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FEATURE REQUEST: OTA Guide Suggestion

Discussion in 'Other HD Receiver Support Forum (811, 921, 942)' started by rbyers, Jul 15, 2004.

  1. rbyers

    rbyers Godfather

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    Jan 14, 2004
    I can see the problems associated with a full-up channel guide for the OTA channels. So, I'd like to offer a suggestion which should be easy to implement.

    Let us users map the local channels to the OTA channels. That would work for MOST of the channels that MOST of us care about. This feature could be added to the Local Channels screen.

    Here's how that would work. Channel 8000 (ABC) in Los Angeles would map to Channel 53 (which is in turn remapped to 7-1) . I can't remember a time when digital 7-1 wasn't the same as 7 analog. And for the few times that it is different. Well, this is a temporary fix. After all, when I want to know what's going to be on 7-1, I look at 8000 in the guide.

    This scheme doesn't handle the other subchannels.. I haven't any idea as to where to get the guide info for 7-2 (and I don't really care).
     
  2. jsanders

    jsanders Hall Of Fame

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    Jan 21, 2004
    Good suggestion. They are supposed to have real OTA guide data out at the end of last month, however, at this point, I will take what I can get....
     
  3. guruka

    guruka Troublemaker/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    Dec 27, 2003
    Okay, but that's a kludge and we don't need more of those. Subchannels may be time-shifted and PBS-HD, for example, carries different programming than PBS SD. I can look at the locals now in the EPG. I'd rather wait for the OTA guide to be implemented correctly.

    .....G
     
  4. rbyers

    rbyers Godfather

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    Jan 14, 2004
    Me too, but it seems to me that it might be a long wait. I've been watching the progress towards a fully functioning environment, which seems to be two steps forward, 1 step back. Here we are, more than 6 months after the initial release, and the OTA tuner basic operations are not fully implemented and robust. Not only that, but my impression is that the OTA tuner operations and requirements are not well understood by the programming team. It they were, we wouldn't be having the kind of problems we are having. After all, this is the ONLY OTA tuner in the world that doesn't work. My best guess, at the current rate of progress, is we're looking at a minimum of 6 more months to a year before we have a system with the robustness of a 501.
     
  5. DonLandis

    DonLandis Hall Of Fame

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    Dec 17, 2003
    rbyers-

    While your solution may work partially for your little broadcast community, we need something that will work nationwide!

    There is only one way to achieve that. A system must be declared standard and then it must be regulated by the FCC. Until that happens, almost or just close only works in Horse shoes and hand grenades. For guide info, if it isn't a standard, we will have every station doing what they please and not worrying if the equipment even works right. One of the biggest mistakes that was implemented with the last years of the Bush admin and fully implemented in the Clinton admin was deregulation of Broadcasters. Until we return to regulating this stuff, I'm afraid guide info will be a hit or mis proposition. It further amazes me that so few of you all realize this and continue to dream that what works in your little world, should work everywhere.
    Sometimes deregulation is a good thing, sometimes it is a mess.

    Simply put, if a station were required to publish accurate schedules for PSIP as regulated and would be fined for violations, you can bet that many of these problems would simply disappear. I talk to a BE about it and I get a blank stare back and told, "Don't you realize that we don't even have to do it their way?"
    In addition, if the FCC won't do anything then the CEA needs to step in and make setting standards a real cooperative priority.
    Can you imagine back about year 2000-2001 when we might have had two modulation standards in local broadcast? Finally the FCC set a standard and it is regulated, COFDM is out and 8VSB is in. Right or wrong, it was a good decision to settle on one standard and work that to the best we can. We need to do the same with guide info.


    "After all, this is the ONLY OTA tuner in the world that doesn't work."
    I know you were joking, right? The main complaints about the 6000 with 8VSB module was the problems with that tuner not working right.
    I just installed the almighty HDTIVO and on a scale of 1-10 the HDTIVO gets a 2 and the 921 an 8 for OTA performance quality. I can't get 80% of the channels that the same antenna gets on the 921 and the VOOM. Yeah it has information in the guide. But, upon checking, much of the non-prime time guide info is pure fiction, totally inaccurate and completely impossible to set an NBR based on it. Funny how you don't read too much about problems with the HDTIVO unless it is a sanctioned bug. Their poor OTA tuner quality is a sequestered subject matter but I am learning that a few non- brainwashed TIVO owners are willing to discuss it.

    Bottom line, ALL these OTA tuners are problematic in some way. Whether it be stability, PQ, signal lock or get screwed up due to PSIP flaws, none of them are perfect everywhere.
     
  6. jsanders

    jsanders Hall Of Fame

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    Jan 21, 2004
    I had the HR10-250 as well, and I returned it w/o even installing it actually, but for other reasons. It isn't as great as they advertise, but it may be perfect for some users. I'm just not one of them!

    I'm very surprised to hear you say that the non-prime time guide info is not accurate. I would expect accuracy.

    So, here I have a question. For those of you that subscribe to local channels with Dish, is the non-prime time guide info accurate with the satellite locals, or satellite distant locals? I'm just curious how reliable it would be....
     
  7. Mike D-CO5

    Mike D-CO5 Hall Of Fame

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    Mar 11, 2003
    The guide info for the locals and distants on Dish is accurate on either daytime or primetime . I have had both locals and distant locals over the last 4 years. With the 921 I do manual timers and the locals with Dish are what I go by for network information. For local information I use the TV Guide.
     
  8. DonLandis

    DonLandis Hall Of Fame

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    Dec 17, 2003
    TVGuide is great for analog station programming content. Due to the fact that many stations around the nation do not consider their Digital signals, prime will often run alternative un announced program content on the digital channel. A good example is what happens here on PBS. Analog Charlie Rose is broadcast and listed in the guides. On the Digital channel- 1080i -1 is a cartoon in HDTV. -2 is an announcement that the channels is off for the 1080i bandwidth. on -3 the program is a rerun of local school board meeting. On channel -4 is a series of still graphics to donate to the station. Look to VOOM for channel guide info and the listing has 4 TV programs listed, none of which are on at the time. Look at DirecTV listing. Two match the Voom and the other is the same as the analog channel Charlie Rose which is the PBS network feed. Admittendly this was an example in the extreme but I have found other channel guide inaccuracies mostly around the noon hour, 5-7 PM and 10 to midnight. Late night is easy because many of the guides say "Paid Programming" anyway because FCC allows that to be a legal log entry.
    I can't set a TIVO NBR timer to hunt my own TV shows because while I have over a hundred shows airing around the nation weekly, they are all listed as "Paid Programming" even though I submit my air schedules monthly in advance.
    I submit that if anyone really believes their guide schedules are perfect then they just don't understand the whole issue and are looking at only a small portion of the problem that interests them. On the otherhand I am looking at the problem as it is, as it affects all viewers.
     

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