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HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray War Thread - Update: Toshiba formally announces end of HD DVD


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#41 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 05 June 2007 - 06:04 PM

But the toshiba Hd-a2 is only 1080i.

And the HD-A20 is "1080p" and also has a $499 MSRP.

The toshiba HD-Xa2 is 1080p and that runs $700, comparable to the blu-ray model in price.

Comparable in price, but that doesn't take into account the relative value of each machine.

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#42 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 05 June 2007 - 06:08 PM

Like the Sony BDP-S1 Blu-ray Disc player, the new player allows you to watch movies on your HDTV with 1080p high-definition output, extraordinary sound and interactive on-screen menus.

Is BD's version of 1080p always 1080p/24?

#43 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 08:28 AM

"...weekly HD DVD player sales doubled in April"

The Retail Bridge:

Is HD DVD Really Winning The High-Def Format War?

According to a report released Monday by the admittedly biased HD DVD Promotional Group, HD DVD players accounted for 60 percent of all the high definition set-top players sold in the last month.

What's the catch? Let's just say that the $100 rebate on Toshiba's HD-A2 player and the free HD DVD movies it's been offering with purchase had something to do with it.

"Toshiba's latest promotional efforts are clearly resonating with consumers and showing that price is king when it comes to hardware," said Craig Kornblau, chairman of the North American HD DVD Promotional Group. "Behind the increase in sales for hardware and movies, you're seeing fundamentally lower manufacturing costs and ease of authoring for HD DVD. That's the type of model that can scale."

According to the report, weekly HD DVD player sales doubled in April when prices were cut from $499 to $399, and doubled again during the company's May promotion. As a result of the deal, customers have so far bought upwards of 150,000 HD DVD players, making the Toshiba HD-A2 the best selling next-gen DVD player on the market. In addition, an all time high of more than 75,000 HD DVD movie titles have been sold in the last month.

Despite the obvious, part of this has to do with an overall increase in high definition sales, Kornblau said. Consumers spent $5.2 million on HD hardware and content last week alone, representing a 31 percent jump in sales over the previous single-week record.

www.TheRetailBridge.com - used with permission

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#44 OFFLINE   n-spring

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 08:54 AM

TOKYO (Reuters) - Japan's Toshiba Corp. has slashed its sales target for high definition DVD players and recorders after disappointing sales in the U.S., putting a damper on prospects for one of its growth businesses.

"Sales in the U.S. have been slower than expected, and we are going to have to lower our U.S. sales forecast," said Yoshihide Fujii, head of Toshiba's digital consumer business.


The rest of the story is here.

#45 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 10:06 AM

It may be that you'll have to own both Blu-Ray and HD-DVD players or a dual format player in order to have access to all your favorite films, unless the studios finally break down and offer their product in both formats. The one thing that keeps people from selecting HD-DVD as their only player is the holdout of studios like Sony and Disney.

Why do I say this? It's less expensive to produce HD-DVD media than Blu-Ray. HD-DVD's can be produced on the same lines as conventional DVD's. Blu-Ray's big advantage has been disk capacity.

For audiophiles, the biggest disadvantage of the Toshiba HD-A20 is the fact that disks recorded with Dolby Digital Plus will play back in DTS format if your receiver doesn't have Dolby Plus capability.

Charlie
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#46 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 06:54 AM

CORRECTION -- In yesterday's "Is HD DVD Really Winning The High-Def Format
War?" (see post #43 above) the writer erroneously stated that "an all time high of
more than 75,000 HD DVD movie titles have been sold in the last month." In fact,
more than 75,000 titles were sold in the last week of May alone.

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#47 OFFLINE   ibglowin

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 07:50 AM

http://www.avsforum....ad.php?t=840632

Big BUY HD-DVD campaign in late May orver at AVS
Mike

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#48 OFFLINE   machavez00

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 05:38 AM

LOS ANGELES - Blockbuster Inc. will rent high-definition DVDs only in the Blu-ray format in 1,450 stores when it expands its high-def offerings next month, dealing a major blow to the rival HD DVD format. The move, being announced Monday, could be the first step in resolving a format war that has kept confused consumers from rushing to buy new DVD players until they can determine which format will dominate the market

Read the full story here

Wal-Mart has not weighed in with their choice. What happens if they choose HD-DVD and sell players and disks priced to move?

#49 OFFLINE   ibglowin

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 07:44 AM

Woa!

This is gonna shake things up a bit.
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#50 OFFLINE   Earl Bonovich

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 08:50 AM

LOS ANGELES - Blockbuster Inc. will rent high-definition DVDs only in the Blu-ray format in 1,450 stores when it expands its high-def offerings next month, dealing a major blow to the rival HD DVD format. The move, being announced Monday, could be the first step in resolving a format war that has kept confused consumers from rushing to buy new DVD players until they can determine which format will dominate the market

Read the full story here

Wal-Mart has not weighed in with their choice. What happens if they choose HD-DVD and sell players and disks priced to move?



I just finished with the story...

Here is my take:

I was in my hometown this weekend... and drove by the Blockbuster Video that I worked at for 5 years when I was a teenager... (so almost 20 years ago).

The Location.... over the past 5 years, has gone from 5 units in the stripmall, down to 3, then down to 1... and now... it is gone (closed on June 1st).

With the other Blockbuster closings over the last two years... there is actually now only 2 location2 in my hometown area... when in years past, there used to be 7. (I had to work them all at times).

What I will find more intresting, is what Blockbuster carries on their "mail" service... and what NetFlix decides on.

Hollywood Video... at least in our area, decided on HD-DVD (they don't have many titles, but they don't carry blu-ray, at least in my two local shops).

So while it may make a dent in the field... I think it is more of a factor that BBV can't afford to support both of them.... I barely think they will be able to afford the one.

IMHO... BBV and store-front video rental, is drastically on it's way down.
The movies are too expensive to rent ($5 a rental at our local BBV), as compared to the purchase price ($15 for SD-DVD on release week)... not sure what they will charge for Blu-Ray, but almost certain it will be as expensive if not more.

The little "Red-Box" company is making strides, at $1 a day, and just a little automated system outside the grocery store (we have about 8 locations that I know about in our area).

So while on the surface... It might seem like a big-blow.
I still feel it is going to be the online-renters, and the retail of those disks... that are going to make the big difference.

Really... what is going to make the big difference, is the content... right now, the studios are the one that have all the power to shift the argument to which one will win.

And as long as they are "pissing and moaning" about it, we the consumers will get stuck in limbo....
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#51 OFFLINE   dmspen

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 09:01 AM

Netflix carries HD DVD and has for a while now. I think this is why BB is going blu - just because the other guys aren't!

#52 OFFLINE   Tom Robertson

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 09:08 AM

I think one telling part of the story is the ratio of Blu-ray to HD they were renting. 7:3 is a much bigger differential than I expected this early in the format war.

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#53 OFFLINE   Michael D'Angelo

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:00 AM

Netflix carries HD DVD and has for a while now. I think this is why BB is going blu - just because the other guys aren't!


Netflix has HD DVD and Blu Ray. I get both from them.

#54 OFFLINE   BudShark

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:20 AM

Netflix carries HD DVD and has for a while now. I think this is why BB is going blu - just because the other guys aren't!


Yes - but to do a fair analogy:

Blockbuster online does and will continue to carry BOTH formats. This announcement pertains to Brick and Mortar stores only.

Everyone keeps touting this as a NetFlix win (I know you didn't - but I quoted your post so your getting wrapped up) - when in reality the Netflix/Blockbuster online debate is irrelevant to this post.

What is more important is the facts presented:
1) More titles in Blu-Ray with more studio support and more exclusives
2) Blu-Ray titles from shelves were churning more

In the end the format is irrelevant. The titles are what is important. And Blu-Ray has that right now - evidenced by studio support and B&M churn. Sales can be skewed easily by promotions (so - were those 5 HD-DVDs that were free with your player counted as sales? I bet they were!) and old titles. Rentals are more relevant to product/industry interest. For a format to be 'fresh' you want rental churn - that tells you what the mass consumer is doing, not the niche players.

Chris

#55 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:20 AM

IMHO... BBV and store-front video rental, is drastically on it's way down.
The movies are too expensive to rent ($5 a rental at our local BBV), as compared to the purchase price ($15 for SD-DVD on release week)... not sure what they will charge for Blu-Ray, but almost certain it will be as expensive if not more.

I very much appreciate the insight. "How the mighty have fallen" applies in many industries.

As I live in the land of Hollywood Video, there doesn't seem to be much room in my area for anyone else. The only other stores that seem to do a reasonable business are the ones that cater to the Latino and adult video viewers.

#56 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:29 AM

Here's a shuttlecock to volley about:

What are PS3 owners supposed to rent if not Blu-ray movies?

I just bought my HD-DVD player on Saturday, but I already had six or seven titles on my shelf. Given the current state of movies in the theater, I suspect that the only "exclusive" that Blu-ray has that I might miss is Casino Royale. I made a huge purchase at the Warner Brother's online store and a couple of really inexpensive titles at Costco ($19 for Batman Begins and Phantom of the Opera).

As I see it, Blu-ray announcing a number of future releases has been similar to DIRECTV listing all of the channels that it plans to carry.

I do like the idea that there are more players in the Blu-ray hardware camp, but it doesn't seem to have lead to affordable players nor recorders.

#57 OFFLINE   BudShark

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:55 AM

harsh - I don't get your PS3 owners comment. I guess they would rent the same thing an HD-DVD player owner would rent - DVDs. Not sure your point.

Also, in terms of the "exclusives" - it just depends on what you want. Based on the summer blockbuster series, of the big 3 movies (Shrek, Pirates, Spiderman), 2 of those will be Blu-Ray exclusives (as are the early versions which are already out). There's a lot of titles out for Blu-Ray NOW. I personally haven't seen Blu-Ray touting future releases anymore than HD-DVD.

I'm neutral in this game. I actually wanted HD-DVD to win for hardware reasons, but unfortunately I think I am going to have to go Blu-Ray (and this was before the Blockbuster announcement which is just another step). I agree with the earlier comment that Blu-Ray seems assurred of surviving. Now its just a matter of whether HD-DVD lives or dies.

Chris

#58 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 20 June 2007 - 05:39 PM

harsh - I don't get your PS3 owners comment. I guess they would rent the same thing an HD-DVD player owner would rent - DVDs. Not sure your point.

Also, in terms of the "exclusives" - it just depends on what you want. Based on the summer blockbuster series, of the big 3 movies (Shrek, Pirates, Spiderman), 2 of those will be Blu-Ray exclusives (as are the early versions which are already out). There's a lot of titles out for Blu-Ray NOW. I personally haven't seen Blu-Ray touting future releases anymore than HD-DVD.

I'm neutral in this game. I actually wanted HD-DVD to win for hardware reasons, but unfortunately I think I am going to have to go Blu-Ray (and this was before the Blockbuster announcement which is just another step). I agree with the earlier comment that Blu-Ray seems assurred of surviving. Now its just a matter of whether HD-DVD lives or dies.

Chris


Chris: Blockbuster is working with flawed data from last year. At the time, it was cheaper to get a PS/3 with Blu-Ray capability (figuring you were getting both an advanced game console and Blu-Ray player all in one) than to buy an HD DVD player. Now that Toshiba has been selling HD DVD players for as low as $268 and kicking in five free HD DVD's, there is probably a big turnabout in market share.
Blockbuster even admitted that the "PS/3 effect" probably had something to do with Blu-Ray disk popularity.
As to sheer number of titles available AT THIS TIME, I think HD DVD has the edge. The secret weapon of the Blu-Ray camp is the fact that Sony Pictures and Disney have stated that they plan to support only Blu-Ray. Not too surprising, considering they are founding members of the Blu-Ray alliance.

Charlie
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Bedroom: Vizio 42" 3D TV, Pioneer VSX-521-K AVR, Panasonic 3D DVD player, Energy Take Classic 5.1 speakers, Roku 2 XD, TiVo Premiere, Insignia HD radio tuner, Toshiba HD DVD player


#59 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 20 June 2007 - 09:41 PM

harsh - I don't get your PS3 owners comment. I guess they would rent the same thing an HD-DVD player owner would rent - DVDs. Not sure your point.

I was speaking of the dearth of PS3 titles at rental stores.

#60 OFFLINE   BudShark

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Posted 21 June 2007 - 07:42 AM

Chris: Blockbuster is working with flawed data from last year. At the time, it was cheaper to get a PS/3 with Blu-Ray capability (figuring you were getting both an advanced game console and Blu-Ray player all in one) than to buy an HD DVD player. Now that Toshiba has been selling HD DVD players for as low as $268 and kicking in five free HD DVD's, there is probably a big turnabout in market share.
Blockbuster even admitted that the "PS/3 effect" probably had something to do with Blu-Ray disk popularity.
As to sheer number of titles available AT THIS TIME, I think HD DVD has the edge. The secret weapon of the Blu-Ray camp is the fact that Sony Pictures and Disney have stated that they plan to support only Blu-Ray. Not too surprising, considering they are founding members of the Blu-Ray alliance.


Flawed original data or not - my point still remains. Rental is about current titles, and if you are Blockbuster and you look at the 'tea leaves' what do you think will be the top 5 rentals this Fall? Maybe the top 5 movies of the summer? Seems logical. And oh by the way - all 5 of those are on Blu-Ray. Only 2 on HD-DVD (unless studios change their declared allegiance). So.... who you gonna put your money on in the short term rental business?

Chris




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