1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

103(ca) signals on even transponders

Discussion in 'DIRECTV Installation/MDU Discussion' started by DrummerBoy523, Aug 29, 2010.

  1. DrummerBoy523

    DrummerBoy523 Godfather

    511
    0
    Jan 9, 2007
    Franklin, TN
    My 103(ca) signals look like this:

    1-8 NA
    9-16 90 82 88 82 88 80 86 81
    17-24 87 82 88 80 85 79 87 80
    25-32 NA

    It seems weird that my even transponders are all low and the odds are in good shape. All other sats & transponders are in the high 80s low 90s but there isn't the deviation in odd vs. even transponders as I see here.

    We tend to lose our HD signals rather quickly when rain pops up - and prior to our dish move we RARELY EVER lost signals.

    FYI, our dish is now on the roof with no obstructions and we went to a SWMLNB system.

    Any thoughts?
     
  2. NR4P

    NR4P Dad

    6,361
    271
    Jan 15, 2007
    Sunny Florida
    Readings are marginal and could be better, assuming good weather.
    You should have not less than an 85 anywhere with most if not all in the 90's.

    If you call Directv they may not want to send the tech out to correct this unless your readings are below 70
     
  3. texasbrit

    texasbrit Well-Known Member

    5,170
    92
    Aug 9, 2006
    If the dish is slightly out of alignment it is quite normal to see all the even transponders lower than the odds, or vice versa. A well-aligned dish will have all signals in the low to mid-90s on 99c, 103ca and 103cb.
     
  4. DrummerBoy523

    DrummerBoy523 Godfather

    511
    0
    Jan 9, 2007
    Franklin, TN
    when I took this reading, there was a slight drizzle going on I believe. But, I was concerned that the evens were 5-8 points lower than the odds. And only for the 103(ca). 103(cb) and 99 are in good shape even with rain or drizzle.

    But, unfortunately, I wont be able to get DTV out here. I just know that this dish was aligned improperly because we have lost our signals repeatedly during rainy weather since the dish move - prior to the dish move we hardly ever lost signals - even when our trees started causing signal loss and our signals were in the 60s.

    I don't know the first thing about aligning the dish so any help on how to get the evens a bit higher w/o affecting the rest of the sats would be appreciated.
     
  5. joe diamond

    joe diamond Hall Of Fame

    3,071
    0
    Feb 28, 2007
    Best guess...the signals are a little low,,,,possibly because the mast has slumped due to improper support. With the 103 signal meter on try pulling back on the top of the dish WITHOUT CHANGING ANY LOCKED DOWN SETTINGS. If the signals get better, the elevation is too low...unlock and raise the elevation very little, AFTER marking where the dish was set.

    Try the same test with left and right.

    Report success.

    Joe
     
  6. DrummerBoy523

    DrummerBoy523 Godfather

    511
    0
    Jan 9, 2007
    Franklin, TN
    Thanks Joe. I appreciate the help.

    The last guy here checked the dish and found that the installer did not find a stud when he installed it. So, the last guy here added two more support straps. Any chance that (not hitting a stud) could be an issue?

    FYI, It is going to be awhile before I'm able to do this due to work issues/conflicts.

    Oh, one other thing - I can't seem to get the signal meters to make noise (which makes it incredibly hard to align a dish on a roof!).
     
  7. joe diamond

    joe diamond Hall Of Fame

    3,071
    0
    Feb 28, 2007
    The meter noise thing is a Directv idea. They feel installers should have a meter of their own that can "see" the 99 & 103 birds. To force this they disabled the tone feature. Since a Birdog or Sat Buddy is around $500.00 I passed on buying one. But you can continue with someone on a cell phone in front of the TV.

    Hitting or missing a stud is a long term problem. Roof sheathing will not support continual wind load and unload. The lag bolts eventually pull out...or strip immediately from over tightening.
    The use of monopoles (braces) is a fix. You want to make sure some sort of asphalt caulking
    is used to keep water from damaging the sheathing & leaking into the attic. For now, unless the dish is moving in the wind, the stud thing is a separate issue.

    Know that there is a significant lag; a few seconds, between tuning changes and a signal change on screen so work slowly.

    I guessed at the elevation aspect because it is a common error. The mast should be securely mounted before tuning. It should also be "plumb" to make tuning easier. At your stage of installation using the dish pull is just a starting trick to tell you which direction to adjust the dish.

    If you elect to use the dither adjustments know that they are locked by nuts on the mount and must be released before tuning and then tightened again after adjustments. Do one parameter at a time...up down then left right. Only inspect tilt. It is probably ok.

    Your tuning is very close now so you might want to check it before you begin again. There are atmospheric conditions that may affect signal even on clear days so things might have changed from your last check.

    Be careful on the roof.

    Joe
     
  8. DrummerBoy523

    DrummerBoy523 Godfather

    511
    0
    Jan 9, 2007
    Franklin, TN
    Today is partly cloudy and an overall decent day. My 103(ca) numbers are all in the mid to high 80s. But, all other sats, 101, 99 & 103(cb) are all in the mid to high 90s. I would expect the (ca) numbers to be in the 90s as well, so since they are not, I'm guessing the dish just needs some tweaking. Hopefully I'll be able to get to it this week sometime. Thanks again...

    Oh, one other thing - I've looked everywhere and cannot find information on the dither adjustments & procedure. Can you provide a link or explanation?
     
  9. DrummerBoy523

    DrummerBoy523 Godfather

    511
    0
    Jan 9, 2007
    Franklin, TN
    Yeah, I'm not too happy with the original installer. He put a hole in my ceiling as well. It appears he cut a lot of corners.

    As for the stud thing - it seems like all he had to do was have a stud finder and lift up some shingles to find the stud. Maybe it is more difficult with the roof sheathing, but still...drive a nail as a pilot or something..Ugh.

    The last guy who was here said the dish was sealed properly and he was the one who added the monopoles.
     
  10. Manctech

    Manctech Icon

    542
    0
    Jul 5, 2010
    Just a heads up. A bird dog doesn't see the 99 or 103. It picks up the 101,119, and 110.

    It also picks up the SWM 101

    You have to dither to peak the 99/103.


    The Accutrac 3+ sees the 99/103.
     
  11. joe diamond

    joe diamond Hall Of Fame

    3,071
    0
    Feb 28, 2007
    I don't keep up!
    I understood the Birdog had a new card or something to get the 99 & 103. Last time I paid attention the Accutrac 3 was in the coming out stage. So it works now; great.

    The last installation work I turned down was offering 70 /10. You gotta twist a lot of dishes to pay for a new $500.00 meter. A customer dropped my Acutrack 2 off their kitchen table and it never worked again.

    Hit the 101 and poosh a little west until the 103 is nice...better than what DrummerBoy reports.

    Thanks for the update,

    Joe
     
  12. DrummerBoy523

    DrummerBoy523 Godfather

    511
    0
    Jan 9, 2007
    Franklin, TN
    I've looked everywhere and cannot find information on the dither adjustments & procedure. Can anyone provide a link or explanation? I don't understand what this means.
     
  13. joe diamond

    joe diamond Hall Of Fame

    3,071
    0
    Feb 28, 2007
    You can just do a google search for "Directv Slimline antenna installation" and download a PDF file with the same material that is shipped with your slimline dish.

    You can read through it and see the drawings of how to "dither"...tune by moving back and forth through signal levels. Much of the material refers to using a meter that sees the 99 & 103 Ka signal. You are going to ignor this stuff because you don't have the correct meter.

    This may help. The Ku band signals for SD reception are coming from satellites in the 101, 110 & 119 degree west longitude positions. They are, by FCC reg, nine degrees apart. The Ka sats are at a lower frequency and allowed closer to the existing SD sats. The 99 & 103 sats are about three degrees on either side of the 101 sat. All five Directv sat signals (or only three) are simultaneously received from the single dish.

    So you are moving the dish very slightly by loosening the lock nuts for the left /right and then the up down until your signal improves. The dither wheels allow for easy application of very small adjustments. You can pull and or push the rim of the dish...if the signal goes up that gives you a hint which way to move the dish when you unlock the mechanism.

    It is possible to have a very high signal on the SD 101 satellite meter and very low signals on the HD 99 and 103 meters. As you move toward the 103 0r 99 the signal on the 101 will go down a little as the HD signals come up. Your current signals are not that bad. Work slowly to improve them.

    DO not attempt to turn the dither wheels without unlocking them (1/2 " wrench) or you will strip the threads. DO mark with a pencil where all settings are before you start. Work slowly with someone watching the 103 meter...let them announce changes to you by cell phone.

    Joe
     
  14. MONSTERMAN

    MONSTERMAN Godfather

    261
    0
    Aug 18, 2007
    Crystal Bay...
    I still haven't mastered the dithering process. Very confusing method to remember and often has differing results with same process. Here are some links you can use to try to figure it out, good luck.

    manuals.solidsignal.com/Slimline_Dish_Installation_Manual.pdf

    http://www.solidsignal.com/p/?p=2709&d=directv-dish-antenna-types&mc=02
     
  15. DrummerBoy523

    DrummerBoy523 Godfather

    511
    0
    Jan 9, 2007
    Franklin, TN
    thanks a bunch.
     
  16. Kev4Bama

    Kev4Bama Legend

    184
    0
    Aug 7, 2010
    I am having almost the exact same problem that Drummer was having and I noticed there was never any real resolution to the issue so I thought I would put it up to everyone again.

    I switched my system over to SWM a few weeks ago. Before the switch I had 90's on all SATS and TP's. After the switch I still have the same signals except for the 103(ca) on the even TP's. Some of the evens especially 22/24 drop as low as the 70's. When I revert back to multiswitch using the same cables I am back in 90's on the same SAT and TP so I dont think it is a cabling issue between the lnb and SWM 16.

    I have tried a different SWM16 switch with the same results within a point or two. I also tried a different PI with both SWM16 I tried with the same results. I replaced coax between the SWM16 and Splitters and even tried switching splitters all with the same result. Only caveat to this is that while the signals are still low out of the SWM2 port they are a few points higher than out of SWM1 but again this was the case with both switches I tried.

    I am not having any dropped signal issues as of yet it just does not make any sense why every SAT and TP is in the 90's with the exception of this one. And with that one when hooked directly to the LNB signals are in the 90's as well.

    Could it be something to do with the LNB only causing this on this one sat only in a SWM enviroment?

    I know we can figure this one out :D
     
  17. veryoldschool

    veryoldschool Lifetime Achiever Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

    42,684
    349
    Dec 9, 2006
    I tested one of the first SWM8s back in '07. I simply swapped it for my WB68, so was never near the dish [60' away]. I too noticed some 90s dropped to 80s. Later on I tested the SWiMLNB and didn't see any change. I've since moved the dish and realigned it a couple of times.
    I just checked and have these:
    99c 79-94
    103ca 86-94
    103cb 86-95

    Since when I see reception problems my numbers are 15, I simply don't care.
    "YMMV"
     

Share This Page