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New install - 2nd tuner doesn't work - 5x8 mulitswitch


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#1 OFFLINE   skaeight

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:12 AM

I still haven't posted the official update to my ordered a HR20 thread yet because I've been busy and afaik the install is not complete yet.

Here's the issue, my second tuner does not work on my brand new HR20. I've swapped the cables back and forth on them and I see no change (the problem follows the tuner, not the cable). I did call d* and they are shipping me a replacement (hopefully new, but we'll see), but I have some other concerns.

When the installer was at my place, I showed him where the multi-switch was installed and he looked at it and said "let me see if I have to replace this". This is a powered 5x8 multi-switch. He said, "oh, no I don't have to swap it out, it says on it that it passes the required frequencies". Is this possible? Or should have I really had him install the 6x8?

I am wondering if my second tuner not working might have anything to do with him not switching the multiswitch? I did a signal test and found that I am getting a signal on 99 & 103, and I also am getting YESH and SNYH which I'm pretty sure are MPEG-4. So everything appears to be working fine there.

From what I'm reading though, if I ever want to add an OTA antenna into the mix, I'm not going to be able to do this with the 5x8, correct?

This gets me mad, because he kind of breezed through checking the signal on the box, and should have seen that the second tuner was not working.

Please give me some advice on what to do.

Thanks

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#2 OFFLINE   PoitNarf

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:17 AM

If you're getting your locals in HD as well as YES HD and SNY HD then yes, it seems that you have a compatible multiswitch. You're correct that the OTA signal cannot be diplexed with the traditional multiswitches, but the newer SWM switches due to come out sometime this year will support OTA diplexing. Your tuner #2 not working even with swapping the cables would have nothing to do with the multiswitch, definitely a DOA tuner.

#3 OFFLINE   John4924

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:19 AM

I still haven't posted the official update to my ordered a HR20 thread yet because I've been busy and afaik the install is not complete yet.

Here's the issue, my second tuner does not work on my brand new HR20. I've swapped the cables back and forth on them and I see no change (the problem follows the tuner, not the cable). I did call d* and they are shipping me a replacement (hopefully new, but we'll see), but I have some other concerns.

When the installer was at my place, I showed him where the multi-switch was installed and he looked at it and said "let me see if I have to replace this". This is a powered 5x8 multi-switch. He said, "oh, no I don't have to swap it out, it says on it that it passes the required frequencies". Is this possible? Or should have I really had him install the 6x8?

I am wondering if my second tuner not working might have anything to do with him not switching the multiswitch? I did a signal test and found that I am getting a signal on 99 & 103, and I also am getting YESH and SNYH which I'm pretty sure are MPEG-4. So everything appears to be working fine there.

From what I'm reading though, if I ever want to add an OTA antenna into the mix, I'm not going to be able to do this with the 5x8, correct?

This gets me mad, because he kind of breezed through checking the signal on the box, and should have seen that the second tuner was not working.

Please give me some advice on what to do.

Thanks


Quick question: did he have BOTH tuner cables hooked up when you initially started up the HR20? I had an issue on two of mine that I hooked up the second cable AFTER I had booted up, and the second tuner would not work.

I then shut the unit down (unplugged - all power off), hooked up the second tuner cable, powered back up, and wala! the second tuner worked! :D so I would try this first.

As far as the multiswitch, I have the Zinwell 6x8 (unpowered) and it works just fine. Don't know about the 5x8

Cheers,
John

#4 OFFLINE   skaeight

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:20 AM

If you're getting your locals in HD as well as YES HD and SNY HD then yes, it seems that you have a compatible multiswitch. You're correct that the OTA signal cannot be diplexed with the traditional multiswitches, but the newer SWM switches due to come out sometime this year will support OTA diplexing. Your tuner #2 not working even with swapping the cables would have nothing to do with the multiswitch, definitely a DOA tuner.


Ok, that makes me feel a little bit better. So I guess I have a newer 5x8 multiswitch that passes the KA frequencies? I actually am getting HD locals out of NY right now as distants, so the only thing I'm actually getting via Ka is YESH and SNYH.

What exactly is the extra input on the 6x8 for?

I probably will still call and complain though once I get my replacement HR20. Theres a 50/50 chance I will put up an OTA antenna, and I really am entitled to have the 6x8 that should have been installed.

#5 OFFLINE   skaeight

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:25 AM

Quick question: did he have BOTH tuner cables hooked up when you initially started up the HR20? I had an issue on two of mine that I hooked up the second cable AFTER I had booted up, and the second tuner would not work.

I then shut the unit down (unplugged - all power off), hooked up the second tuner cable, powered back up, and wala! the second tuner worked! :D so I would try this first.

As far as the multiswitch, I have the Zinwell 6x8 (unpowered) and it works just fine. Don't know about the 5x8

Cheers,
John


Well, I think it's been rebooted a couple of times (it updated it's software) since the initial install and both cables were plugged in. The connections at the DVR/BBC however were a little loose and I don't think it's been rebooted since I tightened them.

When I get home I'll confirm they are tight and do a RBR. It would be great if that's all it was and I could keep my new HR20-100, because I'm willing to bet they're going to ship me a refurbed HR20-700.

#6 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:28 AM

Ok, that makes me feel a little bit better. So I guess I have a newer multiswitch that passes the KA frequencies? I actually am getting HD locals out of NY right now as distants, so the only thing I'm actually getting via Ka is YESH and SNYH.

I probably will still call and complain though once I get my replacement HR20. Theres a 50/50 chance I will put up an OTA antenna, and I really am entitled to have the 6x8 that should have been installed.

My two cents: you do want the Zinwell WB68 multi-switch for when the new SATs go active and use the 250-750 MHz band [Ka lo].
When you "test" swapping cables to see if it's your receiver that's bad, you will need to do a RBR to see if the #2 tuner is still bad. Without the RBR the second tuner was initialized.
A.K.A VOS

#7 OFFLINE   skaeight

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:30 AM

My two cents: you do want the Zinwell WB68 multi-switch for when the new SATs go active and use the 250-750 MHz band [Ka lo].
When you "test" swapping cables to see if it's your receiver that's bad, you will need to do a RBR to see if the #2 tuner is still bad. Without the RBR the second tuner was initialized.


Do you think they'll drop ship one to me, or will it be necessary for a tech to come out?

#8 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:35 AM

Do you think they'll drop ship one to me, or will it be necessary for a tech to come out?

You should be able to have them FedEx you a "replacement" [there is no telling what model -100/-700 or whether it is new or something else] & it should be 2-3 days.
A.K.A VOS

#9 OFFLINE   skaeight

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:37 AM

You should be able to have them FedEx you a "replacement" [there is no telling what model -100/-700 or whether it is new or something else] & it should be 2-3 days.


I'm sorry, I meant a multiswitch. I actually already have a "replacement" on the way. I told them I didn't want a refurb because I just got it brand new today. They said that if it's within a 30 day window they usually send new. We'll see about that :rolleyes:

#10 OFFLINE   John4924

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:40 AM

Well, I think it's been rebooted a couple of times (it updated it's software) since the initial install and both cables were plugged in. The connections at the DVR/BBC however were a little loose and I don't think it's been rebooted since I tightened them.

When I get home I'll confirm they are tight and do a RBR. It would be great if that's all it was and I could keep my new HR20-100, because I'm willing to bet they're going to ship me a refurbed HR20-700.


Another thing you may want to try is removing the BBCs, bringing both cables in direct, and rebooting? I do not have mine installed yet, but I may now to make sure they are not defective :)

#11 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:41 AM

I'm sorry, I meant a multiswitch. I actually already have a "replacement" on the way. I told them I didn't want a refurb because I just got it brand new today. They said that if it's within a 30 day window they usually send new. We'll see about that :rolleyes:

1) they have no control over what's on the shelf when your order is filled.
2) the multi-switch comes with [from] an installer. You might be able to buy one & have D* credit your account.
A.K.A VOS

#12 OFFLINE   John4924

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:43 AM

I'm sorry, I meant a multiswitch. I actually already have a "replacement" on the way. I told them I didn't want a refurb because I just got it brand new today. They said that if it's within a 30 day window they usually send new. We'll see about that :rolleyes:


I would not count on a brand new, because my first "brand new" was DOA, and sent a replacement, which was a HR20-700 "refurb". But you know what? It has been rock solid for over a month now...so the "refurb" is OK with me :)

#13 OFFLINE   PoitNarf

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:45 AM

When you "test" swapping cables to see if it's your receiver that's bad, you will need to do a RBR to see if the #2 tuner is still bad. Without the RBR the second tuner was initialized.


I actually recall that the sat cables needed to be connected while the HR20 was unplugged from power, a RBR isn't sufficient. Is this correct or is my memory shot?

#14 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:50 AM

I actually recall that the sat cables needed to be connected while the HR20 was unplugged from power, a RBR isn't sufficient. Is this correct or is my memory shot?

As they say: "the same thing" [RBR & power recycled].

CSRs now say to plug in the power cord last, so it doesn't start to boot until all of the cables are connected.
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#15 OFFLINE   skaeight

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:50 AM

I actually recall that the sat cables needed to be connected while the HR20 was unplugged from power, a RBR isn't sufficient. Is this correct or is my memory shot?


I'll give that a shot then. I'll unplug everything, then reconnect and make sure they're all snug. If that doesn't work, I'll shut everything down again and try swapping the cables. Finally I'll do the same again without the BBCs. Hopefully one of those will take care of the issue. I really didn't have much time to play around with it yesterday before I called them.

Once I get that issue sorted out I'll work on them giving me a credit for the 6x8 multiswitch. It seems like it might confuse the matter if I try to get two issues solved at once with d*.

#16 OFFLINE   skaeight

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 09:24 PM

My two cents: you do want the Zinwell WB68 multi-switch for when the new SATs go active and use the 250-750 MHz band [Ka lo].
When you "test" swapping cables to see if it's your receiver that's bad, you will need to do a RBR to see if the #2 tuner is still bad. Without the RBR the second tuner was initialized.


I just took a look at my multiswitch. It says it passes frequencies 54-2150 MHz. So it looks like it's ok, right?

Does anyone know exactly what the 6th input on the 6x8 switch does? Also, am I right that even with the 6x8 you can't diplex an OTA signal, because it conflicts with a Ka range?

If so, is it necessary to run a separate cable for OTA? I just watched 24 in HD and I really really really want to get an antenna up so I can get as much HD as possible :)

#17 OFFLINE   cruise350

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 09:33 PM

Its actually the 5th & 6th inputs since the 6X8 zinwell does not combine your OTA antenna signal. The 5th and sixth inputs are for the 2 new satellites that will come on line this year and will require 2 more lnbs added to your dish. The 2 lines from them will connect to the Aux 1 and 2 inputs on the multiswitch.

Your 5X8 will not be able to accomplish this so you will need a new multiswitch to get the future HD channels.

On your other questions, since you won't be using the lower frequency sats for a while you may combine the OTA signal with your current multiswitch and diplex it out before the hr20 if you want. Once the new birds are operational you will have to ensure you have a seperate line run for your OTA or hope they have implemented the SWMs by then.
1 HR21-100= HDMI direct to Sharp Aqous 52D82U LCD, Networked Wireless Bridge
1 HR22-100= HDMI direct to Panasonic 42" Plasma, Networked Wireless Game Adapter,Slingbox Classic
1 HR21-200= HDMI direct to Vizio LC420XVT, Wired Direct to Router, Slingbox Pro HD Connect
1 HR21-700= HDMI direct to Sharp 19" LCD/DVD HDTV, not networked
1 HR 20-700=HDMI 32" Vizio
1 HR20-100=In the Motorhome

#18 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:16 PM

I just took a look at my multiswitch. It says it passes frequencies 54-2150 MHz. So it looks like it's ok, right?

Does anyone know exactly what the 6th input on the 6x8 switch does? Also, am I right that even with the 6x8 you can't diplex an OTA signal, because it conflicts with a Ka range?

If so, is it necessary to run a separate cable for OTA? I just watched 24 in HD and I really really really want to get an antenna up so I can get as much HD as possible :)

Those frequencies "look good", but is that for all of the SAT feeds? Or are they for the switch [where they are counting an OTA pass through]? I would really need to see the specs for that switch to know. if this is the case then it will work now but not with the Ka lo signals. What has been stated, many times, is the need for the Zinwell Wide Band WB68.
The other two inputs would be to add other dishes [95 & 72.5 SATs].
Your OTA frequencies will go up to almost 900 MHz so you can see where they will be a problem.
While "right now" you could diplex them in, as soon as the new SATs start using Ka lo, it won't work. Why do it for the very short term when a coax will work for the long term.
A.K.A VOS

#19 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:21 PM

The 5th and sixth inputs are for the 2 new satellites that will come on line this year and will require 2 more lnbs added to your dish. The 2 lines from them will connect to the Aux 1 and 2 inputs on the multiswitch.

I don't think you're correct, as those " 5th & 6th" are for other SATs now that require other dishes to be added, while the new Ka SATs will not require any new equipment.
A.K.A VOS

#20 OFFLINE   Tom Robertson

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 11:05 PM

Its actually the 5th & 6th inputs since the 6X8 zinwell does not combine your OTA antenna signal. The 5th and sixth inputs are for the 2 new satellites that will come on line this year and will require 2 more lnbs added to your dish. The 2 lines from them will connect to the Aux 1 and 2 inputs on the multiswitch.

Your 5X8 will not be able to accomplish this so you will need a new multiswitch to get the future HD channels.

On your other questions, since you won't be using the lower frequency sats for a while you may combine the OTA signal with your current multiswitch and diplex it out before the hr20 if you want. Once the new birds are operational you will have to ensure you have a seperate line run for your OTA or hope they have implemented the SWMs by then.


The two other inputs on the 6x8 switches (both on the new wb68 and older models) are for receiving locals and international programming from two satellite slots: 72.5° and 95°. They are called flexports.

The two satellites about to launch will replace a portion of S1 and S2 filling in the Ka-lo bands from 99° and 103° that are not used to the home today. (They are used for uplinking to the regional and national broadcast facilities today.) So no new home equipment will be necessary--but you must have the BBCs (little gray boxes) in place to use the new satellites.

The reason most (read as ALL until someone actually makes one) 5x8 switches WILL NOT work is the Ka-lo frequencies are not switched properly by the 5x8 switches. They try to amplify and distribute OTA which overlaps with the Ka-lo. IF you have a 5lnb dish and more than 4 tuners, DIRECTV should have left a NEW 6x8 switch (the WB68).

Cheers,
Tom

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