CBS stations pulled from Dish Network in contract dispute (for less than 12 hours)

Discussion in 'General DISH™ Discussion' started by bgullicksen, Dec 5, 2014.

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  1. Dec 8, 2014 #81 of 122
    SeaBeagle

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    What is Charlie's NUTV cable OTT cable service?


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  2. Dec 8, 2014 #82 of 122
    James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Gold Club DBSTalk Club

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    "NuTV" is the reported brand name of DISH's planned "over the top" IPTV delivery service.
    Mr Idiot is suggesting that the deal CBS made with DISH excludes them from the OTT offering.
    The reality is that inclusion in OTT is still under negotiation.


    From Variety:
    The companies’ announcement did not address whether Dish has OTT rights to CBS programming. According to a source familiar with the deal, CBS will negotiate with Dish in good faith for Internet TV rights if and when the satellite carrier launches an OTT service. Dish has said it plans to launch an OTT service before the end of 2014, having secured deals with Disney/ESPN, Scripps Networks Interactive and A+E Networks.

    Financial terms of the deal are not being disclosed. The sticking points in the talks, which dragged on for months and included two short-term extensions granted by CBS last month, were as much about digital content rights issues as about retrans dollars and cents.
    http://variety.com/2014/tv/news/cbs-dish-reach-carriage-deal-1201372651/
     
  3. Dec 8, 2014 #83 of 122
    maartena

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    Yes, they were picked out of the air, because the exact numbers are usually not disclosed. However, those percentages are not uncommon. Not too long ago, a media group that owned 20-odd local stations, mainly in the Washington State area, wanted a 600% increase, or 6 times they were receiving now, from DirecTV. The stations went black for a good 6 weeks I believe.

    Although the costs is usually not disclosed, there have been some articles over the years that shed some light on the average costs and the increases.

    Here are articles from 2010 and 2014:

    http://allthingsd.com/20100308/hate-paying-for-cable-heres-the-reason-why/
    http://blogs.wsj.com/numbers/how-much-cable-subscribers-pay-per-channel-1626/

    Some price differences:

    TNT in 2010: $0.99
    TNT in 2014: $1.48

    USA in 2010: $0.55
    USA in 2014: $0.83

    Disney Channel in 2010: $0.88
    Disney Channel in 2014: $1.21

    ESPN in 2010: $4.08
    ESPN in 2014: $6.04

    Now, these are averages, compiled from different sources, based on what was found in the media and press releases and/or leaked info, but it does give you an idea.

    As you can see, the increases in price as opposed to 4 years ago are along the lines of 25-35%, so it is really not unthinkable that the channel owners demanded a 50-60% increase and settled at a price around half of that.

    Interestingly, the 2010 article mentions that 40% of the pricing of cable, goes to sports. So in essence, if you don't really watch sports much, 40% of your bill will go to sports you won't ever watch. That figure probably hasn't gone down over the last 4 years, as a matter of fact I suspect it is closer to 50% now.

    Now if you love sports, there is no question that you will need a cable or satellite subscription. But if you could care less about sports, and you add to that all the other channels you don't ever watch, but still pay for, there is a good chance that you only get about 30% worth of the money you spend on cable. And in the field of economics, that is a really really lousy rate of return and a bad investment. :D (but then again, so is a car.)

    It's not getting any cheaper, that's for sure. Even the biggest deniers are now saying cord-cutting is happening, because people are just fed up paying for expensive packages, that gives them no choice, mandatory (expensive) channels they may not want, and disputes when they are least convenient.
     
  4. Dec 8, 2014 #84 of 122
    maartena

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    The difference between your analogy and the price of a bottle of coke, and price increases of channels over the last 4-5 years, is that the price of channels (see articles listed above) has risen by about 30-40%, and the bottle of coke has not.
     
  5. Dec 9, 2014 #85 of 122
    SomeRandomIdiot

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    Incorrect. It has been widely reported that CBS is excluded from NuTV and that was the holdup, much like I posted on this thread Friday.

    Even Variety says as much when it talks of digital content rights.
     
  6. Dec 9, 2014 #86 of 122
    SomeRandomIdiot

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    Was not my analogy. Direct to the correct person.
     
  7. Dec 9, 2014 #87 of 122
    James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Gold Club DBSTalk Club

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    5 cents in 1960 is approximately 40 cents today. The 5 cent coke in the 1950s was 6.5 oz. At CPI rate of inflation 12 oz at the 1960 price would be 73.8 cents today. 20 oz would be $1.23.

    Based on the above math, a 12 pack of 12 oz cans would be $8.86. A 24 pack would be $17.71. One can generally do better than that on price.

    For the "ice cold Coca Cola" the price has kept pace with inflation. By the can or bottle from a vending machine 75c per can or $1.25 per bottle are typical prices I have seen. There are "convenience stores" that charge more. (I usually walk away or bring my own from home.) Case prices have beat inflation (although one can usually find a rip off price).


    On the other hand, the price of CBS has skyrocketed since 1960. :)
     
  8. Dec 9, 2014 #88 of 122
    SomeRandomIdiot

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    Every MVPD channel has increased by an infinitesimal amount since 1960.
     
  9. Dec 9, 2014 #89 of 122
    James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Gold Club DBSTalk Club

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    Claims without references? Where are the attributions to sources? Where are the links?

    At least Variety puts their name on their story ... and if you read what is written they say "CBS will negotiate with Dish in good faith for Internet TV rights if and when the satellite carrier launches an OTT service." Which is not the same as your claim "The net result is CBS is not available on Charlie's NuTV OTT cable service."

    Nothing is available on DISH's NuTV since the service has not been launched. Correcting for grammar you are claiming CBS will not be part of NuTV. Whether or not CBS will be part of the service WHEN launched is still up for negotiation - just like reputable people are reporting.
     
  10. Dec 9, 2014 #90 of 122
    SomeRandomIdiot

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    Read it and weep.

    https://gigaom.com/2014/12/06/cbs-and-dish-reach-deal-but-dont-include-internet-tv-service/
     
  11. Dec 9, 2014 #91 of 122
  12. Dec 9, 2014 #92 of 122
    SomeRandomIdiot

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    And the fact that on Friday Night I said that Autohop for 3 days gone - done deal. I also stated the bigger question would C7 be gone. . Note no one had ever mentioned that. Most did not know what it was. But Saturday morning, Autohop is disabled for the C7 period.

    Guess I just pulled that one out of my ass as well?
     
  13. Dec 9, 2014 #93 of 122
    James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Gold Club DBSTalk Club

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    A story posted Saturday - which could not be the basis of what you stated on Friday. The article also leaves open the door for CBS to be on NuTV but stating "it now looks like" CBS won't be on NuTV - not a definitive CBS will never be on NuTV.


    The same source from Friday before the deal was announced. The article contains unsourced speculation about the issues involved.
     
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  14. Dec 9, 2014 #94 of 122
    Stewart Vernon

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    James did most of the legwork... Thanks, James!

    I also would add that my out wasn't going to be can vs bottle... but vending machines are overpriced ways to get drinks these days.

    I can buy a 6-pack of 0.5 liter bottles of Coke for $2.50-$3.00 routinely... even at the $3 price that comes to 50 cents a bottle. I can also get 2 liter bottles for $1 which is a much better deal too. The point essentially being that I can afford Coke easier now than when I was a kid 30+ years ago... and absolutely more affordable than when my Dad was a kid in the previous generation.

    Also... I can buy a laptop PC for <$500 and I couldn't buy a bottom of the line computer which was not even remotely comparable in function 30 years ago for that price.

    Some stuff goes up... some stuff goes down... some stuff goes up BUT is more affordable as it hasn't kept up with inflation.

    That's why general statements are bad. Also why I reminded that luxury items follow a different model than staples... luxury items might be wanted by many, maybe even all, but they aren't needed by most... so luxury items like pay-TV command their own pricing model that doesn't have to be reflected in inflation or other luxury items even.
     
  15. Dec 10, 2014 #95 of 122
    SomeRandomIdiot

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    Perhaps I had different sources. Just because the article did not have it until Saturday does NOT mean I did not know it Friday, just like C7 / Autohop, which had been published NOWHERE except my post on Friday.

    Furthermore, you stated that no reputable source had said NuTV was the holdup, as i stated during the Blackout. I simply proved you incorrect, AGAIN.
     
  16. Dec 10, 2014 #96 of 122
    SomeRandomIdiot

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    Guess you were wrong about this as well.
     
  17. Dec 10, 2014 #97 of 122
    James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Gold Club DBSTalk Club

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    Then you should have posted your sources ... not other places that posted something similar after your posts. Without sources YOU are the source.

    Some would call that a "lucky guess" ... or revisionist history.

    There are plenty of sites on the Internet where non-reputable people post their guesses.


    Can you name ONE non-O&O ABC affiliate that has auto-hop delayed for C3?
    Can you name ONE non-O&O CBS affiliate that has auto-hop delayed for C7?

    Thanks for admitting that you are guessing ... but unless a non-O&O loses auto-hop I'm not wrong.

    (I am not saying than a non-O&O will never negotiate a delayed auto-hop deal similar to the one that ABC and CBS have negotiated. Only that the ABC and CBS network deals will not affect non-O&O stations. Past performance, my ABC station still having auto-hop a few hours after air - not C3, is indicative of future performance, my CBS being unaffected by the deal CBS corporate cut with DISH for O&Os.)
     
  18. Dec 10, 2014 #98 of 122
    SomeRandomIdiot

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    Comical. Considering you will not post your sources in other threads (and support others who do not post their sources.

    Considering you are the only one of us that can "revise" history, by deleting comments, banning people from threads where you are wrong and closing threads so you will not have to admit being wrong.

    But regardless, considering I made a post with 1 item about C7, which came out of the blue, that was a lucky guess? ROFLMAO.

    If that was the case, I just would have said C3. That had a higher probability at the time to the general public.

    Like you, here?

    Please bookmark this as you are already wrong and only digging yourself in deeper.

    Perhaps you should have read the statements.

    At least WestDC did.

     
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  19. Dec 11, 2014 #99 of 122
    James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Gold Club DBSTalk Club

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    Funny ... but the ABC announcement earlier this year said auto-hop would be disabled "on all ABC content" - and the only people who lost auto-hop (for the duration of C3 only) was on ABC O&Os. I'll believe it when I see it.

    Can you name ONE non-O&O ABC affiliate that has auto-hop delayed for C3?
    Can you name ONE non-O&O CBS affiliate that has auto-hop delayed for C7?

    The correct answer is no. You cannot name a non-O&O affiliate with auto-hop disabled C3 or C7.

    And that is the way it is, Thursday, December 11th, 2014. Good morning.
     
  20. inkahauts

    inkahauts Well-Known Member

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    The auto hop disable will likely come to all affiliates as contracts renew and now Id bet everyone will want c7....

    I'd also bet that the will negotiate in good faith is as much a joke as DIRECTV picking up the Sony channels. Dish couldn't get them to agree so had to give up with an agreement they could be negotiated separately. CBS will
    Never give in to what dish wants for that service they will only let dish do it on their terms is my guess. But we will never really know.
     
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