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D* vs E* HD count thread

Discussion in 'General Satellite Discussion' started by Rob Glasser, Oct 30, 2007.

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  1. msmith198025

    msmith198025 Member of the Year

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    and as many have stated the new mpeg 4 stuff being pumped out is as good as OTA. To most anyway
    FIOS has PQ issues also, depending on who you talk to
     
  2. flexoffset

    flexoffset Godfather

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    Attn D* and E* and everyone else who doesn't like channel counting:
    If you don't want folks counting, just use less quantifiable words like "Gobs, Bunches, Oodles, Whole Lot, Tons, Fair Amount, Crapload", etc. :D
     
  3. ScoBuck

    ScoBuck Banned User

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    Let me please tell you a little of why I am 'stirring the pot' as you say. For OVER 2 years I have read way too many posts by DISH fans (here AND in these D* forums as well), COMPLAINING about DirecTV advertising that they will 'soon' have the capcity for 150 channels. I couldn't even begin to link them there are SO MANY OF THEM. And this was all for them promising the channels in the future - NEVER saying they actually had them up and live.

    Some, including mods here participated in tis exercise of indignation over DirecTV's advertising what they didn't have - and the continued gloating that D* gets promises, we already have the channels.

    Well, now, the shoe is on the other foot, and those very same people that bitched for 2 years or so about misleading advertising, now try to JUSTIFY it by THEIR beloved provider putting out not only misleading but entirely BOGUS information.

    I guess its ok if its your team is doing it, and taking it to a new level. DISH puts out official press releases that are clearly false - and there is NO JUSTIFICATION for it - at worse case the argument that D* did it also doesn't fly. Didn't your mamas tell you that 2 wrongs don't make a right?

    I am not trying to stir the pot - I am trying to 'stir the discussion'. Anyone that thinks there is any other reason is plainly wrong. And guess what - I have stirred this discussion. That was the purpose.
     
  4. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    I personally have not written one ad for E* nor one press release. I don't believe those authors post on this forum (or any other). At least not directly. I see no reason to hold anyone responsible for the advertising that "their" provider is using.

    But there does seem to be a blindness to the lies of D*. They have created their own HD channels from SD feeds. In their rush to meet their "promised" over 70 target they put up feeds that did not exist. And we have heard D* fanboys (not the company, but members of this forum) admit that these were non-HD source and defend these "upconvert" channels as "better than SD".

    Sorry, but D*'s advertising isn't "over 70 better than SD" channels. It is over 70 HD channels. HD in HD is the standard they should be living up to. D* is putting out press releases as well that could use a little less channel padding.

    So E* pads their count. So what? Should we give out gold stars to people who mention it? D* pads their counts too. Should I add the line "D* lies less than E* about their count" to my sig?

    D* still has to live up to the shifting promises they made ... I hope the live up to the original promise but I assume that they will just add 19 more channels that are upconverts and/or blacked out in most of the country when in HD instead of truly passing the 100 national channels in HD mark by the end of the year.

    We have had people defend D*'s lies as being less than E*'s lies. What a lousy statement ... "my satellite carrier lies less than yours!"

    That is what the argument has become.
     
  5. ScoBuck

    ScoBuck Banned User

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    See - discussion is good. You again excuse DISH with a "so what", then condem DirecTV. My reply - So What.
     
  6. Richard King

    Richard King Hall Of Fame

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    Obviously someone was looking into their crystal ball "over 2 years" ago when they started posting complaints about Directv advertising. I say this because Directv didn't start talking about 150 channels (or 100 channels) of HD until this year. If someone has been complaining about their ads touting 150 channels for two years I want to know who it was so that I can hire them to be my financial advisor and lottery number picker. By the way, they are still advertising that they will have "up to" 100 channels by the end of the year. Of course, anyone the least bit familiar with the English language will realize when they hear this ad that they already carry "up to" 100 channels in HD, in fact, they carried "up to" 100 channels in HD the day they started transmitting their first HD channel.


    http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?...&postcount=142

    Quote:
    But you guys win - I'll stay in the DirecTV area - I'm tired of the whining here already. See you all in a year or so.
     
  7. RAD

    RAD Well-Known Member

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    Dripping...
    Since you're making a post talking about D* creating their own HD channels do you have any proof of that statement? This is the same exact thing that people were saying, there was no Weather Channel HD, no Sci-Fi HD, no USA HD, no FX HD, no CNBC HD, we know those folks were incorrect in their statements. Unless you have facts to back up your statement I think you shouldn't make such comments.
     
  8. ScoBuck

    ScoBuck Banned User

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    Another uninformed post. DirecTv has been talking abut 150 channel capacity since September 8, 2004. The following items ALL discuss this very thing AND ARE OVER 2 YEARS OLD:


    http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=617918&highlight=

    http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=660036&highlight=

    http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=660037&highlight=

    http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=700828&highlight=

    http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=713981&highlight=

    http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=766263&highlight=
     
  9. Richard King

    Richard King Hall Of Fame

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    A press release does not an advertisement make. They did not start advertising this capacity until this year.
     
  10. RAD

    RAD Well-Known Member

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    Dripping...
    IIRC, D* was advertising all the coming HD capacity at least last year. I remember seeing an ad with a bunch of TV moving around, some on a roof, about all the HD channels that D* would be adding.
     
  11. Ron Barry

    Ron Barry 622 Tips & Trick Keeper

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    Guys this is marketing not a court of law. I don't get the arguing of whose Marketing departement stretches the truth more. Marketing stretches the truth all the time it is their job to show a company in its best light. E* does it, D* does
    it, and Cable does. No company is immune to it.

    And one tactic that Microsoft has perfected is pre-announcements to freeze their customer from going to the competition. It has killed companies and in a lot of cases the announcements never saw the light of day. It is a Marketing tactic just like press releases and are ways to get the word out while providing the spin your company wants or freeze the market until you have something better to offer.

    My take on any company making two year ahead announcements like mentioned above is it is down with the sole purpose to freeze the customer base until you have somthing better to provide them. To create a perception that may or may not become reality.

    As for Press Releases, Not sure how E* does them but at my previous company they get written months in advance because they have to go through legal etc. Not sure if this is the case with E* or perhaps it is just the Marketing Department being a Marketing Department.

    Bottom line. In my opinion both tactics suck but it is part of our environement and as consumers we should do our research and listen to various sources. Lots of times it is just how two people see the same thing.

    As to the.. E* subs have been throwing rocks the last two years. Well I have been on this board for the last two years and personally I have not seen as much mud slinging than I have in the last month.

    Maybe I am old and have forgotten.. But besides the occassional flair up I don't recall this type of flaming occuring during any of that time between the D* and E* subs. Perhaps these things were happing on the D* threads and I missed them but I don't recall it and I think I would have remember something like that.

    I know this thread is in the general forum and is the right place for it. However, I also think when people gather at a common area (Nutreal ground so to speak), points should be stated, differeing view points respected, people should state facts or opinions as they know them, listen to other opinions and avoid flame baiting and derogotary behavior. If someone steps into another persons house they should treat the house with respect and avoid taking a leak pool. There has been a lot of leaking lately from both sides and it Just is not cool.

    Well that is my opinion...
     
  12. Richard King

    Richard King Hall Of Fame

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    I could be wrong, but I don't recall anything promoting the "up to" 100 HD channels until CES in Jan '07. They made a big splash about it at the show (I was there). If I recall correctly, at the show they claimed that they would have 150 channels, then adjusted the claim to have the "capacity" for 150 channels.
     
  13. Tom Robertson

    Tom Robertson Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

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    I had the pleasure of meeting Richard at CES (it truly was a pleasure). Being aware of the capacity of 150 channels, I always interpreted a mispeak as meant to be capacity, not reality; they pushed the nearly signed agreements for 70 channels more than the 150, IMHO.

    I will go back to an important thing: No matter who has the count lead today, everyone has benefited from the approach BOTH companies have brought to the table.

    Dish was able to bring more Nationals sooner thru shrewd business decisions and DIRECTV was able to bring more HD LILs thru their shrewd business decisions. I applaud both of them! :)

    Who is the leader? Who cares! I have HD locals and HD nationals. (and one other important package.) I'm good!

    I hope all of you are good too,
    Tom
     
  14. Richard King

    Richard King Hall Of Fame

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    VERY well stated. Ain't competition grand. By the way, it was my pleasure. :D
     
  15. braven

    braven Hall Of Fame

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    With this said. I still wouldn't trade D* current HD lineup with E*'s. NO WAY.
     
  16. msmith198025

    msmith198025 Member of the Year

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    James as of last night there are very few if any of the channels that dont show at least some HD now. How many people that wanted to watch Nip/Tuck in hd did so on E* last night? See, on D* you could. It even had the nice little FX HD logo:) They are coming along nicely
     
  17. Richard King

    Richard King Hall Of Fame

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    That is ALL that matters. If YOU are happy with YOUR services then YOU are in the right place. I happen to prefer what Dish carries ONLY because I don't even watch the channels that Directv added in HD in their SD formats. I have no interest in them, but I have a GREAT interest in channels such as RAVE. If Directv started carrying Rave I might even consider a switch, but then I would be switching for something that I already have and for a bunch of channels that I wouldn't watch (normally). The LINEUP is what matters, not the NUMBERS (although I still want someone to do the minute by minute calculations). :D
     
  18. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    I am still waiting for you to be honest about D*'s deceptions.

    You seem to be willing to throw stones at E* ... large nasty worded posts attacking not only the company but the E* forum regulars for something that is entirely out of our control. But you are blind to D*'s deceptions.

    Don't tell us the "truth" until you are ready to face it. :)

    Yes ... it is nice to see that some HD is finally appearing on those channels. The more HD they get the more encouraged E* will be to add them. :)
     
  19. msmith198025

    msmith198025 Member of the Year

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    This was true as of the time you said all they were putting up was feeds that did not exist. When in fact they did. Even before today it did on most. It was a generalized statement that was mostly false. IMHO
    Just seems to me that they are living up to the "HD standard"
     
  20. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    So it is true that the channels were put up before they were HD. :)
     
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