HBO Max - is it a mess?

Discussion in 'Internet Streaming Services' started by phrelin, May 28, 2020.

  1. techguy88

    techguy88 Well-Known Member

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    I'm actually interested in The Flight Attendant after watching Kaley Cuoco on The Big Bang Theory plus what they have shown of the show seems interesting. I'm actually looking forward to Raised by Wolves and Tokyo Vice. I like the international shows. I've been watching The Capture on Peacock so I will defiantly check out Frayed (mainly because of that tag line you mentioned made me laugh.)

    Also I have to watch Zach Snyder's Justice League when it comes out. I like DC and Marvel (although I will say Marvel films are much better.) One of my hobbies is watching different cuts of films so I want to see how different Zach Snyder's Justice League is different from the theatrical (aka the Whedon) cut.
     
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  2. inkahauts

    inkahauts Well-Known Member

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    I actually believe he probably doesn’t know anything about it. That’s really small fry by comparison to other things. He shouldn’t even have to be aware of the details of that.
     
  3. techguy88

    techguy88 Well-Known Member

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    It was an anti-trust hearing and Amazon was the only company there that has a streaming device platform with a majority share. Given how much both HBO Max and Peacock have been in the news for their lack of an Fire TV app, Bezos should have reviewed those negotiations and been prepared. Also Bezos didn't become the richest man on the planet without having some knowledge on how various aspects of his company negotiates.

    Bezos was involved in the negotiations to get the Prime Video app on Apple's iOS & Apple TV platforms in 2016. Prime Video & Fire TV devices are a big part of Amazon given the fact that Prime Video being included in Prime memberships is a key draw of a Prime subscription. So yeah Bezos knows something about the negotiations that his company is involved in.
     
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  4. glrush

    glrush Cool Member/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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  5. NashGuy

    NashGuy Well-Known Member

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    Here's an interview with the new head guy at WarnerMedia, Jason Kilar (formerly of Hulu).

    WarnerMedia’s Jason Kilar On New Structure, Layoffs & Future Of HBO Max, Theatrical Distribution & Linear TV – Deadline

    It sounds to me like the layoffs and changes are more about streamlining the company and orienting it more in a direct-to-consumer direction (mainly in support of HBO Max).

    Given the increased focus that Kilar wants to bring to HBO Max, I'd say it makes it even *less* likely that they will give in to Amazon and Roku's demands to allow their own apps (Prime Video and Roku Channel) to ingest the entire HBO Max catalog/service, leaving WarnerMedia playing the role of disintermediated wholesaler. That's exactly what HBO historically was, offering up content that others -- cable companies -- distributed, with those distributors owning the consumer relationship. Kilar very much understands the need for HBO Max to forge their own direct relationship with consumers, through their own UI and their own data-rich feedback channels. So I don't see him backing down in the fight with Amazon and Roku on that point. And my guess is that his long-term vision is that eventually *all* HBO viewing takes place inside the HBO Max app (just as *all* viewing of Netflix, Hulu and Prime Video takes place in their respective apps).

    Now, as far as tweaking the cut that Roku/Amazon gets of HBO Max subscription revenues, or sharing ad inventory on the future ad-supported version of HBO Max, yeah, he might be more willing to compromise there.
     
  6. harsh

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset DBSTalk Club

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    Warner Media is made up of Turner, HBO and Warner Bros.

    Turner's profits were down 12% year over year
    HBO's profits were down 5.2%
    Warner Bros. profits were down 3.9%

    All the while, Warner Media was somehow down 22.9%. I don't think we're getting the whole story but the result seems to be that heads are rolling.

    HBO's content acquisition costs went down but HBO Max is costing them a fortune as spending at HBO is up 32.5% (attributed to content acquisition for HBO Max) and their margin went from 33.4% last year to 6.9% this year. Subscriber count was up 4.91% year over year.
     
  7. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Are these the numbers you are attempting to quote?
    warnermedia-2Q20.png
     
  8. billsharpe

    billsharpe Hall Of Fame

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    That "Eliminations and others," whatever that means looks like the biggest contributor to the overall loss. I can understand why heads might roll.
     
  9. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Reading the full SEC filing helps explain what that category refers to. But the big thing I noticed was that harsh refers to "profits" and the numbers shown are "Revenues". The second part of that chart shows the cost of doing business that cuts in to those revenues. Revenues down 22.9% but profit was down 18.4%.
    warnermedia-2Q20costs.png
    Additional tables are provided that show Turner's profit was UP 34.9%, HBO's profit was down 81.6% and Warner Bro's profit was UP 39.5%.

    Here are the figures for HBO ... hopefully some of those programming costs cover future delivery.
    warnermedia-2Q20hbo.png
     
  10. AngryManMLS

    AngryManMLS Active Member

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    To be fair one could have expected HBO's profits to be down compared to 2019 given they don't quite have something in 2020 to equal what the final season of Game Of Thrones was bringing in.
     
  11. harsh

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset DBSTalk Club

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    Its not fair to the subscribers (or the shareholders) that they didn't have something brewing in the pipeline.
     
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  12. techguy88

    techguy88 Well-Known Member

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    I would say the HBO unit took the brunt of the hit for HBO Max. Next quarter will be interesting to see HBO Max activations of existing subscribers since the discontinuation of HBO Go and people on the Internet finding out the workaround to use any HBO Max subscription to use the vanilla HBO app on Fire TV & Roku devices. o_O
     
  13. AngryManMLS

    AngryManMLS Active Member

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    I agree to an extent. COVID-19 has basically shut down major productions but that doesn't mean HBO couldn't of had something ready given they have been preparing to launch HBO Max for YEARS. Bad planning on their part.
     
  14. harsh

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset DBSTalk Club

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    GoT was in the can 15 months ago. They had more than enough time to bring along another tentpole.

    I'm not sure why many think that HBO Max requires more production effort. They've effectively stopped production on the Cinemax Originals side and a good chunk of the costs involved in the HBO family of products was acquiring third-party content for HBO Max rather than producing their own.

    Adding bookkeeping and customer support systems is pretty much the difference between HBO Now+Go and HBO Max. While they clearly don't know what they're doing in either case, the costs are pretty well understood.
     
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  15. techguy88

    techguy88 Well-Known Member

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    Just realized AT&T reports full breakdowns of HBO & HBO Max on their own full quarterly earnings report (full Q2 report). Here is what the segment looks like from Q2 (April - June)

    8d297e50412c4d17f31067d1850c26d4.png

    The segment is defined as:
    So what they have done is moved anyone that has HBO with HBO Max included in their subscriptions to the HBO Max segment. "HBO" refers to those without HBO Max as part of their subscriptions (i.e. Amazon/Roku).

    So there are a total of 26.6 million HBO Max subscribers (wholesale + retail) but only 4.1 million have actually activated the service. I would expect the "activations" number to have a decent increase with the release of Q3 numbers on October 22 since HBO Go was discontinued on July 31. Since "Activation" count as anyone who signed into HBO Max once for wholesale customers this will include people who figured out the workaround to use the basic HBO app on Fire TV & Roku with their credentials since they have to technically "sign in" to HBO Max once.
     
  16. NashGuy

    NashGuy Well-Known Member

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    Just started watching Frayed (a Max Original import from UK+Australia) last night. Pretty good first ep!
     
  17. techguy88

    techguy88 Well-Known Member

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    If you get a craving for another show from Australia, Peacock has Five Bedrooms (a Peacock Original import from Australia's Network 10.)

    I will check out Frayed however my new fav show is Raised by Wolves. :) The next "Max Original" I'm looking forward to is Zach Snyder's Justice League. :cool:

    Something tells me HBO Max will see a spike in subs & activations from all those fans that gang-tweeted this 4-hour thing into existence.
     
  18. NashGuy

    NashGuy Well-Known Member

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    I haven't watched Raised by Wolves, as I'm not typically into sci-fi, but I'm intrigued by what I've read about it. It's getting a fair amount of positive buzz.

    At some point, there will be one or more breakout hits in the Max Originals lineup (as Hulu experienced with The Handmaid's Tale, for instance) and that will drive a lot more existing HBO subs to actually use the HBO Max app. And becoming the home for all that DC content, such as the Snyder Cut and those DC Universe original series, will do a lot to attract younger/non-HBO folks.
     
  19. b4pjoe

    b4pjoe New Member

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    Any one looking for a 12 month deal for HBO Max they are currently running a special for $11.99 per month for 12 months.

    Promo code: SAVEFOR12
     
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  20. harsh

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset DBSTalk Club

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    The offer expires 9/25/2020.
     

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