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Dual SWIM-16 Multiswitches & Multiple Genie's?

Discussion in 'DIRECTV Installation/MDU Discussion' started by kikkenit2, Sep 6, 2013.

  1. Sep 6, 2013 #1 of 47

    kikkenit2 Icon

    Oct 25, 2006
    Will Directv go for this? They are coming out next Wednesday.
    Protection plan offered a 2nd Genie for $300, but case management
    said only 1 per account? I'm scheming for a free replacement.

    My current equipment is 1 leased HR34, 1 leased HR24 and 6 owned HR20
    dvr's for a total of 19 recordable tuners. Just bought a newer home with
    8 single coaxial cables running inside walls from a panel to 8 rooms.

    Harley from Caldwell, Idaho installed a new dish and SWIM-16 exactly
    as shown on solid signal website. He connected 2 four way splitters
    as seen here, except no cinema kit.


    The 8 feeds were not labeled, but most of my receivers were in storage
    so everything worked fine. When I tried to wake up all the boxes I
    started getting 776 cabling errors. Finally figured out I had 9 tuners
    on the 4 way splitter. I traced each cable and now have all 8 labeled.

    I want directv to split the 4 lines near the dish and run the cables
    for a second SWIM-16 in the crawl space to the living room like this.


    I can only connect 7 tuners to each red line feed with a genie and a 20
    or 24 box. 3 of my hr20's are broke or lock up and need rbr's often.
    Hoping to trade those for a second genie for free. I need either 14 or
    15 tuners at my main viewing location for football recording.

    And I still want the original 8 locations available for other or future
    tv's. With this install 24 tuners would be active in the living room even
    though 15 is plenty. Slim chance, but would like to trade other hr20's for a
    third genie to lower monthly bill.

    With 19 tuners they have to add the second multiswitch correct? 8 dvr's
    allows expanding to more TV's without another visit, but 2 or 3 genie's
    is simpler and a lower monthly payment. I only own 2 tv's right now.
    Is this all a feasible install?
  2. Sep 6, 2013 #2 of 47

    inkahauts Well-Known Member

    Nov 13, 2006
    No not at all. They will not activate two genies on the account period. And if someone did screw up and activate it, they'd catch it on an audit and shut it off. Don't even bother till they change that rule,and it will be screamed about here the day it happens.

    Second why do you need so many tuners in the main room. Do you not have Whole Home Service turned on? And if your having lockups, then something is wrong with your setup. There is no way possible for you to have all the receivers hooked up right now and working right. But its better to figure out the best final solution than to figure out what is wrong now to be honest.

    With that said, one note... If HR20 are in the same cabinet and not getting enough air, that's probably the issue right there. Those things run hot and start locking up if they get a little extra hot and it sounds like you have a lot of DVRs piled in one area.

    Personally If all you need is 15 tuners I'd get your system down to 16 and get rid of the rest. One genie, one genie client, plus five DVRs running two tuners and one h25 and be done (or run one more DVR in one tuner only mode instead of the h25, or use two genie clients and run with 15 tuners)

    I can't even figure out why you need 14 tuners for football... There's never more than what, 13 games at most playing at any one time. Sometimes less than that. Unless your going after college too. Then I think you need 50 tuners... :)

    Otherwise, just follow the right the right diagram and run the two swim16 and have one genie and seven hr2xs still. But just spread your recovers out amoung your tvs and use splitters at the tvs to make all the tuners work and not require you to rewire away from your main home run location for the coax cables. I'd put the splitters and the second swim in with the current one so they are all in the same place. Hopeful this is a big enough area and has ventilation as well, since swim16s can get hot as well.

    How many tvs do you have in your living room.

    Sent from my iPad using DBSTalk mobile app
  3. Sep 6, 2013 #3 of 47

    peds48 Genius.

    Jan 10, 2008
    Yup, the system will not allow the activation of a second Genie. Others have tried and failed
  4. Sep 6, 2013 #4 of 47

    CDJohnson25 Mentor

    Nov 4, 2007
    On a long...
    peds, you need a macro for that reply:)
  5. Sep 6, 2013 #5 of 47

    kikkenit2 Icon

    Oct 25, 2006
    I thought I read here recently that some accounts have 2 genie's now. Well then, my goal is to be the first.
    The hr24 is fine. The genie is more convenient and should save me a few%2
  6. Sep 6, 2013 #6 of 47

    kikkenit2 Icon

    Oct 25, 2006
    I believe you guys. That is why I read your posts. The last service tech was a rookie
    and didn't know he was connecting 9 tuners on 1 feed. If I end up with 7 hr24's and 1 genie
    that will give me more flexibility and more total storage. Just tired of seeing a long list
    of $6 expenses. I really was offered a second genie. Just not for free. And I thought I read
    here about others getting 2 recently.
  7. Sep 6, 2013 #7 of 47

    HoTat2 Hall Of Fame

    Nov 16, 2005
    Nope, only a select few have two Genies by special circumstances;

    Such as those who were part of the original field testing team for the HR44 and already had HR34s on their accounts.

    Besides, its my understanding two Genies do not fully work together yet, and that's one of the reasons its not being allowed by DIRECTV at this time.
  8. Sep 6, 2013 #8 of 47

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset

    Jun 14, 2003
    Salem, OR
    This is arguably a question that has risen to sticky status.
  9. Sep 6, 2013 #9 of 47

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset

    Jun 14, 2003
    Salem, OR
    Perhaps they're trying to figure out how to schedule recordings from one Genie to the other; something they haven't allowed with other DVRs either.

    I'm sure they'd rather not face 10 tuners on a regular basis either.
  10. kikkenit2

    kikkenit2 Icon

    Oct 25, 2006
    Two genies will not work on 1 feed. That makes 10. But why wouldn't 1 on each feed work?
    And no way am I going below 18 recordable tuners in this big house. I had 14 in a 1 bedroom
    apartment. I am willing to trade the broken HR20 for a second genie and go to 22 tuners max.

    Just trying to help the installer get it right next visit. If my install was near typical I wouldn't
    have started a new thread. I am pushing the limit for sure. If they do it the way I want they
    never have to mess with the install as I add roommates/boxes. Seven HR24's and 1 genie
    is fine. The HR20's are worn out and very noisy. Also slow to boot and small storage. Now I
    want them to break. Thanks again.
  11. carl6

    carl6 Moderator Staff Member DBSTalk Club

    Nov 15, 2005
    Seattle, WA
    The issue with two Genies is not related to the number of tuners or multiswitch needed. There are technical reasons, one of which has to do with clients working properly with the Genies when there is more than one Genie. As to the total number of tuners, there is really no limit. In fact, there is another thread right now about a residential account with over 50 tuners. There are however limits on how many receivers/DVRs can be on a given whole-home system. You may need to be set up with two (or more) separate whole-home networks, such that none of the units will be able to see all of the other units on your account, just the other units on that specific DECA cloud. Once you get to accounts like yours with a lot of receivers, it does take a more experienced installer.
  12. kikkenit2

    kikkenit2 Icon

    Oct 25, 2006
    Thanks Carl. I am more concerned about the 32 tuner install and hiding most of
    the exterior cable runs than operating multiple genies. The multiswitch requires
    power so that limits where it can be located.

    The deca's go for $50 at solid signal. I have 4 of them sitting here. I already
    disconnected them. Sharing a playlist is not worth the trouble for me. Glad I
    tried it though. Putting 6 dvr's near my home theater receiver makes switching
    between boxes simple. I have 8 of the RC64RB NFL remotes and use rf on all
    the units. The HR24 is acting funny with rf though.

    I am hoping trading 4 deca's and 3 HR20's for 1 genie will fly. Otherwise a bank
    of HR24's is fine. Just no HR22's please. Whole home is $3 a month. Trivial.
    I'll check out the 50 tuner thread.
  13. inkahauts

    inkahauts Well-Known Member

    Nov 13, 2006
    that is not it at all.
  14. slice1900

    slice1900 Well-Known Member

    Feb 14, 2013
    There's no reason you can't split the feed at your dish and do some wiring under your crawl space to devote an entire SWM-16's worth of tuners to your living room. But it likely isn't something a typical installer who shows up when you call Directv is going to know how to do, or be willing to do without extra payment. You'd probably be better off calling some place that specializes in custom installs and paying them an hourly rate to do it - I'd buy the second SWM16 up front off Ebay, if you have them supply it undoubtedly it will cost far more.

    As for the second Genie, given that everyone says it can't be done, it isn't doesn't sound like it is even worth wasting your time on.
  15. inkahauts

    inkahauts Well-Known Member

    Nov 13, 2006
    Well, if you have all hr24s you don't need decas really.

    If you disconnected the decas from the hr20's and have the genie plugged into Ethernet, you are hurting your hr20s.. Could even be part of your issue with lock ups right now.

    Again, how many tvs do you have in your house and in each room? shared playlists are extremely easy to deal with, what was it that didn't work right?

    As I said before, Id definetly put the two swims next to each other and power supplys in there as well, and then work from there. A full description of your system would help everyone give you some ideas on the easiest way to wire it all up.
  16. sigma1914

    sigma1914 Well-Known Member DBSTalk Club

    Sep 5, 2006
    Allen, TX
    What are you recording where you need 14-22 tuners? I don't work (disabled) and neither does my mom (retired), and we barely use the 8 we have.
  17. trh

    trh This Space for Sale

    Nov 2, 2007
    NE FL
    He said he needs 14-15 tuners at his main viewing room for football.

    Personally, I would spread the tuners around, add MRV and then control the recordings through my iPad. But that's just me.
  18. kikkenit2

    kikkenit2 Icon

    Oct 25, 2006
    The HR20's were tested one at a time with nothing else attached (including the genie).
    I don't connect anything to the internet. Except my computer and S4 smartphone.
    Only have one HR24 right now. That was traded for a broken HR20 3 weeks ago.
    I used 7 hr20's only for several years. This spring they gave me ownership of all 7
    so I wouldn't have to keep them all activated to prevent losing recorded shows on 28
    external drives! Now they want the access cards back if I deactivate them? Thanks directv.
    They were all built 2006/07 and are worn out. The more new boxes I can get the better.

    I do watch a lot of tv. Duh. And I am partially disabled. Take morphine for lower spine damage.
    Worked as a survey party chief (licensed land surveyor) for 35 years. Retired on California
    state pension at 53. Now at 57 I still ride motorcycles when the weather is nice.

    I watch sports, sports and more sports. Like music too. Study using (not installing) directv
    and home theater (avsforum.com) a lot. Have lots of a/v receivers(4), subwoofers(3), amps(3),
    and about 40 bookshelf speakers. Zero tower speakers.And lease/own 8 dvr's.

    The dish is mounted all the way across the house from the living room. There is a bedroom behind
    tv location. I could punch a hole through the wall and have 32 tuners right there after they add
    the other multiswitch. Don't really want/need that though. The existing 16 swim is in a panel in
    the garage. Shorter run from dish to living room. Crawl space is about 4' deep because it gets
    cold here. There is an access door in closet floor at each end of building.

    It would be easier to just staple the coaxial cables along outside of house, but still tricky
    going through outside wall. Crawl space has a screened vent every 25' or so. No existing easy
    opening from crawl space near tv location. I only have 1 tv and 1 27' computer monitor with hdmi
    input, but plan on adding/moving TV's to all the other locations at some point.

    The way the house is wired right now there is only 8 tuners available in the living room now with
    only 8 tuners available for the 7 other coaxial locations. I'm paying for 19 recordable tuners now.
    With the genie I can only connect 15 tuners and only 7 or 8 at any one spot. No good.

    The internet (CenturyLink cable) router is not connected where the network cables all nest. Only the 2
    four way splitters reside there. I use mostly wifi for internet and don't connect it to directv. I have
    no landline phone service. Only Verizon wireless cell phone. Mortgage and utilities $2k per month.

    I record every nfl game and watch most games several months later. Directv doesn't show the year of
    the recordings, only month and day. Watch a lot of car/mc racing also, but hate nascar. There are
    3 games on pac 12 network tomorrow I would record if I had that channel. Never leaving directv until
    I die so give me the newest equipment and clean install. I bet I could run 4 genie's at once here.
  19. inkahauts

    inkahauts Well-Known Member

    Nov 13, 2006
    This us a better way IMHO than putting so many ion one place, just due to heat alone, not to mention easier setup and duplication should one fail.
  20. inkahauts

    inkahauts Well-Known Member

    Nov 13, 2006
    Here is what i would set up personally...

    dish > splitters in the room where you have the swim16 now. sounds easy to work in that room.

    Splitter outputs 1 to swim16 #1. Splitter output 2 to swim 16 #2

    SWIM 1 OUT 1 >>>splitter to Main room and one other room ... genie in main room and one hr24 in the other.
    SWIM 1 OUT 2 >>>splitter to two rooms, one dvrs in each.
    SWIM 2 OUT 1 >>>splitter to two rooms, one dvrs in each
    SWIM 2 OUT 2 >>>splitter to two rooms one dvrs in each.

    Should make the wiring of the coax much easier, nothing would need to be moved. Then just turn on and use MRV. Connect to the network too so as one said, you can easily schedule remotely. Heck, with as much as you have, I might actually add a H25 to the main living room and then you can use that to go through the guide and schedule recordings to other receivers without having to use an ipad or web interface.
    1 person likes this.

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