DIRECTV HD TiVo (THR22-100) Anticipation (Official Q311 Thread)

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by Stuart Sweet, Jun 26, 2011.

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  1. Jul 1, 2011 #21 of 1071
    Shades228

    Shades228 DaBears

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    Ready to deploy is misleading as it's opinion based. Without specific features, to me, it would never be ready to deploy.

    They won't order units to have software loaded on until both TiVo and DIRECTV sign off as it's ready for production. Once that happens they'll order units which will take time. Then they'll have to get the marketing campaigns started as well as training for the test markets. That will take at least 1 if not 2 months. Then there will be inevitible delays of some sort. All of that is just for the soft/teaser/test launch. Then they have to go full production after they fix issues that are encountered with the first launch. That usually takes 2-3 months or so based on prior launch's.

    Then after people hear what it has and doesn't have they have to see how many they project to order. The usual problem with hardware launch's are they're successful and you have a supply issue. I don't see this one being a problem though even if they low ball the consumer demand.
     
  2. Jul 1, 2011 #22 of 1071
    Mike Bertelson

    Mike Bertelson 6EQUJ5 WOW! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Why is it misleading and opinion based?

    You can see the THR22-100 in the title. There has be extensive discussion of what features are to be included and which will not.

    Based on what’s been posted, it doesn’t seem misleading at all. AAMOF it seems we know more now than we ever did and finally have a solid idea of what’s going on.

    I guess you can say you don’t trust the information but, IMHO, it is far from misleading.

    My 3.34¢ :grin:

    Mike
     
  3. Jul 1, 2011 #23 of 1071
    usnret

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    I anticipate anticipating...
     
  4. Jul 2, 2011 #24 of 1071
    balboadave

    balboadave Legend

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    Isn't that the main reason for this new TiVo unit? To give all of the existing Series 1 and 2 customers a path to upgrade? For them, this will be an improvement, as they won't know what they're missing with the HR series. DirecTV might even require them to upgrade.
     
  5. Jul 2, 2011 #25 of 1071
    Jeremy W

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    Very highly doubtful.
     
  6. Jul 2, 2011 #26 of 1071
    johnner1999

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    Why wouldn't it have MRV??? The new Premiere boxes in the last update have a stream feature (not listed but does function) along with transfer as an option - I assume the transfer command would not be enabled on any D* TiVo box! Now this is a huge assumption on my part but....

    RePlayTV - holds the patent for streaming!
    DirecTV bought RePlay a few years ago no?
    TiVo has never had this feature (some say its was a hardware limitation which is correct BUT TiVo would/didn't want to pay RePlayTV)
    TiVo starts working with DirecTV again
    TiVo starts to have its newer STB's stream but not known yet by the public


    LONG <Short
    I think the D* box will be available once they perfect this stream function (by available - I mean an official launch date and or product specs)


    BUT who's knows this "company" doesn't seem to give a rants but about customers - the new owners seem to run it like an old fashioned cable-co
     
  7. Jul 2, 2011 #27 of 1071
    bonscott87

    bonscott87 Cutting Edge: ECHELON '07

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    Remember though that this new DirecTivo box is not based on the Premier so what it does and doesn't do has nothing to do with the Premier. It is the "Tivo Classic" software that will be on this box. You know, the 10 year old version of the Tivo software. ;)
     
  8. Jul 2, 2011 #28 of 1071
    elaclair

    elaclair Rescued Racers Live Here

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    Have not been following the original threads for a while, has it been ruled out that this could be a software upgrade to your existing system? ie can you do a software pull and change your HR24-100 to a THR24-100?
     
  9. Jul 2, 2011 #29 of 1071
    Mike Bertelson

    Mike Bertelson 6EQUJ5 WOW! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    It's likely that the THR22-100 is a TiVo branded unit.

    You won't be able to turn your HR24 into a TiVo.

    Mike
     
  10. Jul 2, 2011 #30 of 1071
    jacmyoung

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    Every company now has streaming between their boxes so I don't think the above theory holds.
     
  11. Jul 2, 2011 #31 of 1071
    johnner1999

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    It very well might hold true - or AT&T, Comcast etc pay a royalty (like E* is doing to TiVo and other do as well)

    or the other brands came up with a way to stream that didn't violate the patent
     
  12. Jul 2, 2011 #32 of 1071
    Doug Brott

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    Regardless, TiVo and DIRECTV have reciprocal non-litigation agreements regarding technology .. e.g. they cross-license. I'm sure TiVo could use any STB related Patents than DIRECTV may hold if TiVo wanted to.

    At this point, who know. Maybe TiVo saw the light and decided to add MRV .. heck, I actually think it will be there in the "second version" that comes out. But we're still waiting on the first version and it will be at least 36 months from the original "It's coming" announcement in 2008 before we'll even see that.
     
  13. Jul 2, 2011 #33 of 1071
    Shades228

    Shades228 DaBears

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    Saying something is ready for launch when it doesn't cover what most people now would consider a basic ability of all HD DVR's with DIRECTV is an opinion.

    If a company were to launch a premium priced blue ray player without network connectivity would you call that ready for launch? Most people would say it was pushed out before everything that it needs was done. While there has been extensive discussions about what people may or may not know about the features that will be there at launch time.

    It's not trusting information that I read here it's trusting information that I know.

    Just because they can cross license certain patents that doesn't mean that either company can put a feature in that the other says no to due to a patent. Maybe one company has a patent that isn't covered, or public allowed at this point, and the other company won't allow that particular feature or software to be used.
     
  14. Jul 2, 2011 #34 of 1071
    Doug Brott

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    It is true that I haven't read the agreement myself .. BUT .. it's clear that pretty much anything goes between the two companies with respect to features, etc. in DVRs. As long as it sticks in the technology realm and their not disparaging each other I doubt that there will be much of an issue. Clearly TiVo won't be able to steal a DIRECTV technology and produce it, but are reverse engineering or "similar" feature is probably fair game.

    Besides, aren't Patents by nature "public?"
     
  15. Jul 2, 2011 #35 of 1071
    jacmyoung

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    I think he meant DirecTV can demand royalties from ATT/Comcast...for MRV, since he thought Replay holds the patent on in-home streaming. I doubt this is the case though.
     
  16. Jul 2, 2011 #36 of 1071
    Shades228

    Shades228 DaBears

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    Public in terms of open for use by all compared to private use where you would have to have an agreement setup by them. As far as anything goes between the two companies we'll just have to agree to disagree on that part.
     
  17. Jul 2, 2011 #37 of 1071
    Doug Brott

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    All I know is that DIRECTV is happily using features that TiVo has sued others for .. TiVo & DIRECTV have an agreement .. Sure it may not be a free for all, but I seriously doubt that there is much more than a "Hey, can we do this?" phone call regarding any Patents.

    Besides, I'm not looking up nor quoting any Patents .. I don't care that much. I just don't see any Patent issues getting in the way of DIRECTV or TiVo when it relates to each other.
     
  18. Jul 2, 2011 #38 of 1071
    Brennok

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    Well it is not based on the premiere ui, but even in the classic ui on the premiere streaming works.

    Of course who knows what code they are using. It seems to make sense to use the current, Premiere based, assuming it is easily compatible. It would just be a matter of not including the HDUI portion.
     
  19. Jul 2, 2011 #39 of 1071
    jacmyoung

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    That is misleading because most patents are public, with the exception of a minority that are deemed classified. A patent not only is public, but also must provide detailed enough descriptions so that a person skilled in the field can duplicate the invention without undue experimentation, i.e. can copy it without much difficulty.

    A patent usually consists of multiple steps to describe an invention, if that person can copy the invention without using all of the described steps, he can copy it without consequences. So for example if the patent describes 10 steps, he can copy 9 out of 10, skip one step or replace it with one of his own, he is allowed to do so without permission by the patent holder. He of course risks being liable if the patent holder can sue and prove that he actually copied all 10 of the steps.

    I agree with Doug that the agreement between DirecTV and TiVo is practically a no-sue agreement, but regardless, since DirecTV now holds ReplayTV patents, even without such agreement, TiVo WILL NOT sue DirecTV.

    If you are correct that ReplayTV (therefore DirecTV) actually holds the in-home streaming patent, DirecTV can sue other companies for infringing on its patent. But DirecTV is unlikely going to bother TiVo if TiVo infringes on such streaming patent due to their agreement.

    As far as TiVo's Premiere goes, I do recall even before it, TiVo already had MRV on their classic DVRs. The THR22 should be able to do MRV easily without even using the Premiere code, just that DirecTV does not want such functions on the THR22. What that means is, the further delay is unlikely the result of them trying to add MRV or some other additional features to the THR22 before the rollout.
     
  20. Jul 2, 2011 #40 of 1071
    Shades228

    Shades228 DaBears

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    I could use open source and not public is that better? You can have a patent but not enforce it and let others know it's not being enforced. I have no idea what the technical term is if any but that's what I was talking about.

    As far as the patent agreement again we have to agree to disagree on this.
     
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