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Dual Buffers

Discussion in 'DIRECTV HD DVR/Receiver Discussion' started by Que, Aug 17, 2006.

Dual Buffers

  1. A must have!

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. Don't really care about it.

    94.1%
  3. Like the option but, Ok if it's not there.

    5.9%
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  1. Oct 8, 2007 #1661 of 2967
    Earl Bonovich

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    I would not say it is True of SLBs...
     
  2. Oct 8, 2007 #1662 of 2967
    Earl Bonovich

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    Funny thing that you should mention Comcast's DVR...
    I was at my Aunt's house yesterday... (Sister's wedding shower).
    So I was upstairs using her HD-DVR (Comcast Motorola, not sure what version).

    But... it didn't even HAVE a SINGLE buffer... at least not one that I could find.
    As I went to bathroom, came back and saw that Indy only had 13 points instead of 14, and wanted to see what happen.

    Hit RW... nothing....

    And she does have DVR service....

    But I digress... Yes, I do know some of the reasons why...
    And yes, I can't share them.
     
  3. Oct 8, 2007 #1663 of 2967
    raott

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    The Motorola 6412/6416's have DLBs. It is what many if not most Comcast areas are using. I used one for over three months and it was a one button press to switch tuners and buffers.
     
  4. Oct 8, 2007 #1664 of 2967
    Earl Bonovich

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    It was some fancy dancy looking (relatively "state of the art" looking) DVR...
    It was a MOTO box, but not sure which one... definently wasn't the same as the GI digital box my brother in law has...

    But all I know....
    I hit REWIND on the remote (and had been watching it for a long period of time), and it didn't rewind into a buffer.

    So either it was not "intuitive" enough, even for me.... or it failed to buffer the show.

    But again... I digress.... but I did find it funny...
     
  5. Oct 8, 2007 #1665 of 2967
    swconsult

    swconsult Cool Member

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    Folks, look at the life this topic has after 2 years. Talk about ignoring your customers! So seriously Earl, WHO DO WE COMPLAIN TO???????
     
  6. Oct 8, 2007 #1666 of 2967
    Earl Bonovich

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    Anyone that you want...

    If you want to write a letter... send it to the Office of the President.
     
  7. Oct 8, 2007 #1667 of 2967
    nhey

    nhey Cool Member

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    You don't understand what dual live buffers means.

    I can tell with absolute certainty that the Comcast DVRs including all of their current MOTO boxes do NOT, and I repeat NOT, have DLBs. You can switch back and forth between tuners but the buffer is NOT preserved on the first tuner when you switch to the second tuner and then switch back to the first tuner. I have a Tivo Series 3 with FIOS TV service, and also had Comcast HD until 3 weeks ago when I went back to D*. Having the TIVO I know what DLB means.

    So D* is definitely not alone in this unfortunate decision.
     
  8. Oct 8, 2007 #1668 of 2967
    smithrh

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    Mainly directed at Earl:

    So, is it in the realm of possibility that if enough people complain DTV will change their stance?
     
  9. Oct 8, 2007 #1669 of 2967
    bhumps

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    Alright, time to come out of hiding. I’ve been lurking here a long time. Like many others, I too found this site after taking delivery of the HR20 about a year ago and turning to Google in an effort to figure out which button I needed to press in order to change tuners. I had no idea it was called DLB, I just knew every time I turned on the TV, I found two shows and surfed back and forth (I have the attention span of a third grader).

    Before I get to my point, I’d like to say thanks to all who make this site the wonderful place that it is. While this may be my first post, I’ve started to feel like many of you are old friends over the last year.

    After following this (and so many other) DLB threads, I’ve always been under the belief that the HR20 worked exactly like the HR10-250 in that it was utilizing tuner #1 out of the box and would change to tuner #2 only when tuner #1 was recording a show. It seemed so frustrating to me then that the only thing standing between myself and DLB was what would seem to be a simple software tweak allowing me to toggle between tuners.

    During the recent launch of D10 while reading through many of the testing threads on this site I came to the conclusion that the HR20 utilizes its tuners in a different manner than its predecessor. Forgive me if this was known to everyone else or has been previously stated, but it seems to me that upon a channel change, the HR20 also changes tuners (see quote below from Stuart Sweet as one example of a few that I found).

    General troubleshooting for Channel 498 Problems

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    General troubleshooting for Channel 498 Problems:

    First tune to channel 498 and see if you see a Congratulation Screen (no audio), If you can, you are getting the new HD satellite! You are done!

    If you instead you have a black or gray screen, try this:
    Try tuning to channel 72, then 73, then back to 498.


    As this applies to adding DLB to the HR20, my typical scenario of finding a show on tuner #1, toggling to tuner #2 and finding another show, then toggling back and forth to watch, becomes more than just adding a “toggle tuner” function to the HR20’s software. Even if we had the option to toggle to tuner #2, the minute we changed the channel, the HR20 would revert back to tuner #1 for the new channel, leaving tuner #2 where it was.

    While this doesn’t answer the burning question “why no DLB?” it does pose the question “why auto alternate tuners on channel change?”

    My apologies if this wins the “No Sh@# Sherlock” award but I found it interesting.
     
  10. Oct 8, 2007 #1670 of 2967
    Earl Bonovich

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    My honest opinion...

    It's going to take a LOT to change their stance.
     
  11. Oct 8, 2007 #1671 of 2967
    Lord Vader

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    It would help if we knew why they were so darn stubborn.
     
  12. Oct 8, 2007 #1672 of 2967
    smithrh

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    Well, exactly.

    I can think of half a dozen reasons, but they're all quite silly.

    I'd say there are 5 basic reasons why a corporation does something like this:

    * Partnership issues
    * Technology
    * IPR issues
    * Revenue issues
    * Embarrassment/simple bloodymindedness

    So, either they're bumping up against a contractual issue that we might be unaware of, or they're enjoined from doing it, they think it will hurt revenues, or they're being daft.

    I left out technology in the second list because it sounds like that's not an issue here.

    If it would take a lot for them to enable DLB, it's got to be a money issue one way or the other. "Follow the money" is probably apt advice here as in Watergate.
     
  13. Oct 8, 2007 #1673 of 2967
    JohnLips

    JohnLips Cool Member

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    What do you mean by a LOT? Is two years of asking for it not enough? And why is it such a secret?
     
  14. Oct 8, 2007 #1674 of 2967
    Lord Vader

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    Not a "corporation" but DirecTV specifically.

    Earl has already explained that it has nothing to do with technology--they can implement it easily--and it has nothing to do with legalities. Casting these aside, I can only surmise that the reasons are ones that if revealed, would really tick off their customers. The fact that Earl cannot divulge these reasons leads me to believe that that just might be it.
     
  15. Oct 8, 2007 #1675 of 2967
    cygnusloop

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    Here's a thought...

    I am coming at this by thinking about how the single buffer works. The HR20 doesn't really buffer a a particular channel, it buffers programs or shows. Let me say that again, the HR20's buffer is program or show based, not time based, per se. We also know that the second buffer is there, we just cant access it, except under very specific circumstances (this has been proven many times).

    I am hoping that the big secret relates to what could be in the works for the buffers on the HR20. What I am thinking (or perhaps just hoping) is that these buffered programs will somehow be made available on some kind of list.

    What I envision is a list that could be called up that contains the current set of programs that are in the buffer on both tuners at a given time. On that list, there would be options to watch, or perhaps to dump the program to the playlist.

    I am likely way off base here, but something like this seems the only rational reason that there are no DLB's on the HR20, and the only rational reason that there has been no real feedback on this one particular issue, when feedback has been forthcoming on so many other issues and feature requests.
     
  16. Oct 8, 2007 #1676 of 2967
    Lord Vader

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    Your contention is based on technological issues, which Earl has repeatedly emphasized are not the reason.
     
  17. Oct 8, 2007 #1677 of 2967
    Earl Bonovich

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    Bufferf is "program based" ?

    So explain to me why in my buffer right now, is three different shows?

    Journey Man, Local News, Jay Leno?
     
  18. Oct 8, 2007 #1678 of 2967
    cygnusloop

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    If you are replying to me...

    I think you misunderstood my post (I have edited to clarify). That is exactly what I am saying. Unlike the TiVo buffer, which is strictly time based, the HR20's buffer is program (or show based). It doesn't hold (necessarily) 90 minutes, but one 60 minute and one 30 minute program (for example).
     
  19. Oct 8, 2007 #1679 of 2967
    cygnusloop

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    My take on what he said was that there is no technological reason that DLB's couldn't be on the HR20. My contention is that it was a design decision.
     
  20. Oct 8, 2007 #1680 of 2967
    Earl Bonovich

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    Right now... in my buffer, I only have the last 30 ish minutes of Journey Man, all of the local news, and now all of Jay Leno that has aired so far.

    It is a "time" base buffer... not program based.
     
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