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HD Problems Pinpointed, Now What?


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48 replies to this topic

#26 OFFLINE   kmkraft_1974

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 10:15 AM

after some extensive testing this morning, here's my latest:

1. old box with new BBCs.
a. audio drops with both coax cables connected to sat1 input
b. no audio drops with either coax cable connected to sat2 input

2. new box with new BBCs.
a. no audio drops with either coax cable connected to sat1 input
b. no audio drops with either coax cable connected to sat2 input

I'll keep watching for another couple of hours to make sure I don't have any audio drops. Again, this is just my case, and I realize others have luck with new BBCs and the "old box". Just wasn't happening for me.
NR | HR20-700 | WNC AU9, WB68 | Linksys WRT54G | 6 Mbps | Denon 2807 (HDMI) | Panasonic 42PX60U (HDMI)

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#27 OFFLINE   0x1b

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 11:37 AM

Hi!
I'm new to this so hopefully I am not repeating stuff people have already tried and discounted.
I have recently had a lot of audio and pixelation problems but last night tried a different approach to solving the problem. I noticed on the Info page that the internal receiver temperature was 172 degrees. This is awfully high so I placed a fan in front of the normally closed cabinet that holds my AV equipment. After an hour, the temperature dropped to 104 degrees and the problem with Tuner 2 went away.
I'm not sure if this is the same thing that others are seeing but I thought it might help isolate the issue.

#28 OFFLINE   kmkraft_1974

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 11:44 AM

Hi!
I'm new to this so hopefully I am not repeating stuff people have already tried and discounted.
I have recently had a lot of audio and pixelation problems but last night tried a different approach to solving the problem. I noticed on the Info page that the internal receiver temperature was 172 degrees. This is awfully high so I placed a fan in front of the normally closed cabinet that holds my AV equipment. After an hour, the temperature dropped to 104 degrees and the problem with Tuner 2 went away.
I'm not sure if this is the same thing that others are seeing but I thought it might help isolate the issue.


could very well be. its interesting that its now summer and the issue is cropping up. my old box operated at 105 with a fan on and I couldn't seem to draw any conclusions with temperature. the new box is right around 105 as well, no issues so far.
NR | HR20-700 | WNC AU9, WB68 | Linksys WRT54G | 6 Mbps | Denon 2807 (HDMI) | Panasonic 42PX60U (HDMI)

#29 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 11:51 AM

could very well be. its interesting that its now summer and the issue is cropping up. my old box operated at 105 with a fan on and I couldn't seem to draw any conclusions with temperature. the new box is right around 105 as well, no issues so far.

We "saw" the same thing when winter came and heaters came on with the receivers too close. "It's been working fine until....".
A.K.A VOS

#30 OFFLINE   kmkraft_1974

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 12:15 PM

would temperature problems cause issues on all channels? my audio drops were limited to the MPEG2 channels (70-79).
NR | HR20-700 | WNC AU9, WB68 | Linksys WRT54G | 6 Mbps | Denon 2807 (HDMI) | Panasonic 42PX60U (HDMI)

#31 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 12:27 PM

would temperature problems cause issues on all channels? my audio drops were limited to the MPEG2 channels (70-79).

I would just say "it would cause problems" as unless you could get the temp down to the chip, it would be hard to say, but 105-126 is fine, so....????
A.K.A VOS

#32 OFFLINE   FunkyMonk93

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 12:49 PM

From reading some of the other threads, it seems like LOTS of DTV customers are having this issue. How could all of our BBCs have gone fubar all at the same time???????

#33 OFFLINE   LR308er

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 01:04 PM

Just wait until they light #10 and all those new HD's start breaking up.
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#34 OFFLINE   ldmth44

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 01:20 PM

:welcome_s

Hi!
I'm new to this so hopefully I am not repeating stuff people have already tried and discounted.
I have recently had a lot of audio and pixelation problems but last night tried a different approach to solving the problem. I noticed on the Info page that the internal receiver temperature was 172 degrees. This is awfully high so I placed a fan in front of the normally closed cabinet that holds my AV equipment. After an hour, the temperature dropped to 104 degrees and the problem with Tuner 2 went away.
I'm not sure if this is the same thing that others are seeing but I thought it might help isolate the issue.



:flaiming :flaiming WOW!!! At that temp., you would think the unit could catch fire, or you could bake an egg on it!!:new_Eyecr Are you sure it wasn't 127 degrees? I run a 6" axial fan (120 volt, 75 cfm, purchased at Graingers for appx. $20). Keeps my HR20 at 100 degrees with no air conditioning on in my home (room temp at 85) and about 88 degrees if the ac is on (room temp at 74). Open cabinets.
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#35 OFFLINE   0x1b

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 02:22 PM

ldmth44,

Yes, I was amazed and had to reload the diagnostic data multiple times to convince myself I wasn't seeing things. I believe I will be investing in that same axial fan. Thanks for the tip. Now that I have found what I believe to be the clprit for my pixelation woes on Tuner 2, I will be monitoring the problem/temperature correlation to confirm the theory. Hopefully, I won't burn the house down trying experiments!

#36 OFFLINE   Drew2k

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 06:22 PM

With a temp of 172°, I'd be a little concerned ...

I just recently got a 2nd HR20 and stacked them in my AV Cabinet. Before stacking them, the one HR20 was at 116° all the time. After stacking them, it ran at 127° all the time. I just added two USB-powered laptop chill mats on top of each (inverted, to suck the heat out from the top of the HR20 and blow it out the back), and the temp on each HR20 is now 98°.

#37 OFFLINE   LR308er

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 10:44 PM

I thought I had it fixed with the new BBC's, but it has reared its ugly head yet again today.
My HDN recording of Arrested Development was junk.
I toggled the tuners again using an odd channel to push the problematic one and it goes wehereever I tell it to go. (Hope that makes sense).

Anyway, I pulled the new BBC's off and the problem is gone again.

However, I did notice that the BBC's are quite toasty to the touch, so I'm wondering if heat is buggering them up.

My HR20 temp is 127, but the area behind the unit is closed off, so it gets hotter around the BBC's.

I'll look at getting some air back there or making an extension for the dongles to hang them outside of the cabinet tomorrow.
Favorite Quotes:
"Don't fry bacon naked" - Janet Campbell (circa 1995)
"My head do stink" - Tommy Early (2003)
"Ya'll ain't got no more money?!" - Exotic Dancer (2004)

#38 OFFLINE   hasan

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 07:40 AM

I thought I had it fixed with the new BBC's, but it has reared its ugly head yet again today.
My HDN recording of Arrested Development was junk.
I toggled the tuners again using an odd channel to push the problematic one and it goes wehereever I tell it to go. (Hope that makes sense).

Anyway, I pulled the new BBC's off and the problem is gone again.

However, I did notice that the BBC's are quite toasty to the touch, so I'm wondering if heat is buggering them up.

My HR20 temp is 127, but the area behind the unit is closed off, so it gets hotter around the BBC's.

I'll look at getting some air back there or making an extension for the dongles to hang them outside of the cabinet tomorrow.


The BBCs I got that were "hot or quite warm to the touch" in the open air, were defective. My new ones are warm to the touch, but certainly not hot.
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#39 OFFLINE   Mark_M

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 09:23 AM

I've been seeing pixelation and audio dropouts on satellite HD channels for about a week now.

Last night, I proved the problem is tied to a tuner, but I still am not sure which tuner or how to fix it.

Here's what I did.

While watching one HD channel, I noticed the problems had come back again.
I switched to another HD channel, and that channel was fine.
I ran the signal strength tests in setup and changed tuners on 110 during the tests.
I assume this somehow toggled which tuner was selected first, because when I went back to the program I was watching, it had cleared up, but when I switched to the pervious channel the other channel was now having the problems.

I was able to repeat these results over and over, pushing the problems to any HD channel I chose.

So, am I right in thinking that I forced a tuner change?

Is it a tuner issue or a BBC issue?

I am not getting any local stations in HD over the satellite, so can BBC's be removed, or do they serve other functions as well?


FWIW. After putting up with audio dropouts for months on all of the HD channels in the 70s I called D* and asked them to get my problem fixed. They wanted $70 for a service call unless I had the protection plan. Signed up for the protection plan & had the tech. out to look at what was going on. The tech did basically nothing except look at the TV and he then called D* and told them I needed a replacement receiver. The replacement is in place using all my original wiring and origianl BBCs and the audio droputs and pixilation are gone.
Mark
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#40 OFFLINE   kmkraft_1974

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 10:07 AM

FWIW. After putting up with audio dropouts for months on all of the HD channels in the 70s I called D* and asked them to get my problem fixed. They wanted $70 for a service call unless I had the protection plan. Signed up for the protection plan & had the tech. out to look at what was going on. The tech did basically nothing except look at the TV and he then called D* and told them I needed a replacement receiver. The replacement is in place using all my original wiring and origianl BBCs and the audio droputs and pixilation are gone.


same situation here, except I was still under warranty. in any case, its been 1 day without drops. I've been only watching these channels when I watch TV to make sure I don't get a drop. I'll post back if anything changes.
NR | HR20-700 | WNC AU9, WB68 | Linksys WRT54G | 6 Mbps | Denon 2807 (HDMI) | Panasonic 42PX60U (HDMI)

#41 OFFLINE   LR308er

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 10:33 AM

I hear what you guys are saying, but I'm just having a bit of a hard time convincing myself that the tuner can be bad when it does fine with the BBC's off.

If it were the tuner, wouldn't it also act up without the BBC's connected?
Favorite Quotes:
"Don't fry bacon naked" - Janet Campbell (circa 1995)
"My head do stink" - Tommy Early (2003)
"Ya'll ain't got no more money?!" - Exotic Dancer (2004)

#42 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 10:45 AM

I hear what you guys are saying, but I'm just having a bit of a hard time convincing myself that the tuner can be bad when it does fine with the BBC's off.

If it were the tuner, wouldn't it also act up without the BBC's connected?

First you're talking about RF and by its nature is crazy. Now if there was a bad impedance match, it could cause it. If the tuner was "borderline" then the addition of the BBC could drop it below the minimum.
There as just so many things that could give the results you're seeing.

You might try adding a short piece of coax and see what that does too.
A.K.A VOS

#43 OFFLINE   LR308er

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Posted 19 July 2007 - 05:34 PM

I made up two 3' pieces today at the office.
They're still at the office :(

I'll try them tomorrow.

VOA, your points are very helpful.
If the short add-on caox pieces don't fix, then I'm just going to make the calll. AGAIN, and let them deal with it in whatever way they think is best.

I'm really just fed up with having to baby the friggin thing every day to get it do what it's supposed to do right outta the box.
Favorite Quotes:
"Don't fry bacon naked" - Janet Campbell (circa 1995)
"My head do stink" - Tommy Early (2003)
"Ya'll ain't got no more money?!" - Exotic Dancer (2004)

#44 OFFLINE   LR308er

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Posted 20 July 2007 - 10:50 AM

Well, they didn't help at all.
Making the call :mad:
Favorite Quotes:
"Don't fry bacon naked" - Janet Campbell (circa 1995)
"My head do stink" - Tommy Early (2003)
"Ya'll ain't got no more money?!" - Exotic Dancer (2004)

#45 OFFLINE   LR308er

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Posted 20 July 2007 - 11:01 AM

Replacement HR20 on the way.
There goes another $20 down the tubes on this POS receiver.
Favorite Quotes:
"Don't fry bacon naked" - Janet Campbell (circa 1995)
"My head do stink" - Tommy Early (2003)
"Ya'll ain't got no more money?!" - Exotic Dancer (2004)

#46 OFFLINE   veryoldschool

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Posted 20 July 2007 - 11:09 AM

Replacement HR20 on the way.
There goes another $20 down the tubes on this POS receiver.

Down the road, if/when you get it working, you might find it well worth it. Mine took several months before things were sorted out but since then it works fine. :)
A.K.A VOS

#47 OFFLINE   LR308er

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Posted 20 July 2007 - 11:59 AM

I hear you, but right now I'm pretty disappointed in this whole deal.
I've locked myself into a two year commitiment with a defective product that is nowhere near as glorious as it was advertised to be.

I have to pay for service and pay for shipping on problems that are not of my doing.

It wouldn't matter to me if it was nickel instead of $20.
There's a principle involved here and the way D* is handling it is wrong.
Favorite Quotes:
"Don't fry bacon naked" - Janet Campbell (circa 1995)
"My head do stink" - Tommy Early (2003)
"Ya'll ain't got no more money?!" - Exotic Dancer (2004)

#48 OFFLINE   dsm

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Posted 20 July 2007 - 03:36 PM

I had a very similar problem to what you are having and D* fix it under warranty. About 3 months after I got the box one of the tuners was delivering a very low signal on one sat (103?). Futzing with tuners and cables I had convinced myself the box was OK (at least with either input alone).

They sent someone out and he concluded the installer had done a bad job with the lines when he put in my new dish. The guy had extended the lines a couple of feet and then inside the arm of the dish he extended them again. The connections were not even solid. They put in 4 new cables from the dish to my units and that did fix the problem. No charge, but I had to rebury the cables.

-steve

#49 OFFLINE   LR308er

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Posted 20 July 2007 - 05:47 PM

Yeah, my initial installation was similar and I had problems and actually lost signal to one receiver. Same thing. The guy ran about three feet off the dish and coupled in.
He also left a couple of cables loose on the LNB's.

Either the first guy or the second one left the clamp bolts loose on the dish and that got out of alignment too.
Favorite Quotes:
"Don't fry bacon naked" - Janet Campbell (circa 1995)
"My head do stink" - Tommy Early (2003)
"Ya'll ain't got no more money?!" - Exotic Dancer (2004)




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