for $699 after savings, Toshiba HD DVD for $299 after savings.

I don't care what kind of minimal lead Blu-Ray has RIGHT NOW... with prices like
that, they will lose unless they can get them under control. Joe 6-pack will not
spend $700 on Blu-Ray. They have the studio edge right now, but if the numbers
of units ends up like I think it will because of prices, then the Blu-Ray studios will
have to start going neutral and offering HD DVDs.

#30 OFFLINE   ibglowin

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Posted 21 May 2007 - 02:37 PM

Try some of the other ports on the HDMI switcher. I remember reading there was one port on that unit (Monoprice) that worked better than the others.

I bought a Toshiba HD-A2 HD DVD player from Amazon. At the same time, I ordered a HDMI switcher from Monoprice.com, since my Sony HDTV has only one HDMI input, and I also have an HD TiVo. Upon receiving the two units, I hooked them up and loaded up a DVD to see how upconversion would work. Less than 5 minutes into the movie, I was greeted by a black screen and loss of audio. I was going out of town for a week, so couldn't troubleshoot at the time. Today, I received my "Planet Earth" HD DVD's from Amazon and decided to try one out. Same result as with the regular DVD. Apparently, the HDCP handshake fails at times when using the switcher, although I saw no error message on the DVD player display. I connected the HDMI output of the player directly to the HDMI input of the TV and the DVD now played perfectly. I seem to have seen something somewhere (perhaps on the Toshiba web site) that they advise against using a switch box. :(
BTW -- Planet Earth on HD DVD is awesome! It's quite different, hearing David Attenborough do the narration, rather than Sigourney Weaver. :D


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#31 OFFLINE   Chris Blount

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Posted 21 May 2007 - 02:56 PM

Yep. Look at the Best Buy ad this week... sitting one above the other, Samsung
Blu-Ray for $699 after savings, Toshiba HD DVD for $299 after savings.

I don't care what kind of minimal lead Blu-Ray has RIGHT NOW... with prices like
that, they will lose unless they can get them under control. Joe 6-pack will not
spend $700 on Blu-Ray. They have the studio edge right now, but if the numbers
of units ends up like I think it will because of prices, then the Blu-Ray studios will
have to start going neutral and offering HD DVDs.

Agree. This is going to be an interesting war. BTW, Costco has them for $249!

#32 OFFLINE   4DThinker

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Posted 24 May 2007 - 06:49 AM

I think BluRay decks are going to have to hit that $249-$299 price before anyone declares the war over. And my guess is that you'll be able to buy an HD-DVD deck this Christmas for $199 or lower. If Walmart actually makes a deal with a manufacturer, they'll have a player for $149 as a thanksgiving black friday special, and all their HD-DVD movies on sale for perhaps $18.99.

Personally, I think HD-DVD could win if it would make deals with all the local rental outlets to be available at the same price to buy and rent as DVDs. Heck, even add a buck to the usual rental fee and they'd still win. In my little town the major grocery stores rent DVDs. I'll bet that more than 60% of rentals in this town are done when getting groceries. Yet no one is renting either BluRay or HD-DVD disks. The grocery store also sells a cheap DVD player for $29 (sometimes $19.99) just so no one passing buy will claim they don't rent movies becasue they can't afford a DVD player. If they'd sell a HD-DVD deck for $249 and have a huge assortment of HD-DVD movies to rent, they'd get thousands of "impulse" buys and HD-DVD would win. Better yet, put up a big 1080 LCD and have the latest HD movie playing as a demo. If the studios would provide a "clips" HD-DVD with short clips of all the latest HD-DVD movies to play in a loop, it would even improves rentals of those pricier "new releases". I can imagine a whole surround sound system with a good subwoofer installed in the back of my favorite grocery's DVD corner.

#33 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 08:10 AM

Warner Home Video said that it is the first studio to have sold more than 100,000 copies of a
single high-definition DVD title with "The Departed." The company attributed the milestone to
the fact that the movie was released on both Blu-ray and HD DVD. Warner is one of just two
studios to release films in both formats, with Paramount Home Entertainment being the other.
- SkyReport

No word on how many of the 100k copies of "The Departed" sold in each format.

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#34 OFFLINE   hdtvfan0001

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 09:42 AM

If you look at the numbers from Amazon, The Toshiba A2 is the #1 selling DVD player and #15 overall electronics item selling there. In addition, HD DVD sales are skyrocketing (The Matrix Trilogy is white hot in sales). In addition, the other Toshiba HD DVD format units are also selling very well.

Sorry Blu Ray...not only are you NOT winning the war, but now your losing the battles as well.

Between the PS3 lackluster sales, problems with numerous BRD titles/media, and problems with some of the equipment, HD DVD (at its lower price by far) has passed up Blu Ray this past weekend in sales of players and media.

Looking ahead, with the new HD DVD titles scheduled for June, July, and August...this will be a hot HD DVD selling season this summer. Blu Ray is going to be in a world of hurt at their much higher prices and with their shakey media.
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#35 OFFLINE   ibglowin

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 11:04 AM

No one is "winning this war" really sorry to burst your bubble.

One week its BD, the next its HD-DVD depending on what title is coming out that week. Way to early to gauge much of anything really. HD-DVD even had a 4-6 month head start out of the gate and BD has caught up to them and surpassed them on certain weeks for total media units sold to date. You mention "numerous problems" with BD titles. Care to elaborate? I own about 50 BD disc and have yet to experience a problem with one of them nor have I read much about any problems whatsoever with "shakey media" as you say. The new release of Pirates I and II on BD has required a JAVA update for new menus to work properly on some machines. Pretty straight forward and easy to fix IMHO. You didn't seem to mention any problems associated with HD-DVD disc for some reason. Guess you have never bought a "Combo Disc" from Universal and had to "boil it" in hot water to get it to play back properly only then to have the 2 layers physically break down and seperate later on.

For the record I am actually format neutral. I own a PS3 (great machine BTW) as well as an Xbox 360 addon drive connected to a PC. I have probably 3 times as many BD as HD-DVD for one reason. There is just not that much out there that is exclusive to HD-DVD that I really, really want. If I have a choice I will buy BD always over HD-DVD, its just that simple.

You can sell a lot of cheap HD-DVD players but what good does it do if you can't buy the movies you want to watch on it? Casino Royale, Pirates of the Carribean (or anything Disney or Sony Pictures for that matter). Not going to see them on HD-DVD thats for sure. As for a hot summer of hits from HD-DVD....

You have to be kidding. Here is the realease dates for this Summer on HD-DVD Its all old stuff and not much new and even fewer "blockbusters":

http://hddvd.highdef...leasedates.html

Here is the release dates for this Summer BD in comparision:

http://bluray.highde...leasedates.html

The only thing that won't be released on BD are the Universal titles. Even the Matrix, Batman Begins etc, will be out on BD sooner or later as they are Warner titles and they are not exclusive to HD-DVD in any way.

Its actually a pretty boring Summer for both formats outside of a few big names and most of those are coming out on both formats at the same time, day and date (300 for example).

Since AACS was cracked shortly after Xmas all of the studios have pretty much come to a grinding halt releasing much of the blockbuster stuff as they try and revoke player keys, force software upgrades and whatever else they can to counter the cracks in AACS. Even BD has been cracked which is why even BD titles have come pretty much to a halt as well (with many new titles now delayed) as they try and counter the cracks in their system as well. At least BD has another layer of protection (BD+) that can be used as a last ditch effort against piracy, something HD-DVD doesn't have.

The "war" is far from over and sadly the only people likely to lose out are the consumers as long as we have two incompatible formats. Our only hope really is a cheap "dual format" player that would take care of the problem once and for all. Since these are $1200 at the moment its probably not going to happen soon unless others jump on the dual format bandwagon and economies of scale start to kick in. So sit on the fence and wait for a winner to emerge or relax, go format neutral and enjoy the ride.


If you look at the numbers from Amazon, The Toshiba A2 is the #1 selling DVD player and #15 overall electronics item selling there. In addition, HD DVD sales are skyrocketing (The Matrix Trilogy is white hot in sales). In addition, the other Toshiba HD DVD format units are also selling very well.

Sorry Blu Ray...not only are you NOT winning the war, but now your losing the battles as well.

Between the PS3 lackluster sales, problems with numerous BRD titles/media, and problems with some of the equipment, HD DVD (at its lower price by far) has passed up Blu Ray this past weekend in sales of players and media.

Looking ahead, with the new HD DVD titles scheduled for June, July, and August...this will be a hot HD DVD selling season this summer. Blu Ray is going to be in a world of hurt at their much higher prices and with their shakey media.


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#36 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 11:22 AM

Mike, excellent post and in-depth discussion of the state of the BD vs HD DVD war.

Your post gets my vote for the DBSTalk "Post of the Week" award. :up:

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#37 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 05 June 2007 - 05:04 AM

The Retail Bridge:

Despite its $499 price tag, the new BDP-S300 from Sony was developed with cost-conscious buyers in mind. The manufacturer's earlier Blu-ray model, the BDP-S1, currently retails for $799.

"The BD format gained great momentum in the past several months, and we're going to capitalize on that with the new model," said Chris Fawcett, vice president of marketing for Sony Electronics' Home Product Division. "The player gives a broader consumer segment the opportunity to experience the exceptional quality of Blu-ray Disc format at a competitive price."

The BDP-S300 can output HD video in resolutions up to 1920 x 1080/24p and supports various formats including MPEG2, MPEG4- AVC and VC1. It includes the Dolby Digital Plus 5.1 audio codec, Sony's BRAVIA Theatre Sync and HDMI connections. The unit also features an analog component 1080i output and can upscale existing DVDs to 1080p via HDMI.

According to Sony, the BDP-S300 is set to roll out to national retailers "shortly."

www.TheRetailBridge.com - used with permission

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#38 OFFLINE   sansha

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Posted 05 June 2007 - 03:55 PM

But the toshiba Hd-a2 is only 1080i. The toshiba HD-Xa2 is 1080p and that runs $700, comparable to the blu-ray model in price.

#39 OFFLINE   sansha

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Posted 05 June 2007 - 04:37 PM

Here's new of a new blu ray player at a cheaper price -- from a circuit city email... oh, if they only had a good combo HD-blu & upconverting dvd player for that price!!

"Now this really IS news: Sony’s soon-to-be-released Blu-ray Disc
player (BDP-S300) is now available for pre-order on circuitcity.com
for only $499.99!

Like the Sony BDP-S1 Blu-ray Disc player, the new player allows
you to watch movies on your HDTV with 1080p high-definition
output, extraordinary sound and interactive on-screen menus.

But now you can also play audio CDs and enjoy BRAVIA
Theatre Sync, a feature which enables the player to communicate
with compatible Sony devices using HDMI connections.

The BDP-S300 is even smaller and sleeker, and it’s being offered at
a price lower than any other Blu-ray Disc player on the market.

So pre-order your Sony BDP-S300 Blu-ray Disc player today for
only $499.99 and see what you’ve been missing!"

#40 OFFLINE   machavez00

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Posted 05 June 2007 - 05:50 PM

But the toshiba Hd-a2 is only 1080i. The toshiba HD-Xa2 is 1080p and that runs $700, comparable to the blu-ray model in price.


we must also take into consideration that the vast majority of HDTVs in service are 720p/1080i, for which a 1080p player is useless. (unless the TV manufactures can do a hardware/software upgrade to 1080p)




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