DIRECTV HD Receiver with TiVo (Official Q1 2011 Thread)

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by Mike Bertelson, Dec 28, 2010.

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  1. Feb 10, 2011 #801 of 1101
    Doug Brott

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    Yes it is.
     
  2. Feb 10, 2011 #802 of 1101
    Doug Brott

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    This probably makes the most sense .. Neither side really cares ..
     
  3. Feb 10, 2011 #803 of 1101
    bonscott87

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    Honestly at this point I am in agreement with this that neither side cares anymore. DirecTV never cared in the first place and Tivo knows that too much time has passed and the opportunity to make a splash is lost so even they don't care anymore. Maybe Tivo is simply delaying it long enough for their smaller cable company deals to roll out enough to make them money and then they can dump the DirecTV box and Wall Street won't ding them as much on it.
     
  4. Feb 11, 2011 #804 of 1101
    Caromsoft

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    Here is one example.

    Higher on the list = less or one chance to record.
    Lower on the list = lots of chances to record.

    The lower one might be more important to me, but I know it will be showing 20 times during the week. Project Runway shows many times for example, vs. Survivor which only shows once.

    Another example is if I have a conflict between two programs that only record once, but the higher one is a repeat and the lower one first run.
     
  5. Feb 11, 2011 #805 of 1101
    hdtvfan0001

    hdtvfan0001 Well-Known Member

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    Wondering out loud if the latest legal maneuvering and court decision between TiVo and Dish will result in yet further delays...or even killing the project.

    The neverending story of patent debates in the courts can't help matters.

    :shrug:
     
  6. Feb 11, 2011 #806 of 1101
    bobcamp1

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    On the reset button, you proved my point. PCs don't have them anymore. That's "hold down for 4 seconds" is not a reset, that's emergency power down, and is just like removing the battery or pulling the plug. That function is not even labeled. It's not arrogance to remove a reset button -- it's a sign of how stable you want your customers to think your product is.

    Plus, the only thing being stressed by pulling the plug and plugging back in is the power supply. The hard drive file system in a DVR should be journaled anyway, so you can pull the plug anytime. Tivo's is definitely journaled, and I hope the HR2x's is too.

    As far as the "two low priority" scenario, if you haven't had time to put things in order, whose fault is that? The Tivo does not have ESP. I agree that an option that says, "create the season pass and enter the season pass manager" would be a nice feature. But in those cases I just push <Tivo>-<1> and there I am.

    For the occasional "this one time make it higher priority" scenario, all recordings set to record from the guide have highest priority. Everything in the season pass manager should be prioritized. You can set your wishlist not to autorecord everything, and then go pick and choose which movies you want recorded. Or you can select the show you really want to record manually, thus making it the highest priority for that one time. I'd think it would be confusing to have a to do list that you couldn't directly trace to the season pass manager or individual show recordings, especially if the DVR is shared. Some have said you don't need a to do list -- this discussion contradicts that.

    To be honest, conflicts were rare when using the one-tuner Series 1, and non-existent when using the Series 2, even with my 60+ season passes. But I'll admit that I was lucky.

    As far as my 4 bad DVR scenario, my setup is simple. SL3 with one cable going to receiver in bedroom, two cables going to living room. A ground block is in between. All cables worked with an H20-600 and continue to work with an H24. No LOS issues. I've had four bad refurbished DVRs and one bad refurbished H20-600 (I now have two new H24s and have no problems). Perhaps that is the issue -- D* doesn't really refurbish anything, they just give it to another customer and hope they don't notice the problem. Refurbishing doesn't happen as much with Tivos, since they are mostly owned and bought brand new.
     
  7. Feb 11, 2011 #807 of 1101
    Earl Bonovich

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    Horrible example.

    The #1 reason why it was removed, IMHO... is because it was easily touched/pressed, and immediately rebooted a computer... no warning, no anything.

    The #2 reason, in most cases (and probably more so today), is the same as a power down (which typically clear more issues, because of power latency in some of the components).... the hold down of the power button serves the same purpose... as is by far less accidentally performed.

    It has ZERO to do with customer perception on how stable it is.
    Even the beloved MAC has this feature, and I have used it often enough (since there is no easy way to pull the battery from a modern MacBook)

    Not true either... the physical hard drive can also be damaged, and as shown many times over... the hard drive typically is stressed the most at start up/spin up time.

    You are most certainly lucky, that with 60 passes, you don't have many conflicts with 2 tuners.

    Before MRV, I had conflicts at least two times a week, with 5+ things trying to record at one time... (Not an issue anymore, since the 6 DVRs can talk to one another, I just schedule the 4 major networks on two of the DVRs, and the fringe recordings go to other systems when necessary)
     
  8. Feb 11, 2011 #808 of 1101
    Doug Brott

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    What!? Pressing and holding a power button that is on the front of a PC is the same thing as digging under your desk behind the PC to find the power cord? Come on. Even though it's a power-off function vs. a reset, that is not the real point. The real point is that you don't have to go to so much effort to cycle the box so that it starts responding again. People don't want to have to go behind their set top boxes for this. A push & hold to off button or a red button reset works just as well.


    The HR2x doesn't have ESP either .. which is why it's nice it lets you choose the one (of the three) to keep when you add a new item. ;)
     
  9. Feb 11, 2011 #809 of 1101
    bobcamp1

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    If the lower one is more important to you, put it higher in the priority list. Also, make sure you have you season pass set to "first run only" to minimize conflicts.

    A trick that Tivo users use is to have TWO season passes for the same show. The higher one is set to "first run" and keep until I delete (which actually works in a Tivo), and the lower pass records everything but only holds 3 or 4 shows. You don't have to do that for every show -- just the ones you have problems with. Since a Tivo has no season pass limit, there aren't any issues. I have had to do that only once in the past, but don't have to anymore. My DVR considers "first run" in a 28 day window, and records the new episode when it is rebroadcast later that night. For most non-network shows, that happens a few hours later at the most.
     
  10. Feb 11, 2011 #810 of 1101
    bobcamp1

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    Could you please tell my marketing people that? :grin: I agree with your other two reasons (well... not the hard drive so much), but the main reason that keeps it out of products I'm involved with ends up being customer perception.

    I think D* has it right -- hide it under a panel you have to swing open, and make it tiny. No one knows it's there until customer support tells them it's there. The S1 and S2 had no need for such a panel, so they didn't have a panel. Actually, they had NO buttons on the front of the display. It'd look bad if the only button there was a reset button. They could have put it in the back, but the power cord is right there too. And they did have a menu reset available.
     
  11. Feb 11, 2011 #811 of 1101
    CuriousMark

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    I really doubt it. This latest news is about an old Dish countersuit that will now be allowed to start. Nothing can come of it, win or lose, for years.
     
  12. Feb 11, 2011 #812 of 1101
    Earl Bonovich

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    Which part, that the button provides the perception...
    Or that the Mac doesn't need it. :D

    I got tired of pulling the power, I bought a remote control power switch (it was a plug module that sat in between the power strip and the powr plug), so I could easily power cycle it without pulling appart the entertainment cabinet. (at the time I was in a smaller home and things were very tight).
     
  13. Feb 11, 2011 #813 of 1101
    jacmyoung

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    The reopening of the countersuit puts an extra card in Charlie's hand, similar to when MS countersued TiVo after TiVo sued ATT. The relavance will be there if one believes the delay of the new DirecTiVo has some to do with the uncertainty about the TiVo's never ending suit with E*.
     
  14. Feb 11, 2011 #814 of 1101
    Doug Brott

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    ... And the suit is not relevant to this thread .. :backtotop
     
  15. Feb 11, 2011 #815 of 1101
    bobcamp1

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    You might want to keep that setup. Every time I called D* with a problem, the first thing they did was have me pull the plug for five minutes. They only mentioned the red reset button once, and had me push it AFTER the hard reset (smack forehead).

    I have been told that dedicated reset buttons are so 90's, and that I should just make my product better. Most devices that have a battery or plug in don't need a reset button -- people just disconnect the battery or unplug it anyway. The people at Apple screwed up with the non-removable battery -- the reset button is two wrongs trying to make a right. To this day, in fact today, I chuckled as someone removed the battery to restart his notebook PC instead of holding down the power button for four seconds. If customers don't use it, and customer service doesn't use it, and marketing doesn't want it, I'm not going to put it in my designs anymore. I give up. They must be onto something. Or on something.

    I'm sure the new HD DirecTivo will have a reset button. My management would strongly disapprove. I might still get one anyway. :)
     
  16. Feb 11, 2011 #816 of 1101
    bobcamp1

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    I finally understood this tonight. (It took me long enough) But if the same show is shown again within 28 days, Tivo will record it then anyway. So you're not really canceling the recording, you're probably postponing it. I suppose the DVR could then look to see if it WILL be reaired, but it would take a while to look through 28 days of guide data (and the DVR doesn't have that much guide data anyway), and you might have another conflict then, so it becomes a huge mess. So you still aren't sure which one to cancel when you're asked the question. I'd still want it to almost always cancel the lower priority recording and have the DVR figure it out.

    I looked tonight, and either by luck or trial and error, the network shows that don't re-air new episodes (and sports events) are higher in my Season Pass Manager than cable network first run episodes, which are reaired. Maybe that's why I don't have any conflicts or missed recordings.

    It all comes down to which features you'd prefer over others. For me, no hiccups in recording or playback, true KUID, 50+ season passes, and recycle bin are the most important. I'm just hoping they don't charge a huge amount for it.
     
  17. Feb 11, 2011 #817 of 1101
    inkahauts

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    A simple example why offering to cancel either recording is far more powerful.. I have one unit that is set up to record all my lakers games (highest priority) and then several cable shows... I also use that unit to randomly record one time events and movies... The other day I was getting ready to go to a friends house to watch a game.. When I selected a movie to record, it asked me which recording I wanted to cancel.. I naturally selected the higher priority one of the game, because I knew I was going to be elsewhere watching it already... Why Tivo thinks there will never be a situation like that is beyond me.

    Your workaround is a TOTAL joke. Thats worse than all the people complaining about the "workaround" for double play... First off, KUID works perfectly. I have never had an issue with it, ever. You don;t like it because if YOU set a limit of how many recordings it can keep, it will delete the oldest of those to record a new rather than not recording the newest one. Well, I'd be pissed either way because I missed a show, and I am more interested in making sure I get the latest info.

    Second reason your workaround is a joke.. DIrectv does this automatically for you! You don;t have to set a second season pass. If something gets canceled because of conflicts, it will record the next available showing. The only time this won;t work is if you purposely choose to not record something from he to do list. But if you choose to not record something from the conflict screen, it will happily record the next airing of a show, even if its labeled a repeat, because it knows it missed the first showing because of a conflict. SO actually, the HRs are smarter and don;t make you set up an annoying second season pass that would fill up your dvr with 99% of episodes that you don;t care about or have already seen as a workaround for conflict resolution...



    I never have any hiccups in recordings or playbacks, although I didn't really have any with tivo either, so frankly, that argument is a wash, unless you want to talk wishlists, in which case tivo sucked and never performed properly at all... I already said my piece about KUID... 50 is annoying, but then I don;t have an issue with it because I have enough DVRs that its never an issue.... But I agree that should be changed.. Recycle bin is easily the most important thing tivo has that I miss with an HR, but then its not something I would ever change dvrs for either... Its so far down the list of overall importance....

    Haha.. I am guessing at least an extra $5 a month.. I really expect it to actually be per dvr too, and without MRv with other directv units, its totally worthless IMHO... and thats before I cringe at their ridiculous GUI that treats people like they are all 5 and/or are idiots...
     
  18. Feb 12, 2011 #818 of 1101
    Brennok

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    The TiVo Slide comes with the Bluetooth usb adapter so as long as support for USB is included it could be possible. They did add the support in the Series 3 and TiVo HD so it should be possible. Of course if no USB ports then it won't matter.
     
  19. Feb 15, 2011 #819 of 1101
    fernly

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    Placed the amazon order for the new HDTV, the new a/v receiver, and the HR24 and AM21.

    OK, Tivo, it's all clear now. You can announce a ship date, now that I've committed the other way... :hurah:
     
  20. Feb 16, 2011 #820 of 1101
    bobcamp1

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    I agree, I just don't need that feature at all. I set up everything beforehand with Season Passes and let Tivo do all the scheduling for me. I rarely pick stuff to record directly off the guide, and when I do there's almost never a three-way conflict. I usually don't know which recording I want canceled -- it totally depends on whether there's going to be another showing later on, or what my wife really wants, and neither DVR tells you that. :grin:

    Tivo WILL automatically record the next showing, even with just one season pass. I've had some problems with the HR20 doing this consistently, though.

    KUID is implemented wrong, but that's OK. I am not the DVR, and the DVR is not me. Keep until ***I*** delete. What part of the letter 'I' does the DVR not get? What if I haven't watched the show in a while, but it's a show where you can't miss an episode? And then they show a marathon of older episodes with bad guide data? With the HR2x's implementation, all the new shows you haven't watched yet are gone. Tivo stops recording the marathon, saving the old shows. The HR2x's implementation is about prioritizing what recording get deleted to make room for other new shows, but it provides a false sense of security that a show will never get deleted when in fact it could.
     
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