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HR34 & HR24 Different OTA Channel Lists?

Discussion in 'DIRECTV HD DVR/Receiver Discussion' started by denpri, Jan 13, 2012.

  1. denpri

    denpri AllStar

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    Aug 8, 2009
    Here's a real mystery - Installed a new HR34 (F/W 4C9; SD GUI) along with a AM21N OTA adapter. Selected St. Louis, MO/E. St. Louis, IL "market" and HR34 IDed most (but not all) OTA channels. Next, installed a AM21N on a previously activated HR24 (F/W 57B; HD GUI) and selected the same "market". HOWEVER, the HR24 IDed a completely DIFFERENT list of OTA channels. The HR24 list is valid for this "market" but it omits a couple of the low-power channels listed in the HR34 list and includes a valid sub-channel not contained in the HR34 list.

    Can anyone explain why two receivers would ID a completely different list of available OTA channels for a given market? Thanks!
     
  2. TheFigurehead

    TheFigurehead AllStar

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    Mar 28, 2009
  3. dettxw

    dettxw MRVing

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    IIRC the HR34/AM21 combo may do a channel scan where the H2x/AM21 combo certainly does not, guide data is used.
     
  4. denpri

    denpri AllStar

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    Aug 8, 2009
    Understand potential H2x "issue" but my issue involves a HR34 and HR24 (i.e., both DVR/AM21N combos).
     
  5. Shades228

    Shades228 DaBears

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    He answered your question. There wasn't a H2X "issue".

    The HR34 doesn't use a set list of OTA channels at this time. The H/HR2X series do.
     
  6. denpri

    denpri AllStar

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    Aug 8, 2009
    Wow. I've got the "reverse" issue! My HR34 shows 5 more OTA channels & subs than the HR24 list while the HR24 lists one sub not included in the HR34 list. I wonder if the OTA guide data contains a "sub-code" for the Receiver ID. If not, I'm clueless like you are.

    Bottom line - I understand DirecTV's desire/need to NOT keep adding new channel and sub-channel Guide Data in the national feed for each "Market" but I'd like to have the AM21 "scan" just like a regular ATSC TV and "enable" available channels (& subs) and simply add a "local" Guide entry that lists Channel/Sub Number along with a standard message (contained in the Receiver F/W) such as "Local HD channel or sub-channel in your Market area". This approach would also faciltate eliminating "Market" channels that don't have adequate signal strength AT the customer's AM21/antenna location.
     
  7. denpri

    denpri AllStar

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    Aug 8, 2009
    OK. Just checked Guide Data for the "additional" HR34 locals & they all say "Regular Schedule" while the "mutual" HR34/HR24 listed channels contain program information. If I understand your comment, the HR34/AM21 combo DOES scan & list all available channels & subs at the customer location while the H/HR2X/AM21 combo simply uses the "canned" data in the national stream. This would explain the "added" HR34 entries AND the absence of two entries for an OTA that is probably not available at my particular antenna/location combintation although it DOES appear on the HR24.

    Thanks for the clarification!
     
  8. dettxw

    dettxw MRVing

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    Choctaw, OK
    Sorry, rushed a response from work.
    Meant HR2x.
    Hey, at least the HR34 scans at all, even though you have no control other than a custom channel list.
     
  9. denpri

    denpri AllStar

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    Aug 8, 2009
    I agree. Wonder if the H/HR2x F/W will ever be upgraded to "conform" to the HR34 method. I also agree it would be nice if a customer (or the F/W on a regular basis) could "rescan" and ID changes to sub-channels (and, in some cases, regular channels) without having to repeat the entire setup process. However, most customers probably don't need/want the AM21 & it's becoming a "niche" product. The only reason I added them is that I'll occasionally want to watch/record one of the sub-channels in my "market". Also, I notice the HR34 RVU functionality doesn't support OTA so I also have to wonder whether the AM21 will eventually disappear.
     
  10. tkrandall

    tkrandall Hall Of Fame

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    Does anyone know if DirecTV is considering adding HR34 style OTA scanning capability to the HR20 and HR21-HR24 models (hooked to an AM-21)?
     
  11. denpri

    denpri AllStar

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    Aug 8, 2009
    I have no idea but it would seem they need to adopt a consistent "philosophy" on OTAs and I'd hope the HR34 approach will eventually be used on all OTA-capable receivers. One possible issue might be a lack of "hardware" in the older generation receivers but I hope it's just a F/W issue.
     
  12. bobnielsen

    bobnielsen Éminence grise

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    Bainbridge...
    We've been asking for this ever since the HR20 (and later the AM21) came out so I doubt it will be added now (although I would still like to see it).
     
  13. dettxw

    dettxw MRVing

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    Choctaw, OK
    Curious that scanning capability showed up on the HR34 after being absent on the earlier models.
    I'm not sure if it's more likely that they'll remove scanning from the HR34 or add it to the other DVRs. I wouldn't bet either way.
     
  14. tkrandall

    tkrandall Hall Of Fame

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    But SOMETHING motivated DirecTV to go with a scanning approach with the HR34. I would like to hope it is a change in philosophy that they will make retroactive to the other units via firmware.
     
  15. TheFigurehead

    TheFigurehead AllStar

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    Does anyone know if I can force my HR34 to use the list of OTA channels from the Primary and Secondary Zip Codes? I am missing about 5 - 10 channels on the HR34... which show up on my HR24.
     
  16. dettxw

    dettxw MRVing

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    Excuse the stupid question, but does the HR24 tune the channels missing from the HR34 guide? Are these possibly weak or low power stations?
     
  17. TheFigurehead

    TheFigurehead AllStar

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    Yes, the HR24 tunes the stations. As an example, our local PBS station is channel 47. The HR24 tunes 47.1, 47.2 and 47.3 (as well as the DirecTV provided local on 47). The HR34 does not see 47.1, 47.2 or 47.3...

    I noticed on the HR24 some of the OTA stations signal varies depending on the time of day... some stations tune in at night better than daytime. But it would be really nice to just have the station guide info available on the HR34, too.

    I can try turning my antenna a bit and see if that makes any difference. Just takes a while to get through the initial Antenna Setup steps.
     
  18. tkrandall

    tkrandall Hall Of Fame

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    Does the HR34 allow for "manual" channel OTA setup (i.e. typing in a RF frequency to tune and if finds a channel, it remembers it, like most television can?)....or only automated scanning OTA setup?
     
  19. denpri

    denpri AllStar

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    Aug 8, 2009
    The problem with allowing a customer/owner of an OTA ATSC-enabled device (e.g., TV, AM21/N, etc.) to simply enter an "RF frequency" is WHAT frequency would they enter? In the "good old days" of OTA NTSC/analog television, the "channel number" was identical to the actual RF frequency. For example, OTA NTSC/analog "Channel 2" corresponded to an RF frequency of 54-60 MHz and there was a consistent, fixed correlation between an "advertised" Channel No. and RF frequency no matter where a particular station was located in the United States.

    With the advent & subsequent rollout of OTA ATSC/digital television, this "link" was broken! In the OTA ATSC/digital "world", Channel 2 could correspond to virtually ANY RF frequency in the current "universe" of OTA ATSC/digital broadcast frequencies. For example, in my location, St. Louis, MO, Channel 2 (KTVI) is now "physically" broadcast on RF channel 43 or 644-650 MHz. However, a "Channel 2" located in another metropolitan area could be "physically" broadcast on a completely different RF channel such as 39, 26, etc.

    In the OTA ATSC/digital "world", all of this physical-to-virtual "translation" is handled by the ATSC tuner AND accompanying device software. I believe the issue DirecTV must now face, in a post-transition world, is IF AND HOW it wants to handle OTA channels in terms of Guide Data AND overall OTA ATSC support. Don't forget - ALL TV sets sold (i.e., advertised as capable of OTA reception) in the United States must now support a OTA ATSC/digital "RF input" in addition to any other inputs (e.g., HDMI). Furthermore, DirecTV is also supporting a far larger "universe" of HD locals via their satellite system than they did 4-5 years ago when the digital transition started. IMHO, I wouldn't be surprised if the HR34/H25 models are the last products to support an OTA ATSC "interface".
     
  20. gcd0865

    gcd0865 Legend

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    Jul 23, 2008
    I'm also very interested in whether the HR34/AM21N combination will allow manual (real) channel entry and saving the resulting stations in memory. And if so, is programming data automatically added in for such station(s) afterwards, where the manually-added station(s) was/were not part of the AM21N's primary/secondary zip code entry method of memorizing stations?
     

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