1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Is it true DTV has more satellites than dish?

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by wegotdatwood, Jul 25, 2012.

  1. evan_s

    evan_s Hall Of Fame

    2,136
    0
    Mar 3, 2008
    Thanks. I was a bit off I guess =)
     
  2. HobbyTalk

    HobbyTalk Hall Of Fame

    1,685
    0
    Jul 14, 2007
    Generally those east of the Mississippi use 61.5, 72.7 and 77. Those west of the Mississippi use 110, 119, 129. All Dish national programming is available on each set of 3 sats. Where your LiLs are is what arc you would use.
     
  3. Diana C

    Diana C Hall Of Fame DBSTalk Club

    2,117
    293
    Mar 30, 2007
    New Jersey
    To the OP's point, I hesitate to say the installer was lying - let's just say he was misinformed.

    Because the DirecTV and Dish satellites are at different locations in the sky there will be locations that can receive service from one provider, but not from the other. In my case, I was a Dish customer for several years, mainly because when I originally switched from cable to satellite a tree across the road from my house blocked the DirecTV slot. Later, when DirecTV released the original TiVo DVRs in 2001, that tree had been knocked down in a storm and I was able to switch.
     
  4. harsh

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset

    21,192
    183
    Jun 14, 2003
    Salem, OR
    If the broadcasting isn't "in the public interest", it doesn't really matter.
    DIRECTV has at least two small complements of transponder capability (RB1 and RB2-A) that can't effectively be used to broadcast conventional programming and four transponders at 110W that they choose not to use for same. Transponders don't translate directly to channels you can watch and ultimately it is the variety of programming that counts, isn't it?

    Generally speaking, installers know how many slots they need to hit and not how many satellites, transponders or channels there are. Long-timers may know, but it certainly isn't a requirement.
     
  5. harsh

    harsh Beware the Attack Basset

    21,192
    183
    Jun 14, 2003
    Salem, OR
    While a pretty apt analogy, rows on an airplane might be better. With respect to HD programming, DIRECTV has six seats (channels) in each row (transponder) and DISH has 8 seats and 33-50% more rows.

    DIRECTV 12 has 24 transponders that each carry "up to" six HD channels while Ciel 2 (129W) has 32 transponders that each carry up to eight HD channels.
     
  6. Hoosier205

    Hoosier205 Active Member

    6,659
    14
    Sep 3, 2007
    The airplane also gives you an idea of how more cramped the Dish "seats" are.
     
  7. HoTat2

    HoTat2 Hall Of Fame

    7,316
    185
    Nov 16, 2005
    Los...
    To note:

    "RB-1" doesn't exist yet;

    But will be a full CONUS beam Reverse-DBS band payload carried aboard the future D14/RB-1 satellite at 99w scheduled for launch in late 2013 to early 2014. And it will carry conventional programming from 18 transponders.

    "RB-2A" is an R-DBS payload aboard D12 at 103w providing 18 transponders to 4 spotbeams for purposes unknown.

    The four areas covered by its spotbeams are maybe used as test markets for a final evaluation of nationwide R-DBS service perhaps?

    And there are three Ku transponders at 110w (28, 30, and 32) that are apparently preparing to relay HD programming to Puerto Rico.
     
  8. domingos35

    domingos35 Icon

    541
    1
    Jan 11, 2006
    doesn't matter. Dish's HD is still better
     
  9. Hoosier205

    Hoosier205 Active Member

    6,659
    14
    Sep 3, 2007
    If by better you actually mean worse...then yes! It isn't possible for Dish's HD to beat HD via DirecTV.
     
  10. P Smith

    P Smith Mr. FixAnything

    22,147
    192
    Jul 25, 2002
    W.Mdtrn Sea
    BOTH of you are WRONG for Ka tpn's bandwidth !

    See my posts in respond to VOS request in other thread.

    All the thread's buzz with sats/tpn/MHz/channel's count is coming to aggregate BITRATE if you want meaningful comparison.

    That would be real 'pipe' measure !
     
  11. HoTat2

    HoTat2 Hall Of Fame

    7,316
    185
    Nov 16, 2005
    Los...
    Well P. Smith, unless DIRECTV lied to the FCC in their LOA filings, those are the actual Ka transponder bandwidths I quoted. Though for the Spaceways 62.5 MHz only applies to the Ka-hi band in non-processor or "bent-pipe" mode.

    However, how efficiently that bandwidth is utilized to provide a given data throughput is another story of course. Beyond just bandwidth, Symbol Rate, FEC, modulation type and level, power output, etc. all play important roles in that area.
     
  12. Diana C

    Diana C Hall Of Fame DBSTalk Club

    2,117
    293
    Mar 30, 2007
    New Jersey
    USABLE bitrate is more relevant to the quality of service. But even there, I remember when Dish Network experimented with squeezing down FEC to squeeze one more channel per transponder (and these were SD channels on Ku transponders). It worked...until it rained. The smaller FEC resulted in rainfade starting in lighter precipitation and lasting longer. This was not an improvment in overall customer experience.

    So, there is no real "absolute" measure of comparison. If you could compare apples to apples, perhaps there would be. But Dish and DirecTV optimize their service differently - differently enough to make all comparisons relative (or at least approximations).
     
  13. ATARI

    ATARI Hall Of Fame

    1,876
    0
    May 10, 2007
    Having just switched to Dish, I can say that Dish HD PQ is almost as good as DTV. Overall. ESPN is the same. HBO is almost the same. Locals are not as good.

    However, Dish SD PQ is far superior to DTV.
     
  14. RAD

    RAD Well-Known Member

    16,476
    133
    Aug 5, 2002
    Dripping...
    Since ESPN HD is a 1280x720p signal I'd guess Dish doesn't need to downrez it like they do with 1080i channels.
     
  15. P Smith

    P Smith Mr. FixAnything

    22,147
    192
    Jul 25, 2002
    W.Mdtrn Sea
    Unless you did read that FCC docs or at least these quotas what I did in other thread answering to VOS an you (?).
    I have proof of the numbers on Spectrum Analyzer screen. Against insufficient quotas from FCC doc. Would you concur measured real time data ?
     
  16. P Smith

    P Smith Mr. FixAnything

    22,147
    192
    Jul 25, 2002
    W.Mdtrn Sea
    You are diverting the discussion into blurring "optimization" aspect. Before that we must settle major numbers. Comparable numbers.
    At least it would common ground to a comparison. As I mentioned everything above is not the numbers to final account; these are just initial parameters to start calculate the total bandwidth on each provider before compare.
     
  17. veryoldschool

    veryoldschool Lifetime Achiever Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

    42,684
    349
    Dec 9, 2006
    I always go with measured data.
     
  18. HoTat2

    HoTat2 Hall Of Fame

    7,316
    185
    Nov 16, 2005
    Los...
    But I don't see how the measured data rates and other parameters you list in that thread are at odds with the quoted bandwidths I listed.
     
  19. P Smith

    P Smith Mr. FixAnything

    22,147
    192
    Jul 25, 2002
    W.Mdtrn Sea
    36 MHz is real (and by FCC it's one of three values) for DTV's setting of SW-1 and SW-2, your [62.5 MHz] is pure FCC paper's possible value.

     
  20. HoTat2

    HoTat2 Hall Of Fame

    7,316
    185
    Nov 16, 2005
    Los...
    Well from the Narrative for SW1 and 2 (on p.15 of the SW2 narrative I'm quoting from at the moment):

    Also the document refers to three emission designators quoted as:

    pertaining to the up/downlinks of the two 165 MHz wide-band transponders the SWs use on Ka-lo Band for backhauling purposes.

    Are you sure you are not confusing those with the Ka-hi band used by subscribers?

    As quoted above only one bandwidth 62.5 MHz and designator 24M0G7W is listed for those available to customers.

    And I admit is a bit confusing since for a 62.5 MHz bandwidth only a 24 MHz wide transmission is stated as being supported by it? :confused:
     

Share This Page