1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

DIRECTV and Tivo to Launch new HD DVR in 2010

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by Tom Robertson, Sep 3, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Mar 6, 2009 #2421 of 3658
    harsh

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset

    21,192
    183
    Jun 14, 2003
    Salem, OR
    The existing HD DVRs from both DIRECTV and DISH Network support RF remotes and all DISH Network receivers support IR blasting so why would this be significantly different?

    I wouldn't go so far as to characterize the communications as being bidirectional as the only time the receiver yells at the remote is to transmit new programming.
     
  2. Mar 6, 2009 #2422 of 3658
    Doug Brott

    Doug Brott Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

    28,939
    72
    Jul 12, 2006
    Los Angeles
    beats me .. I won't be one of those people

    Why? DIRECTV still gets the sub and the lease fee on the hardware? TiVo is footing the bill for the other stuff (except for marketing). It seems to me there will be relatively little risk from DIRECTV's side .. besides, they've already agreed at this point. It's not like DIRECTV can come back at say "oops."

    Again, I hedged on the HDD, but I still believe that most people will be 100% satisfied with the 100-hour 500GB HDD which certainly must cost a lot less than the brand new 2TB HDDs that are available.
     
  3. Mar 6, 2009 #2423 of 3658
    Curtis0620

    Curtis0620 Hall Of Fame

    1,500
    25
    Apr 22, 2002
    DISH will shortly be paying TiVo at least $2 per DVR (after the judge rules in favor of TiVo).
     
  4. Mar 6, 2009 #2424 of 3658
    Doug Brott

    Doug Brott Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

    28,939
    72
    Jul 12, 2006
    Los Angeles

    What!? You say "the receiver yells at the remote" (as in communicates) and clearly the remote talks to the receiver. Yet in the same sentence you don't call this two-way communication bidirectional? Isn't that the definition of bidirectional? It doesn't matter if it's 1 bit or a million bits .. if it goes both ways it goes both ways :scratchin.
     
  5. Mar 6, 2009 #2425 of 3658
    Doug Brott

    Doug Brott Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

    28,939
    72
    Jul 12, 2006
    Los Angeles
    <MOD HAT>

    Curtis, this is not directed just at you, but at everyone ..

    This thread is about the DIRECTiVo .. There will be no discussion of the TiVo v. Echostar case in this thread .. If there are any posts on the Court Case, they will be deleted.

    If you would like to discuss the the TiVo v. Echostar case, please use the appropriate thread in the DISH forums:

    http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=152587

    Thank You

    </Mod Hat>
     
  6. Mar 6, 2009 #2426 of 3658
    hdtvfan0001

    hdtvfan0001 Well-Known Member

    32,456
    258
    Jul 28, 2004
    Maybe that's how it works with the Dish receivers...but not the Direct ones...:D
     
  7. Mar 6, 2009 #2427 of 3658
    Steve

    Steve Well-Known Member

    23,063
    154
    Aug 22, 2006
    Lower...
    Plus I could swear I read somewhere that the Dish remote could also back up your "timers" (their name for Series Links/Season's Passes), but for the life of me I can't find it. It could have been a report from someone at CES, but since it's not mentioned in the press release, maybe I just misunderstood what I thought I read. /steve
     
  8. Mar 6, 2009 #2428 of 3658
    Doug Brott

    Doug Brott Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

    28,939
    72
    Jul 12, 2006
    Los Angeles
    Yes .. the new 922 will store this and I believe all of your setting on the remote so that if you have to send back your receiver, the new one will read these settings a go back to the way you expect it (sans any recorded programming of course).
     
  9. Mar 6, 2009 #2429 of 3658
    jacmyoung

    jacmyoung Hall Of Fame

    6,544
    0
    Sep 8, 2006
    But if you yourself do not see much point in this plan, why is it that DirecTV may not think the same, that this plan does not make much sense, at least not worth the extra $5 D* must pay TiVo?

    A lot of what had been speculated by those who love TiVo is based on the mentality that TiVo is the center of the universe, that the mere "TiVo" name on the box is worth the extra $13/mo. for a standalone TiVo or $5 to $10/mo. on a DirecTiVo.

    The question is does DirecTV think the same? Evidence do not support it. DirecTV has been converting DirecTiVo subs to their own HR subs in such a pace that by the same time next year there might not be many DirecTiVo accounts left to even give a damn.

    So the logical question is, then why did D* make that agreement? Why bother?

    One of the main reasons is to avoid being sued by TiVo, this is not even implied, rather clearly stated in the very agreement itself.

    And of course again the timing of the press release, the complete silence after that, I will simply not repeat myself.
     
  10. Mar 6, 2009 #2430 of 3658
    Doug Brott

    Doug Brott Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

    28,939
    72
    Jul 12, 2006
    Los Angeles
    Hey, don't make me out to be more important than I am .. Just because I'm not going to get a TiVo doesn't mean no one will. Personally I don't think a lot of people will, but there will be those that really want a new TiVo. Many of those will want it for free but likely won't get it for that price. In truth we don't know how much it will cost but the general speculation is that there will be a $5/sub above and beyond any other fees that would apply. TiVo may receive up to 100% of this upcharge as in reality it's just a pass-through charge and DIRECTV still gets the programming fees from the subscriber.

    You could very well be right .. DIRECTV may have simply made this agreement to keep the TiVo/DIRECTV cross-licensing agreements in check ..

    BTW, the cross-licensing also implies that DIRECTV will not sue TiVo either so it works both ways. It was a negotiated agreement and this is one of the items that came out of that negotiation.

    I still say the risk is small for DIRECTV .. It give people a choice and DIRECTV still gets the programming fees and lease fees on the receiver. TiVo is taking the greater risk by committing their Engineering resources to the port. It may or may not pay off for them.
     
  11. Mar 6, 2009 #2431 of 3658
    bonscott87

    bonscott87 Cutting Edge: ECHELON '07

    9,809
    2
    Jan 21, 2003
    That's all I think it is anyway.
     
  12. Mar 6, 2009 #2432 of 3658
    jacmyoung

    jacmyoung Hall Of Fame

    6,544
    0
    Sep 8, 2006
    I don't see any reason why D* will bother to sue TiVo, it cost a lot just to sue. D* does not rely on TiVo to do business.

    The same cannot be said the other way around at all.
     
  13. Mar 6, 2009 #2433 of 3658
    wingrider01

    wingrider01 Hall Of Fame

    1,764
    2
    Sep 9, 2005
    Sorry, if you believe that Directv is going to foot the additional cost of the TIVO fees without passing them on to the end users, I have a piece of land in arizona with ocean front property and a bridge I will sell you. That would be stupid business practices and the stock holders would pitch a fit.

    What would be even stupider is if they try to pass the increased costs onto the general user that does not want nor desire the TIVO interface. as mentioned in the original release, the TIVO based unit will be considered a premium service and will be charged as such, default dvr will be the Directv software based unit. The original release stated that the Directv based box will be the standard shipped to new customers.
     
  14. Mar 6, 2009 #2434 of 3658
    Curtis0620

    Curtis0620 Hall Of Fame

    1,500
    25
    Apr 22, 2002

    Sorry, I for one would welcome a new HD DirecTiVo. Was always more user friendly for the non-tech types.
     
  15. Mar 6, 2009 #2435 of 3658
    bonscott87

    bonscott87 Cutting Edge: ECHELON '07

    9,809
    2
    Jan 21, 2003
    I'm sure DirecTV thinks the same because the facts have backed it up over the past half decade. People, the general public, the "unwashed masses" do not see any value in Tivo as a brand, at least not enough to pay more. Certainly some do, but most do not. Thus why Tivo once owned the DVR market, now they have less then 10% of the market and shrinking by the day.

    So why bother doing the agreement? Cheaper (for both) to have the agreement then it is to fight a lawsuit, even if they were to win it. And as mentioned there is very little risk on the part of DirecTV here. DirecTV, in my opinion, finally said to Tivo "ok fine, you think Tivo is all that then we'll give you the subscriber fee you want, but we're going to pass it all on to the customer with a little extra for ourselves of course. Now prove you are the best." If this new DirecTivo is a hit it's a win for DirecTV and Tivo. If it's a failure or just mediocre on the uptake then it's no skin off DirecTV's back, they keep from being sued for another decade along with more subs paying $80+ a month and it's a loss for Tivo (although anything is better then they have now which is nothing but declining subs).

    This whole deal is basically a win all around for DirecTV no matter if they sell 5 million boxes or 500 boxes. The risk is all on Tivo here and they now have their chance to prove that people will indeed pay more for the Tivo brand. History has shown that people in general will not and I personally believe there will be some interest, perhaps a small success, but in general it's not going to take over the world unless DirecTV decides to abandon their own DVR plans such as the whole home DVR server and such.

    As for why DirecTV has been silent, the reason is above. DirecTV frankly doesn't care that much about it at this time. They've got bigger things to work on and their DVR is a success with over 40% of the subs now having one, pushing 50% they said the last conference call. Churn is down, sub numbers are up. DirecTV hasn't offered a Tivo product *in years* and people have not left in droves because of it. Plus this past quarter had record sub growth despite being the first quarter that the first HR20 subs came off commitments. 2-3 times more people have their branded DVR now then ever had the DirecTivo.

    All that said competition is good and I hope Tivo can come out with a product and the economy doesn't kill the project. But history and the facts are just not on the side of the people that think Tivo is somehow going to "save" DirecTV with this receiver or somehow overtake the in house DVR. Just not going to happen. But having an option is always good for the consumer, usually.
     
  16. Mar 6, 2009 #2436 of 3658
    Doug Brott

    Doug Brott Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

    28,939
    72
    Jul 12, 2006
    Los Angeles
    DIRECTV has always been very conservative with respect to DRM .. I don't see this arrangement as being any different in concept. Basically DIRECTV has acknowledged that TiVo has some licensing rights in this area and as it turns out, TiVo has acknowledged that DIRECTV has some licensing rights in this area (via Replay Patents) .. they negotiated a contract for cross-licensing so that neither party had to worry about litigation .. DIRECTV still has low risk .. meaning if the TiVo project either succeeds or fails, DIRECTV isn't really exposed .. yet as part of the arrangement, DIRECTV doesn't have to worry about getting sued by TiVo.
     
  17. Mar 6, 2009 #2437 of 3658
    Steve

    Steve Well-Known Member

    23,063
    154
    Aug 22, 2006
    Lower...
    You missed my point. We were talking about hardware, not monthly TiVo software service fees, which I agree should be passed on to the users who elect TiVo service. TiVo has agreed to port their software to a standard Direct DVR broadband box that would otherwise be shipping with DirecTV software on it, so there are no added hardware costs for DirecTV to pass along. /steve
     
  18. Mar 6, 2009 #2438 of 3658
    Tallgntlmn

    Tallgntlmn Icon

    888
    0
    Jun 7, 2007
    Raleigh, NC
    I can say I will be first in line for a TiVo depending on the feature set. If I get DLB but lose the other cool stuff the HR has, probably not. If I do not get DLB, DEFINITELY not. If I get Netflix, DLB, and media sharing, where do I sign up? It depends on a lot of things but the combination of feature sets is what will make my decision, not only the fee that may or may not be attached.
     
  19. Mar 6, 2009 #2439 of 3658
    Doug Brott

    Doug Brott Lifetime Achiever DBSTalk Club

    28,939
    72
    Jul 12, 2006
    Los Angeles
    What would you choose if DLB were to show up on the HR2x before the TiVo became available?
     
  20. Mar 6, 2009 #2440 of 3658
    Steve

    Steve Well-Known Member

    23,063
    154
    Aug 22, 2006
    Lower...
    And in case you missed, are you aware you can get Netflix on the HR2x today, via media sharing and Playon? If you already have a Netflix account that offers on-line downloads, you can get a free 30-day trial of the Playon software here. After that, the app is $40. /steve
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page