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HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray War Thread - Update: Toshiba formally announces end of HD DVD


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#51 OFFLINE   dmspen

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 09:01 AM

Netflix carries HD DVD and has for a while now. I think this is why BB is going blu - just because the other guys aren't!

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#52 OFFLINE   Tom Robertson

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 09:08 AM

I think one telling part of the story is the ratio of Blu-ray to HD they were renting. 7:3 is a much bigger differential than I expected this early in the format war.

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#53 OFFLINE   Michael D'Angelo

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:00 AM

Netflix carries HD DVD and has for a while now. I think this is why BB is going blu - just because the other guys aren't!


Netflix has HD DVD and Blu Ray. I get both from them.

#54 OFFLINE   BudShark

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:20 AM

Netflix carries HD DVD and has for a while now. I think this is why BB is going blu - just because the other guys aren't!


Yes - but to do a fair analogy:

Blockbuster online does and will continue to carry BOTH formats. This announcement pertains to Brick and Mortar stores only.

Everyone keeps touting this as a NetFlix win (I know you didn't - but I quoted your post so your getting wrapped up) - when in reality the Netflix/Blockbuster online debate is irrelevant to this post.

What is more important is the facts presented:
1) More titles in Blu-Ray with more studio support and more exclusives
2) Blu-Ray titles from shelves were churning more

In the end the format is irrelevant. The titles are what is important. And Blu-Ray has that right now - evidenced by studio support and B&M churn. Sales can be skewed easily by promotions (so - were those 5 HD-DVDs that were free with your player counted as sales? I bet they were!) and old titles. Rentals are more relevant to product/industry interest. For a format to be 'fresh' you want rental churn - that tells you what the mass consumer is doing, not the niche players.

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#55 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:20 AM

IMHO... BBV and store-front video rental, is drastically on it's way down.
The movies are too expensive to rent ($5 a rental at our local BBV), as compared to the purchase price ($15 for SD-DVD on release week)... not sure what they will charge for Blu-Ray, but almost certain it will be as expensive if not more.

I very much appreciate the insight. "How the mighty have fallen" applies in many industries.

As I live in the land of Hollywood Video, there doesn't seem to be much room in my area for anyone else. The only other stores that seem to do a reasonable business are the ones that cater to the Latino and adult video viewers.

#56 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:29 AM

Here's a shuttlecock to volley about:

What are PS3 owners supposed to rent if not Blu-ray movies?

I just bought my HD-DVD player on Saturday, but I already had six or seven titles on my shelf. Given the current state of movies in the theater, I suspect that the only "exclusive" that Blu-ray has that I might miss is Casino Royale. I made a huge purchase at the Warner Brother's online store and a couple of really inexpensive titles at Costco ($19 for Batman Begins and Phantom of the Opera).

As I see it, Blu-ray announcing a number of future releases has been similar to DIRECTV listing all of the channels that it plans to carry.

I do like the idea that there are more players in the Blu-ray hardware camp, but it doesn't seem to have lead to affordable players nor recorders.

#57 OFFLINE   BudShark

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 10:55 AM

harsh - I don't get your PS3 owners comment. I guess they would rent the same thing an HD-DVD player owner would rent - DVDs. Not sure your point.

Also, in terms of the "exclusives" - it just depends on what you want. Based on the summer blockbuster series, of the big 3 movies (Shrek, Pirates, Spiderman), 2 of those will be Blu-Ray exclusives (as are the early versions which are already out). There's a lot of titles out for Blu-Ray NOW. I personally haven't seen Blu-Ray touting future releases anymore than HD-DVD.

I'm neutral in this game. I actually wanted HD-DVD to win for hardware reasons, but unfortunately I think I am going to have to go Blu-Ray (and this was before the Blockbuster announcement which is just another step). I agree with the earlier comment that Blu-Ray seems assurred of surviving. Now its just a matter of whether HD-DVD lives or dies.

Chris

#58 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 20 June 2007 - 05:39 PM

harsh - I don't get your PS3 owners comment. I guess they would rent the same thing an HD-DVD player owner would rent - DVDs. Not sure your point.

Also, in terms of the "exclusives" - it just depends on what you want. Based on the summer blockbuster series, of the big 3 movies (Shrek, Pirates, Spiderman), 2 of those will be Blu-Ray exclusives (as are the early versions which are already out). There's a lot of titles out for Blu-Ray NOW. I personally haven't seen Blu-Ray touting future releases anymore than HD-DVD.

I'm neutral in this game. I actually wanted HD-DVD to win for hardware reasons, but unfortunately I think I am going to have to go Blu-Ray (and this was before the Blockbuster announcement which is just another step). I agree with the earlier comment that Blu-Ray seems assurred of surviving. Now its just a matter of whether HD-DVD lives or dies.

Chris


Chris: Blockbuster is working with flawed data from last year. At the time, it was cheaper to get a PS/3 with Blu-Ray capability (figuring you were getting both an advanced game console and Blu-Ray player all in one) than to buy an HD DVD player. Now that Toshiba has been selling HD DVD players for as low as $268 and kicking in five free HD DVD's, there is probably a big turnabout in market share.
Blockbuster even admitted that the "PS/3 effect" probably had something to do with Blu-Ray disk popularity.
As to sheer number of titles available AT THIS TIME, I think HD DVD has the edge. The secret weapon of the Blu-Ray camp is the fact that Sony Pictures and Disney have stated that they plan to support only Blu-Ray. Not too surprising, considering they are founding members of the Blu-Ray alliance.

Charlie
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Family Room: Samsung UN60F7100 60" LED 3D TV; Samsung  BD-H5900 3D Blu-Ray DVD player; Yamaha RX-V663 AVR. Paradigm speakers - Focus fronts, CC170 center, PDR-8 subwoofer, Atom surrounds, ADP rear center; TiVo Roamio Plus DVR, Toshiba HD-A3 HD DVD player.
Bedroom: Vizio 42" 3D TV, Pioneer VSX-521-K AVR, Panasonic 3D DVD player, Energy Take Classic 5.1 speakers, Roku 2 XD, TiVo Premiere, Insignia HD radio tuner, Toshiba HD DVD player


#59 OFFLINE   harsh

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Posted 20 June 2007 - 09:41 PM

harsh - I don't get your PS3 owners comment. I guess they would rent the same thing an HD-DVD player owner would rent - DVDs. Not sure your point.

I was speaking of the dearth of PS3 titles at rental stores.

#60 OFFLINE   BudShark

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Posted 21 June 2007 - 07:42 AM

Chris: Blockbuster is working with flawed data from last year. At the time, it was cheaper to get a PS/3 with Blu-Ray capability (figuring you were getting both an advanced game console and Blu-Ray player all in one) than to buy an HD DVD player. Now that Toshiba has been selling HD DVD players for as low as $268 and kicking in five free HD DVD's, there is probably a big turnabout in market share.
Blockbuster even admitted that the "PS/3 effect" probably had something to do with Blu-Ray disk popularity.
As to sheer number of titles available AT THIS TIME, I think HD DVD has the edge. The secret weapon of the Blu-Ray camp is the fact that Sony Pictures and Disney have stated that they plan to support only Blu-Ray. Not too surprising, considering they are founding members of the Blu-Ray alliance.


Flawed original data or not - my point still remains. Rental is about current titles, and if you are Blockbuster and you look at the 'tea leaves' what do you think will be the top 5 rentals this Fall? Maybe the top 5 movies of the summer? Seems logical. And oh by the way - all 5 of those are on Blu-Ray. Only 2 on HD-DVD (unless studios change their declared allegiance). So.... who you gonna put your money on in the short term rental business?

Chris

#61 OFFLINE   djlong

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Posted 21 June 2007 - 08:04 AM

Personally, I think that if Universal decides to go both ways and add Blu-Ray, that will be the death knell for HD-DVD.

#62 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 21 June 2007 - 05:12 PM

I've spent a fair amount of time today looking for a complete listing of high definition DVD's (from both camps) and have come up empty. Seems I stumbled on one a month or two ago, and failed to bookmark it. Can someone feed me a link?

Charlie
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Family Room: Samsung UN60F7100 60" LED 3D TV; Samsung  BD-H5900 3D Blu-Ray DVD player; Yamaha RX-V663 AVR. Paradigm speakers - Focus fronts, CC170 center, PDR-8 subwoofer, Atom surrounds, ADP rear center; TiVo Roamio Plus DVR, Toshiba HD-A3 HD DVD player.
Bedroom: Vizio 42" 3D TV, Pioneer VSX-521-K AVR, Panasonic 3D DVD player, Energy Take Classic 5.1 speakers, Roku 2 XD, TiVo Premiere, Insignia HD radio tuner, Toshiba HD DVD player


#63 OFFLINE   ibglowin

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Posted 22 June 2007 - 09:42 AM

Here is my favorite site. They have pages for both formats. Nice site.

http://bluray.highde...leasedates.html

http://hddvd.highdef...leasedates.html
Mike

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#64 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 22 June 2007 - 01:15 PM

Here is my favorite site. They have pages for both formats. Nice site.

http://bluray.highde...leasedates.html

http://hddvd.highdef...leasedates.html


Perfect! Thanks, Mike!:goodjob: :joy:

Charlie
--------------------

Family Room: Samsung UN60F7100 60" LED 3D TV; Samsung  BD-H5900 3D Blu-Ray DVD player; Yamaha RX-V663 AVR. Paradigm speakers - Focus fronts, CC170 center, PDR-8 subwoofer, Atom surrounds, ADP rear center; TiVo Roamio Plus DVR, Toshiba HD-A3 HD DVD player.
Bedroom: Vizio 42" 3D TV, Pioneer VSX-521-K AVR, Panasonic 3D DVD player, Energy Take Classic 5.1 speakers, Roku 2 XD, TiVo Premiere, Insignia HD radio tuner, Toshiba HD DVD player


#65 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 02 July 2007 - 04:10 AM

The Retail Bridge:

Faced with a falling market share and recent wins for Blu-ray (like Blockbuster's announcement that it would phase out HD DVD rentals), Toshiba this week announced a firmware upgrade for its HD DVD players that will enable the downloading of web-enabled HD content.

"Through web-enabled network connectivity, HD DVD is unlocking the door to an entirely new world of entertainment and once again achieving another milestone in next generation DVD," said Jodi Sally, vice president of marketing with Toshiba's Digital A/V Group. "With HD DVD, studios have the ability to develop new and unique content for movie fans, enabling consumers to have an entirely new way to access entertainment and customize their home movie experience that is currently not available with any other format."

The upgrade allows Toshiba's HD DVD players to download bonus features from a movie studio's server or unlock content hidden on select discs. This information can then be stored on the player itself, "enhancing" the existing content. Users can also upload content and provide feedback on titles they like, don't like.

"While others may talk about interactivity, HD DVD has proven time and time again that it offers true interactive features and capabilities for consumers which can make the enjoyment of movies a new experience every time they're viewed," Sally said.

Toshiba is also making its promotional prices of $299.99 for the HD- A2 and $399.99 for the HD-A20 permanent and will, starting this September, upgrade both players to 24 frames-per-second.

www.TheRetailBridge.com - used with permission

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#66 OFFLINE   machavez00

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Posted 02 July 2007 - 04:46 AM

The makers of Digital Video Essentials have made their choice. I don't see a Blu version on the web site

For those of you with an HD-DVD player and those thinking of getting one. Combo disk so when you move up you are good to go!
Program notes (147 page pdf) http://www.videoessentials.com
Posted ImagePosted Image



#67 OFFLINE   Cholly

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Posted 02 July 2007 - 04:46 PM

Battle Won, War far from over. http://www.hdtvmagaz...e_won_war_i.php

Charlie
--------------------

Family Room: Samsung UN60F7100 60" LED 3D TV; Samsung  BD-H5900 3D Blu-Ray DVD player; Yamaha RX-V663 AVR. Paradigm speakers - Focus fronts, CC170 center, PDR-8 subwoofer, Atom surrounds, ADP rear center; TiVo Roamio Plus DVR, Toshiba HD-A3 HD DVD player.
Bedroom: Vizio 42" 3D TV, Pioneer VSX-521-K AVR, Panasonic 3D DVD player, Energy Take Classic 5.1 speakers, Roku 2 XD, TiVo Premiere, Insignia HD radio tuner, Toshiba HD DVD player


#68 OFFLINE   machavez00

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Posted 02 July 2007 - 06:56 PM

Time for Walmart's oft' denied sub $200 player to hit stores

#69 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 03 July 2007 - 05:48 AM

SkyReport:

Just when we thought HD DVD was down for the count, Amazon and Microsoft Monday announced plans to sell as many as 1,000 indie titles on HD DVD through Amazon's CustomFlix Labs DVD On Demand program in an effort to support grassroots filmmaking.

"From a technical standpoint, we found that the HD DVD format fits our business model perfectly," said Dana LoPiccolo-Giles, co-founder and managing director of CustomFlix. "With retail shelf space at a premium, our model eliminates the risk of carrying inventory and immediately expands the number of great HD DVD titles available to consumers."

The program, which will produce and ship HD DVD titles as they are ordered, is being touted as a more cost-effective way for small-time filmmakers to distribute their content in HD. Amazon and Microsoft will offer free authoring and HD setup services to up to 1,000 indie titles as part of the project.

For the HD DVD format, however, the partnership could also become a key promotional tool, getting HD DVD discs into the hands of the viewers that most value high definition. Amazon currently offers about 300 HD DVD titles compared to more than 400 in Blu-ray format.

And, of course, Amazon sells more than a few HDTVs and HD DVD players. Perhaps this program will help them move a few more of those.

www.SkyReport.com - used with permission

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#70 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 03 July 2007 - 06:20 PM

The European Union (EU) Commission asked several major Hollywood movie studios
today to defend their choice between the battling high-definition DVD formats of HD
DVD and Blu-ray. The international agency is seeking to find whether the studios are
breaking EU regulations that prohibit companies from shutting out rivals from a market-
place. Sony's Blu-ray has won support from Disney, News Corp.'s 20th Century Fox
and Sony Pictures, while GE's Universal Studios releases high-def movies exclusively
on HD DVD. Commision spokesman Jonathan Todd said regulators are only looking
for information on how studios choose which format to use for filmreleases at this stage
and had not accused the companies of violating antitrust law. - The Evening Bridge

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#71 OFFLINE   DCSholtis

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Posted 03 July 2007 - 06:33 PM

Well I bit the bullet and have entered the Blu Ray territory. Purchased the Sony BDP S-300 yesterday. Was feeling so good after that I went and bought the new Sanyo Xacti VPC-HD2 camcorder. Wish me luck. :D
Dan Sholtis
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#72 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 16 July 2007 - 04:24 AM

According to the blatantly biased European office of the HD DVD Promotional
Group, HD DVD players have outsold Blu-ray players in Europe by 3-to-1. The
group did not release sales data but claimed to have 74 percent of the market
for standalone players in Britain, Germany, France, Italy, Spain and Switzerland.
- SkyReport

Ed. note: :rolleyes:

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#73 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 17 July 2007 - 03:10 PM

HDTV Magazine:

HD DVD Outpacing All Next-Gen Formats in Sales Growth

by Shane Sturgeon

(excerpt)

At the Entertainment Merchants Association (EMA) Home Media Expo 2007, the North American HD DVD Promotional Group today announced that overall HD DVD hardware sales were up 37 percent from Q1 to Q2 2007, while software sales experienced a 20 percent increase in growth. The data is based on NPD reports, Nielsen Netratings reports and point of sale data from the studios. During the same time-frame, overall Blu-ray hardware sales saw a 27 percent decline from Q1 to Q2, and Blu-ray software sales were down 5 percent.

Driven by major spring marketing efforts which brought standalone HD DVD players down to an industry first $299, dedicated HD DVD CE players experienced an astounding 183 percent quarterly increase. There are currently more than 180,000 dedicated HD DVD CE players in the market. ...

More @ HDTVMagazine.com

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#74 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 06:46 AM

In an effort to promote Blu-ray technology, Walt Disney Studios has announced
Disney's Magical Blu-ray Tour, which will visit 18 malls across the country starting
Aug. 17. Sponsored by Panasonic, the tour aims to educate buyers about the
advantages of Blu-ray. - SkyReport

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#75 OFFLINE   Richard King

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Posted 25 July 2007 - 09:19 AM

Samsung Introduces Dual HD, Other New Hi-Def Players
http://www.dealersco...var=story#70750

Samsung Electronics announced Wednesday the upcoming release of a line of “third-generation” high-definition disc players, including the company’s first-ever dual-format player....

The dual-format player, known as the BD-UP5000 Duo HD Player, supports both the standard and interactive technologies of both Blu-ray Disc and HD DVD. It will debut in the fourth quarter of this year at a suggested retail price of $1,049.

More....
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