HR24- Losing Audio on SD programs when switching tuners

Discussion in 'DIRECTV HD DVR/Receiver Discussion' started by drwdbs, Nov 29, 2011.

  1. drwdbs

    drwdbs Cool Member

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    Sep 14, 2010
    Apologies for the new post- I know that this subject has been discussed in a previous topic, but I could ‎not find it when searching.‎

    I have an HR24 connected to a Denon Receiver via HDMI.‎

    I have been having the following issue- losing audio on some SD channels when switching back on ‎forth on tuners. It took me awhile but I have pinpointed the problem and can now duplicate it ‎anytime.‎

    I have found that if I am watching TV LAND on tuner 1 and am NOT live (I have paused the live tv), ‎THEN switch to tuner 2. ‎

    When I switch back to tuner 1 to watch TV LAND (channel 304)- if I am not live, the audio is gone- it ‎happens every single time.‎

    This also happens on QVC (channel 275/317)- I am not sure if it just these two channels or if it is any SD ‎channel/program- so far this has not ever happened to me with an HD program.‎

    There is no way to get the audio back except to change the channel, clearing the buffer, then changing ‎back to it. (I’ve tried everything- turning the receiver off, the tv, etc, etc)‎

    It also does not happen if you are live on TV land or QVC- if you are live, you can switch back and forth ‎between tuners with no loss of audio.‎


    Anyone know what is going on here?? I know it is not just me, because somewhere on this forum, ‎others were having the same problem (I just can’t find those posts)….‎
     
  2. Dec 2, 2011 #2 of 48
    TomCat

    TomCat Broadcast Engineer

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    IIRC, incompatibility with HDMI is a known issue with Denons. I think the fix is to upgrade the HDMI firmware on your AVR. Search for your receiver on AVSForums and you can probably get the path to that fix.
     
  3. Dec 2, 2011 #3 of 48
    CCarncross

    CCarncross Hall Of Fame

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    Jackson
    Well I've had 3 different Denon's since the advent of HDMI, and have not had that issue on any of them. Do you have a source for the known issue or just circumstantial based on posts here.
     
  4. Dec 2, 2011 #4 of 48
    allenn

    allenn Icon

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    I am having audio drops too on an HR22-100 when switching tuners or switching from live to a recording video. I am connected to a Denon AVR via coax digital cable. I think this is a D* problem. This sounds like the other thread concerning an HR20.
     
  5. Dec 2, 2011 #5 of 48
    TomCat

    TomCat Broadcast Engineer

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    Well, I've owned three Chevy's so I must know more about them than you do. Sound a little ridiculous? You have your anecdotal information, and I have mine. Neither cancels out the other, but three "I don't never see no problem" 's aren't worth a zillionth of a single "here's what I think it might be and why", so the score as it stands so far is me a zillion and you zero.

    Why would you even need to know? If you want the answer, go to AVS and you shall have it, just as I posted earlier. I am not going to knock the chip off your shoulder for you, sport. It's not always about you, and this time it's about an issue the OP was having, which he solicited advice regarding. Not about you or your scary Denon.

    It sounds like you take offense that someone might impune your precious AVR's reputation, which would be a ridiculous observation and could not be further from the truth. If you instead try to think this through, you'll see that I was trying to help, regardless of whether there is a known issue or it is just a known rumor, or neither or both, and whether it is one or the other doesn't really matter. Who cares? I certainly didn't make it up for sport or pull it out of my, err, ear just to screw with you.

    It was only a suggestion based on a nugget of information that the OP solicited and might not have had, and that a wise OP might choose to take under advisement, and nothing more. Let's just say it was not a wild goose chase I was leading him on, but something I would want to be able to investigate if the tables were turned. It might even be the key to his issue.

    IOW, it was a short conversation between two people, neither of which was you. If you want to respond, respond to the OP's question and try to contribute something of value rather than wasting the rest of us's time moaning about the validity of other information which you have no clue about.



    When cousins marry....

    And by the way, a good AVR lasts for decades. If an AVR is that good, you don't go through three of them in a few years.

    Talk to the hand; I'm out.
     
  6. Dec 2, 2011 #6 of 48
    CCarncross

    CCarncross Hall Of Fame

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    Jackson
    I was interested to read about it because I have not experienced it with any of my Denons. I get the occasion audio dropout like we all occasionally do, but I don't ever lose the sound switching from HD to SD etc...If you choose to read that as I'm being difficult, so be it. Rudeness is not called for.
     
  7. Dec 2, 2011 #7 of 48
    drwdbs

    drwdbs Cool Member

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    Can someone who has an HR24-500 (and especially if you are using a receiver) do the following test to see if you get the same problem I am getting with dropped audio?

    This is what causes the problem for me:

    1) Have doubleplay active
    2) Tune to TVLAND (304)
    3) Switch the other tuner to ESPN (or any other HD channel)
    4) Switch back to the other tuner (TVLAND) and rewind till you are at the end of the buffer
    5) Switch back to ESPN
    6) Switch back to TVLAND- (so that you are watching tvland but are not live).

    For me, this is when I lose audio- it happens every single time, and the only way to get the audio back is to change the channel on that tuner, then switch it back.....

    I just don't know if this is a Directv issue or it has something to do with my HDMI/Receiver.

    I have an HR24-100 in my bedroom that is not connected to a receiver, and I do not have the problem there.....
     
  8. Dec 3, 2011 #8 of 48
    CCarncross

    CCarncross Hall Of Fame

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    Jackson
    I tried to repeat your findings...

    double play with one tuner on tvland, other on FXHD, switched back to tv land, rewound to beginning of buffer, it started to play automatically when it reached the beginning of the buffer, sound was fine.

    I tried to recreate on both my HR22-100, and my HR20-700 both connected via HDMI through my Denon 2809CI to my Sony KDS60-A3000. I couldnt reproduce it, but will try a few more times. It could be a problem with HR24's only, but since I dont have one yet, I cant try to reproduce.

    What Denon AVR models do you have that you are seeing this on?

    @TomCat:

    My 1st HDMI equipped Denon was very basic, so a year or 2 later I upgraded to a much fuller featured model, then I outgrew that one when I kept adding more HDMI equipped devices, so I bought a 3rd with obviously more features and more HDMI inputs. You are right, a good AVR will last for years and years, but since the advent of HDMI, all the BD audio formats, and many other newer features and conveniences, a 10 or 20 year old AVR doesnt work for that. I still have my nearly 20 year old Yamaha RX-V2090 in another room, but it doesnt even do DD or DTS, let alone any BD audio formats, plus it didnt have proper external inputs for my multi-channel hi-res music collection either. I listen to a lot of multichannel DVD-A, and SACD titles as well.
     
  9. Dec 3, 2011 #9 of 48
    drwdbs

    drwdbs Cool Member

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    I have a Denon AVR 591 Receiver and an HR24-500. The reason I think it is a Directv issue is I could have sworn I saw someone else post about the exact same issue somewhere else on this forum, but I can't find it for the life of me..... Audio is lost ONLY on SD programming.
     
  10. Zodad

    Zodad New Member

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    With some of the other model receivers, upgrading Denon firmware was an appropriate solution. However, with respect to the HR24, the issue appears to be with the unit itself. Across the web and various forums, there are multiple reports of HDMI audio issues with the HR24's. I have a number of HDMI audio problems with my HR24-500, and the only robust solution to restore my audio via HDMI is to reboot the HR24. I've tried Denon, Sony, Integra, and Pioneer receivers and always have the same issue with the HR24. Unfortunately DTV has nothing "newer" to replace the HR24 yet, and I'm not willing to go backwards to a slower receiver, so I have learned to deal with it.

    I know the most typical response is going to be upgrade another device, turn off Dolby Digital on the receiver, etc., but the reality is that the HR24-500 does have an HDMI audio issue for which there is no real solution at this time.
     
  11. CCarncross

    CCarncross Hall Of Fame

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    Jackson
    I think Zodad's got the right idea, I don't think its the Denon's at all, but the HR24 is a more likely suspect. There were firmware upgrades for older model Denon's but I dont think it applies to the newer models
     
  12. drwdbs

    drwdbs Cool Member

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    Sep 14, 2010
    I agree- that is pretty much what I am doing- just living with it- at least for me the only time I have an issue is on certain SD channels, so it isn't an issue very often- it never happens on HD programming.

    The only thing that makes me wonder about the source of the problem is the fact that I do NOT have this issue on my HR24-100 in my bedroom (which uses HDMI but no receiver- it is hooked up directly to the TV).
     
  13. Zodad

    Zodad New Member

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    Not surprising actually - many manufacturers have gone through the growing pains of firmware updates to deal with devices that act as repeaters. The AVR is a repeater, whereas the display is just the sink, so there is a significant difference in communication between the two applications.

    I could probably list a number of devices that didn't work with repeaters until the manufacturer provided updated firmware to resolve the issue. No different with DirecTV minus the fact that they've never fixed their firmware on this unit.
     
  14. texasbrit

    texasbrit Well-Known Member

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    I don't have any problems with my Hr24-500s, one connected direct to a TV and another to a Sony A/V receiver.
    Your issue could be a problem with the HR24-500, or the A/V receiver, or both. We've seen these issues reported with other cable, FIOS and Dish receivers. Unfortunately it's really an HDMI spec/testing issue; HDMI has been plagued with the problems since it was designed. Different manufacturers (chip or receiver) interpret the spec differently and this sort of thing is the result. And yes,some Denon A/V receivers seem to suffer this problem more than most.
    Changing out EITHER the HR24 or the Denon would probably solve the problem, although nothing is certain where HDMI is concerned.
     
  15. Zodad

    Zodad New Member

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    Brit - what are the results your test from the original poster, and what specific Sony AVR are you using?
     
  16. JMII

    JMII Legend

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    Jan 19, 2008
    South Florida
    My Pioneer AVR has the same issue - loss of sound on SD channels when using HDMI input from HR24-500. I had the same problem with my old HR20-700s. Thankfully in the input settings I can tell the AVR to use optical for audio and HDMI for video while on the "TV" input. Shocked to see this bug is still around on the much newer units.
     
  17. Shades228

    Shades228 DaBears

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    I've had this issue with -500 and -200 both HR. It's a problem with the AVR switching from Dolby to Pro Logic. You can tell it's happened because it will go to Stereo. It's clearly a handshake issue and how the receiver attempts to change surround sound modes. I'd say it happens about once a month to me. Turning the AVR off and on will fix it or you can jump back to the other tuner and change the channel then swap back and it can kick back in.
     
  18. drwdbs

    drwdbs Cool Member

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    Sep 14, 2010
    For me, even turning the AVR off and back on does not fix it. Changing the channel, then switching it back does fix it, and I also have discovered that turning off Dolby on the HR24 also fixes it........... Very annoying
     
  19. JMII

    JMII Legend

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    South Florida
    Can use the optical for audio like I do? Since this seems to be an HDMI handshake issue the optical connection will avoid that mess.
     
  20. allenn

    allenn Icon

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    Nov 19, 2005
    Georgia
    I have an HR24-100 which replaced an HR22-100. It loses audio when switching from HD to SD i.e. STARZ HD to ENCR. The DVR is connected to a Denon AVR via a digital audio cable. This has been a problem since 0x04d1. Currently, I have 0x57b.
     

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