DIRECTV Nomad

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by Scott Kocourek, Oct 6, 2010.

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  1. Oct 2, 2011 #1901 of 2007
    dualsub2006

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    I'm not taking Gizmodo's word as good on this as there seems to be a number of errors in their story. We should wait for an official release or for one of the testers here that actually has the device to answer this question.

    For me, if there is a 30 day limit imposed I'll just go ahead with my plans to buy a Vulkano and I'll look at an eyeTV to rip shows from my DVR to my devices.
     
  2. Oct 2, 2011 #1902 of 2007
    inkahauts

    inkahauts Well-Known Member

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    Since this could change on a whim, until its released (and frankly, it can always change after its released as well) I don't think anyone can really say for certain either way.
     
  3. Oct 2, 2011 #1903 of 2007
    Tom Robertson

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    Whatever limits there might be, I can't imagine a limit requiring one to transcode/transfer within a certain amount of time after recording. Seems like the goal is to give us access to our recordings.

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  4. Oct 2, 2011 #1904 of 2007
    markrogo

    markrogo Godfather

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    A) So basically if I am going on vacation and want to cue up like 6 hours of TV for taking with me, I have to remember about 7 hours ahead of time then?

    6 hours to transfer it all to Nomad and then some accelerated time to get it to the iPad?

    B) And can I tag like 5-6 things to go to Nomad so it doesn't need babysitting?

    C) Or is it possible to pre-flag stuff as it records to also go to Nomad?
     
  5. Oct 2, 2011 #1905 of 2007
    Tom Robertson

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    I suspect that would be one way to use it, the night before, queue up things you'll want to take. Or each night before the trip, queue things to build up a library for the trip.

    On my DVRs, I have a large library of movies I like, so I would generally always have them on my laptop anyway.

    Edit: by the way, I bet it can transcode and transfer two different things roughly at the same time. So only the last thing would need to transfer after the transcoding. Of course, transfer speed is going to entirely depend upon your network connection type.

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  6. Oct 2, 2011 #1906 of 2007
    markrogo

    markrogo Godfather

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    I honestly don't use DirecTV for movies at all, but I get a lot of use out of it for TV -- enough that the $100+ per month (including sports) doesn't seem entirely unreasonable. I'm just trying to imagine the use cases for myself (and to a lesser extent others). It really seems like it requires a lot of planning.

    By way of example, I have taken DVDs/BluRays on my laptop with me and these days I like to rip them to the hard drive ahead of time and leave the discs at home. If I don't go and do this before I leave, I can drag the DVD drive and some movies with me or seek movies via download (which go pretty quick over iTunes since the movie files are not that huge).

    With Nomad, there is a substantial amount of what we call around here "activation energy" to make it useful. First, I need the thing to be recorded. Then, I need to move it to Nomad. Then, I need to move to, say, iPad.

    And, for what it's worth, as a practical matter, iPad and phones speak WiFi and nothing faster. Though I'm sure there are nifty devices/hacks to get them on Ethernet, let's be real, that's not happening for 99.99% of users. WiFi has a lot of raw bandwidth, but isn't the fastest transfer medium in the universe alas. But my sense is the transfer isn't really the biggest issue. The biggest issue is that if I want 6 hours of stuff from my DVR, I better have started the move more than 6 hours before leaving for the trip.

    For those of you that are excited about Nomad, more power to you. I just have a very difficult time imagining most people will even begin to comprehend how this works, let alone want one (let alone use it if they had one). It seems marginally more interesting for people that commute by rail/bus who would get into a habit of moving one program, regularly, to their mobile device. But AT&Ts ads notwithstanding, is that really a lot of people?

    I'm always curious about these legal solutions that make the illegal solutions seem genius by comparison. Generally, I don't torrent anything, but occasionally we need to grab an episode of something because we go look for it after it aired and for some reason it's not on the DVR (glitch, pre-emption by sports or political speech, accidental deletion, whatever). So when that happens, I find the episode with a 2 second Google search and then start downloading it. Now, I don't know whether they ever resolved the VLC pissing contest around iOS, but I can say 100% of those files play back on my Mac and Win7 machines. And once the download is done -- typically 30 mins to an hour, sometimes 4-6 hours for older material -- I'm done, it's there, voila. If I really want to, I can make the destination folder Dropbox and I'm safely guaranteed the sync will complete in minutes if I just turn on the device in question.

    I kinda think most of you that want Nomad already know how to do all this way better than I do. And that the illegal version is far more full featured and useful. You don't need to remember to record. You don't need to download before you leave home. If you're on vacation, you can download more content. Morally? Well, you are all DirecTV subs, so if you didn't download anything you weren't already paying for a subscription to, the grey area would seem to especially grey -- i.e. the "crime" is like doing 65 in a 55 zone. To be clear, I'm not advocating torrenting, I'm not suggesting that you ever download anything you don't have a subscription for, etc.

    I just feel like the Nomad 1.0 use cases are really quite limited. And I'm sorry to rehash some of this on Page 77 of this thread, it just seems weird that DirecTV is even fussing with this thing. If they reach 2% of the subscriber base in 12 months with it, I'd be nothing short of floored (I'll grant they can get to 1% because if they market it some people will buy it not knowing what the heck it does and then end up never using it).

    The other niche solutions of recent vintage like multi-room and the OTA tuner would seem (a) to benefit more people and (b) at least in the case of MRV, have important competitive ramifications. And my guess is MRV is already decently penetrating the subscriber base while also providing small but real recurring revenue to DirecTV. I know Nomad is the first piece in a strategy, but it's an odd first piece. When I can "dial into it" from afar, it strikes me as so much less odd.
     
  7. Oct 2, 2011 #1907 of 2007
    Tom Robertson

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    I'm confused how nomad requires lots of activation energy in comparison to disks. Steps to rip a disk:1) plan ahead enough to acquire disk. 2) insert disk. 3) rip. 4) repeat (You have to be there between each item.) How many hours do you have to be there to babysit all those disks?

    Steps to use nomad: 1) acquire the material (record to DVR). 2) tell nomad to transcode and download all the things you want.

    I'm presuming for the moment that nomad will let you queue things up (bet it does) and let you transcode and download in one selection (bet it does that too, I can't really imagine anyone would make it one at a time.)

    So with nomad I won't have to order a disk, I won't have to do change disks for each recording, etc. Sounds like a winner to me. :)

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  8. Oct 2, 2011 #1908 of 2007
    markrogo

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    First of all, I'm not saying the disc method is good. But it takes about 15-20 minutes to rip a disc. So if I want 8 hours of movies, I can do that in an hour. The discs are already around; I'm not acquiring movies for the purpose of traveling with them; I either want to watch them or not.

    If I only want 4 hours worth of movies, that's two discs, typically 30 mins worth of effort. With Nomad, it's 4 hour + transfer time. And the thing already needed to be on the DVR.

    Again, this isn't "ripping discs good, Nomad bad". It's "Nomad really convoluted". I doubt most people would ever bother with ripping discs either. Many BluRays now include a "digital copy" that I'm sure most people don't even know exists, let alone what to do with.
     
  9. Oct 2, 2011 #1909 of 2007
    Tom Robertson

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    Fair 'nuff, though I'm not sure what the convoluted is.

    Hopefully when nomad comes out we can see if it really is convoluted or not. :)

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
  10. Oct 3, 2011 #1910 of 2007
    dualsub2006

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    I've yet to see any authoritative source say that it takes 4 hours to transcode 4 hours worth of video. Even if it did, I would prefer a set it and let it go solution to one that involved me having to jockey discs to rip and take along my MacBook when I travel. My MacBook is larger and heavier than my iPad and gets a fraction of the battery life.

    Like you have your DVD collection already, I've got lots of stuff that I want to see on my DVRs already, with more added weekly. If the nomad works, I'd have no issue with setting up some titles to transcode and transfer before heading off to bed.

    I don't really care if most people don't know that there are digital copies (that expire rather quickly) on their discs or if most people won't want anything to do with the nomad. If it transcodes and transfers DVR material to my iPad or my Android phone, that's a winner for me. Even if it actually is real time transcoding.
     
  11. Oct 3, 2011 #1911 of 2007
    markrogo

    markrogo Godfather

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    It's the two-step part of it that's convoluted. This bit where you have to transfer something to Nomad and then Nomad transfers it your device would make Rube Goldberg really proud. There is also fairly overwhelming evidence that transfer occurs at "playback" speeds.

    If the device were able to read a stream off the DVR and transcode it directly to the iPad (or phone or whatever) and said stream wouldn't compete with watching something off said DVR in any way, we'd be talking about something a lot more desirable.
     
  12. Oct 3, 2011 #1912 of 2007
    Jeremy W

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    Nobody said it takes 4 hours to transcode 4 hours of video. But it does take 4 hours to transfer 4 hours of video to the Nomad.
     
  13. Oct 3, 2011 #1913 of 2007
    dualsub2006

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    Well, maybe I'm just dense, but I personally would count the time that it takes to move content from DVR to nomad against the transcoding speed.

    As I said, time to transcode wouldn't be a deal breaker for me.
     
  14. Oct 3, 2011 #1914 of 2007
    Jeremy W

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    Transferring and transcoding are two distinct processes. That's like counting the time it takes to buckle your seatbelt and start the car in a 0-60 time. You can't throw in irrelevant stuff.

    Now if you were to say something like "Nomad import process" that combines the two, that would make sense and it would be a good statistic for people to know. So they could assume, for example, that a 30 minute show will be available to load on their device 40 minutes after they queue it up on their DVR.
     
  15. Oct 3, 2011 #1915 of 2007
    dualsub2006

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    If it takes 40 minutes to get a 30 minute show on my iPad I would hardly call the first 30 minutes irrelevant. And hair splitting about different categories that time should be classified in is more irrelevant than counting transfer time as transcoding time.

    Face it, if it takes 4 hours to TRANSFER 4 hours of content and then say another hour to TRANSCODE and another 20 minutes to move it to a device, people will view that as 5 hours and 20 minutes, not 4 hours and then an hour and then 20 minutes.

    Total time to completion. This thing is slow if you are right and there is no way around that.
     
  16. Oct 3, 2011 #1916 of 2007
    Diana C

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    Yeah, we'd be talking about streaming. ;)
     
  17. Oct 3, 2011 #1917 of 2007
    Jeremy W

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    Way to cut out the second part of my post where I say the total time is relevant. :rolleyes:

    I'm just trying to help you keep your terminology straight, that's all. Transfer time is absolutely relevant to the overall Nomad experience, but it has nothing to do with transcode time. Do you understand now?

    Transfers occur in real time. That is a known fact. So there is no way a 30 minute show can be available in less than 30 minutes. What I don't know is how long transcoding will take, which is to say I don't know how much more time is added on after the transfer process.
     
  18. Oct 3, 2011 #1918 of 2007
    Sixto

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    It seems like it will work like I've always used TiVoToGo.

    I kept a cable connection and a Series3 just for iPad TV recordings.

    Before heading out on vacation or a business trip, the night before (or a few days before), I copy all of the desired recordings from the Series3 to a PC and schedule the transcoding. It takes several hours, and I usually run it at night.

    Then before heading out, I do a quick copy of the transcoded recordings to my iPad.

    It's seems like nomad may be very similar, and remove the need for the Series3 (for me).
     
  19. Oct 3, 2011 #1919 of 2007
    Laxguy

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    This makes more sense. I bet some will keep a few movies on it, always ready to go, and the night before load up some more current stuff for on-the-road viewing.
     
  20. Oct 3, 2011 #1920 of 2007
    Tom Robertson

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    I don't think you will have to "schedule" two steps. I suspect you'll schedule one step (put something(s) on my playback device) and it will do whatever steps are necessary to put them onto your playback device. While it might be two steps (for something that hasn't been transcoded) or just one step for something that has been already transcoded, I really don't think you'll schedule both steps individually.

    So I suspect you'll find it won't be convoluted at all.

    Cheers,
    Tom
     
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