Distant Networks: STELA reauth, DNS and LiL

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by slice1900, Mar 15, 2019.

  1. Michael H..

    Michael H.. Member

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  2. GordonGekko

    GordonGekko Active Member

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    Did you find anything interesting, not certain who wants to read all of those pages.

    Update: After reading the important parts, it confirms what already has been written, the non RV DNS subscribers will lose the channels at the end of May at the latest. I was hoping that underserved markets would include those towns that were too far to pick up a local's HD antenna signal but that is not the case.

    One less thing tying me to Directv and it opens up the freedom to allow a full disconnect cancellation and a possible new subscription with a deal, without worrying about losing the distant channels.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2020
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  3. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I found the fee information in the document to be interesting. The statutory fee paid to copyright holders has dropped 90%. That means that the number of subscribers relying on distants has also dropped, probably by the same percentage (more if the statutory rate per subscriber increased).

    While distant subscribers, RV and grandfathered, are well represented on DBS Talk and other satellite forums - their numbers are certainly waning.
     
  4. GordonGekko

    GordonGekko Active Member

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    It would be interesting to learn the real number, I really only use them for the NFL but even without the NFL, I would still pay for them, why, I don't know, I just like having a channel that is impossible to have on any other service, even if I watch one Los Angeles news broadcast per year. I remember the old days with the rigged satellite card and the spot beams, you could watch news broadcasts all across the country. And I know you can do that now on the internet but whatever, sadly Directv is slowly dying.
     
  5. cpalmer2k

    cpalmer2k New Member

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    The document did say another reason for the drop in revenue was the decline of Superstations too though. TBS/WGN used to be included in that as did the Superstations on Dish. It’s hard to know how much of the revenue was for DNS vs. those too
     
  6. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator

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    The comparison was between six months in 2014 and the same six months in 2019. Long after TBS and WGN stopped being superstations (their local station feeds were not carried nationally and they charged subscription rates instead of relying on the statutory rate). DISH ceased allowing customers to add superstations in 2013, but did not turn off existing customer's feeds.

    The marketing and distribution of distants by DIRECTV would have outpaced DISH's superstations. I believe the primary loss came from DIRECTV adding in market locals and customers who either lost eligibility by changing providers or gave up distants to get all of their locals. The legal changes in 2014 made it harder to keep both and eliminated east coast locals for west coast viewers.
     
  7. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator

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    The illegal reception of signals didn't change under STELA.
     
  8. GordonGekko

    GordonGekko Active Member

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    Ha, yes I know that, it was not me, only a friend, I just remember when I would watch TV over there, Seattle, OKC, multiple locals, but one thing, the rigged cards are a thing of the past.
     
  9. bjlc

    bjlc Icon

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    what consists of an RV ? and what are the rules.. I have three Suburbans all for camping.. does this quailify?
     
  10. GordonGekko

    GordonGekko Active Member

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    Anyone get any communications from Directv regarding their grandfathered DNS channels?
     
  11. cpalmer2k

    cpalmer2k New Member

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    Nothing here, have you?
     
  12. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Has DIRECTV added any of the missing markets? Per the law, grandfathering ends when the last market is added and no later than May 31st. If they don't add the final market by May 31st it will be more than the grandfathered customers losing their distants.

    I don't keep track of DIRECTV market additions - have there been any this year? How many markets are left to add?
     
  13. techguy88

    techguy88 Well-Known Member

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    None that I'm aware of and I haven't seen anything over at Edge Cutters about the missing markets having any locals added. Although AT&T could wait until the last possible minute to activate the remaining 12 markets in order to avoid paying the local channels of those DMAs until they have to. So we may not know until May 31, 2020 hits about the fate of DirecTV DNS.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2020
  14. Michael H..

    Michael H.. Member

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    There has been no change in my market in regards to adding any local network channels.
    Not surprisingly, the results of the DTV app to determine DNS eligibility hasn't changed from when I ran the first version of this back in '94 when the DNS channels (which only comprised of ABC, CBS, and NBC [Edit: From a mix of local affiliates, NYC, DC, Pittsburgh, Raleigh, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle rather than currently all from NYC & LA]) cost $1.50 each.
    I was actually a carry-over from DNS from C-band service, and the STELA (different acronym back then and with every 5-year extension except the present), which was revised to include DBS to the C-band legislation.
    Back then, when Pegasus contracted DTV / USSB service for rural communities on behalf of DTV, most of the Pegasus customers that I knew, and a significant percentage of urban DTV customers opted for DNS, before the advent of DTV 7S and later (spotbeams) enabled LIL.
    Now, all of the neighbors that had DNS, have long since relinquished it, even though local channels were never added to DTV, but have been available via OTA. (Edit: Network affiliate OTA available in the sense that a neighbor has OTA affixed atop a 60' tower in order to get 60% 'ish pre-amplified signal strength from broadcast towers 85 miles away through mountainess terrain. I receive three non-network OTA stations from a local mountaintop broadcast locale.)
    I am grandfathered, and would have still received DNS even if LIL was available in my market, and if grandfathering were to be eliminated, I should still be eligible for DNS based upon no LIL or qualified OTA signal.
    One neighbor, who had relinquished DNS, re-applied (10 years ago?) and although received local station waivers based upon no qualified OTA signal, was denied by DTV.
    The paraphrased answer they received from DTV was that although eligible, DTV was only permitted, not obligated, to provide the service, and elected not to.
    There are estimates that there are 800K (at the end of 2019) DNS customers.
    Would be hard to believe that ATT doesn't care if they lose that revenue, and lose those customers that will cancel DTV if they lose DNS... but ATT has demonstrated that this is consistent with their current vision...
     

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    Last edited: Apr 16, 2020
  15. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Consider the revenue gone. In six weeks DIRECTV will not be able to provide a distant network affiliate in any market where that network has a local affiliate. Even if the network affiliate is a subchannel or does not cover the entire market OTA. Only missing networks in short markets will be allowed (for example, an ABC affiliate in a market with no local ABC). Only RV/commercial vehicles will be able to get a out of market distants package.

    It gets worse if DIRECTV does not offer carriage in every market by May 31st. I hope someone at AT&T|DIRECTV is paying attention to the deadline. (Offer as in contacting every local station in those markets and asking if they want to be carried. If a station refuses carriage it cannot be carried. Nor can a distant be carried in its place.)
     
  16. TheRatPatrol

    TheRatPatrol Hall Of Fame

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    Do you think it got put on hold due to the virus?
     
  17. slice1900

    slice1900 Well-Known Member

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    They haven't added any, but like I said before I would expect if they do add them they'd be done in the second half of May. It takes time to set up the LRFs and the equipment in the RUFs, plus it will cost Directv more since they'd be delivering BOTH the locals and DNS to those markets assuming those customers are grandfathered with the DNS channels.

    If they are working to add the markets I imagine the pandemic has set back their plans since they aren't going to want employees to travel to set up the LRFs. So they could probably ask the FCC and/or Congress for a delay in the deadline.

    If they aren't planning on doing this, it is bizarre that they wouldn't communicate to the affected customers. Unless they were planning on just cutting them off on June 1st, and telling upset customers to complain to their congressmen :)
     
  18. Gary Toma

    Gary Toma UNIX

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    Directv does not provide local service to 12 DMAs at this time. The last DMA addition was Charlottesville, VA, on 9/ 17/2014. There is no indication of any work being done to add any of those DMAs. There also has been no request for a delay.

    For those interested, here-is-the-link to the DMA data (in post #1).
     
  19. tomspeer46

    tomspeer46 Legend

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    On the other hand, they have adequate free spot beam bandwidth to serve all 12 unserved DMAs, if they are doing the preparation for getting the signals in the background. They wouldn't have to leave any indications that we can see.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2020
  20. bjlc

    bjlc Icon

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    i just think that they shouldn't have to complete this task at this time and to kick this can down hte road another 5 years... because by then Directv and dish may be gone and the situation moot..
     
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