Looks Like FoxNews' Turn (FOX News and FOX Business down 12/21/2014 and back 1/15/2015)

Discussion in 'General DISH™ Discussion' started by Nashcat, Dec 14, 2014.

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  1. Dec 21, 2014 #61 of 519
    Jim5506

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    Just tweeted FoxNews to stop jacking Dish subs around.

    We do not need to pay more for sports just to see their news programs.
     
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  2. Dec 21, 2014 #62 of 519
    Stewart Vernon

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    This too shall pass. At some point there will be a new contract, these channels will be back, your bill and my bill will increase as a result, and you'll ask "why did my bill go up" even as you demand "Dish better not lose my favorite channel"...
     
  3. Dec 21, 2014 #63 of 519
    tsmacro

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    Empowers Dish to do what exactly? Dish offered to keep Fox News and Business on the air while they continue to negotiate, Fox refused, so Dish no longer has permission to carry their signal, so exactly what should've Dish done about it? Eventually Dish will agree to pay more money it's just a matter of how much more and how long it'll take to get there. And when that deal is done Fox will move on to it's next provider to try to extort and tell Directv customers, Comcast customers, Time Warner customers or whoever is next to demand that they keep Fox News and pay their increased fee (of course they'll conveniently leave out the part about increasing your bill when urging you to switch providers to follow them) or else.
     
  4. Dec 21, 2014 #64 of 519
    Chihuahua

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    This could get very ugly.
     
  5. Dec 21, 2014 #65 of 519
    nmstough

    nmstough Cool Member

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    I don't see how to get this channel through their website. If you go to "watch TV" you get a page where you have to log into your provider and Dish isn't listed.

    This is terrible news. I just had Dish installed basically only because I wanted to watch Foxnews. OTA would have been sufficient otherwise. Indeed this is the most important of the premium channels. Why don't they simply charge a specific price for Foxnews and for a lot of other channels like CNN, etc. and let the viewer decide? My guess is that Foxnews will destroy the competition in that regard.
     
  6. Dec 21, 2014 #66 of 519
    Stewart Vernon

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    The news itself is available on the FOX News Web site... some video even... just the live streaming isn't available without the contract with Dish.

    Meanwhile... You ask why the channel isn't available on its own? And you say FOX would "destroy the competition"... well, FOX disagrees with you because they want to be in a tier guaranteed to be in a lot of Dish customers homes. FOX doesn't want to be an a la carte channel or they would be. IF FOX thought they could command a premium as a standalone option, you can bet they would do that and Dish would be happy to oblige them. But FOX, and CNN, and eventually MSNBC when that contract comes due, want to be in a tier... and they want to be paid more every time their contract is up for renewal.
     
  7. Dec 21, 2014 #67 of 519
    TechnoCat

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    I don't think so. Fox lied in that article. I'm guessing (no slur here) that you don't generally follow business releases closely. There are "tells" in there; follow the link and read it carefully, and you'll see. For example, the "five years" on contracts that are typically longer than that.

    But the main reason it won't get ugly is, viewers don't care. FNC is on the 3rd tier (of roughly 5) that Dish offers. It's not a 'basic' or near-basic channel. I neither have nor watch FNC, but have noticed that the world has two chunks of news-channel viewers: leftists who can't handle real science or debate, and therefore label everyone they disagree with a 'denier' or a noun-'ist', and the adults-in-the-room. The former watch MSNBC or CNN and are likely to view this as evil-vs-evil but with Dish being more evil for not appeasing the terrorism of Fox (not-withstanding the left's addiction to draconian sensitivity-speech laws - isn't that interesting?), while the latter - the FNC viewers (and a quick search suggests that's more people than MSNBC + CNN, but again, the left doesn't care about reality - people who believe the ratings would be "news deniers" I assume), are more likely to view the outage as symptomatic of hardball business, viewingCharlie Ergen vs Rupert Murdoch / News Corp as a good-guys vs evil overlords battle to keep prices down.

    So Dish can take the hit for a while; the viewers who care about Fox News are smarter than the average viewer and will stick with Dish for the larger reasons. Fox will have to back off, because Dish is a top-five affiliate. (That's media-speak for "provides subscribers" - Comcast is probably #1.) Losing Dish probably lops 10% off Fox affiliate revenues - and 10% is HUGE. You may think of it as the difference between a double- and a triple-shot mocha, but it's huge money in businesses with low margins and no flexibility. Meanwhile, losing Fox doesn't cost Dish anything initially, and over the long term may be a win as short-term subscriber losses are countered by long-term wins on their lower rates.

    As I said, I don't watch FNC, so I don't care. I do have Dish, but actually for entertainment. Funny thing; I never find that watching ANY news program leaves me relaxed. :smoking:
     
  8. Dec 21, 2014 #68 of 519
    TechnoCat

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    Stewart, to clarify... you changed your meaning mid-paragraph. I suspect Fox believes FNC would be an a la carte. It's their weaker channels (most of the rest, judging from the ratings) that they're trying to monetize by piggybacking on the demand for FNC. As I read it, the problem in this case wasn't FNC but the tethering of the costs into bundles.

    An example: FNC is a higher-level package; CNN and MSNBC are in the "mostly home shopping channels" levels, while FNC doesn't start until the middle tier.
     
  9. Dec 21, 2014 #69 of 519
    James Long

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    Do not forget the dispute a few years ago where Fox sued DISH over the placement of Fox News. The contract language was something along the lines of "our most popular programming package". Fox thought they were getting the lowest tier providing the most viewership. Fox wants Fox News Channel in as many homes as possible ... not only the homes that would willingly subscribe a la carte to buy FNC separate from other channels ... but homes that never watch FNC or never watch the news. That is the way channels make the more money ... by charging for subscribers who never watch.

    BTW: Fox News is in DISH's lowest tier (AT120):
    200 CNN
    202 Headline News
    205 Fox News Channel
    208 CNBC
    209 MSNBC
    210 CSPAN
    211 CSPAN 2

    AT200 adds 206 Fox Business Network and 215 Al Jazeera America. AT250 adds 212 TheBlaze.
     
  10. Dec 22, 2014 #70 of 519
    mwdxer

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    I am not a fan of Fox News, but I know some that are. Just like I missed TCM, but others didn't. Dish tries to carry an assortment of channels that will please most viewers out there. Even with the loss of a channel here and there for short periods, we still have a ton of programming in the packages. Often when we do lose a channel, then I may look at something else for that time. A friend who loved CNN for news, when it was missing he got to like MSNBC. Switching does not solve the issues, unless you want to constantly switch when a provider loses a channel. That would be too nerve racking for me. I am used to Dish. I do not want to start over with another provider. Plus there are no providers out there that carry several channels I get from Dish including the Super Stations. Also if I did switch, what would I do with all of the equipment I own? It is useless for anything else. Even the dishes are too small for FTA. These contract issues are generally always solved. There have been a few like Smithonian Channel. I did miss that, but I now get it on the Roku for free.
     
  11. Dec 22, 2014 #71 of 519
    inkahauts

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    I am going to assume you are being mostly sarcastic about all that..

    To think that fox is lying because he talked of five year contracts? He meant for the last five years when he has been doing contracts IMHO. And many are not to long like they used to be, the trend is to make them shorter and shorter really. And companies like fox are in negotiations a LOT with the same companies for different channels almost yearly it seems, which in part is why they are trying to get them all bundled together some.

    I think neither side has flat out lied, but twisted everything that is going on...

    When I read between the lines I see,,,,

    Fox is fine leaving the channels up while they continue to negotiate, but they are pushing to get the value they have wanted for ages for Fox Sports 1 and 2, and to get them to take tveverywhere for all services.

    Dish is as usual, cutting the channels so it doesn't have to pay for a little while to save a few bucks (pretty much close to new standard operating procedure for them except for anything that is really big) at the expense of the customer, but really doesn't want to pay more for the sports channels (I agree, wait till the contract is up) and wants OTT options that Fox doesn't want to give.
     
  12. Dec 22, 2014 #72 of 519
    tsmacro

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    Since Dish specifically said they offered to keep the channels on while they continued to negotiate and Fox refused it doesn't appear Fox thinks it's "fine" leaving the channels up. Two reasons probably, firstly if they keep them up during negotiation they keep getting paid at the old contract rate and they don't want to set that precedent, after all the whole point is to get more money not the same amount. Secondly I'm sure Fox knows that FN has the kind of fans of their channel that will call and complain and make noise so they have no problem withholding the rebroadcast rights for a while and let Dish have to deal with the annoyed FN fans and use that for leverage. Of course I do find it rather comical in the Fox press release that Fox's "proof" that Dish lied about Fox pulling the channels is that they got turned off at 11:50 rather than 11:59, yeah um ok sure, guess you got 'em, real smoking gun there. :sure: Ok let's get real here, I think we all know that it's Dish in it's uplink center that "throws the switch" that removes the programming from Dish's subscribers but that switch gets thrown because Fox refused to extend permission to broadcast their channels beyond the end of the contract while they negotiated.
     
  13. Dec 22, 2014 #73 of 519
    Jaspear

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    Not only noise, but money as well in the form of credits given to mollify the noisemakers. For some short period of time, yanking the channels is a win for Fox.
     
  14. Dec 22, 2014 #74 of 519
    tommiet

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    No biggie for me.... Bye...Bye Fox!
     
  15. Dec 22, 2014 #75 of 519
    TechnoCat

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    Those aren't their lowest tiers. They have "Welcome Pack", "Smart Pack" and "Dish America" below those. I have "Dish America", from a contract way back when.
     
  16. Dec 22, 2014 #76 of 519
    tampa8

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    I'd say those are considered the lowest tiers. Welcome pack and Smart pack are packages that do not allow the full array of DISH services. I don't believe Fox is in any of the Dish America packages.
     
  17. Dec 22, 2014 #77 of 519
    nmetro

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    The is a price point that the media giants are quickly approaching. As they keep raising prices fro OTA and cable channels, more and more subscribers are throwing their hands up in disgust. FOX wants more money for their cable, sports and FOX owned broadcasting properties. In addition to FOX News and FOX Business. National Geographic/National Geographic Wild have become glorified reality channels FX, FXX, are no different than any other cable channels; limited movies, eight hour programming blocks of reruns, and infomercials late at night. FOX Sports 1 & 2 are not as robust as their equivalents in the UK, Australia or New Zealand. Of all the FOX sports properties, FOX Soccer Plus offers the most varied in sports programming (Rugby, Soccer, and Australian Rules Football; most times live).

    So, if FOX wants more money, then offer more different kinds of sports, and provide the HD feed of FXM. And of course, provide more varied programming, than what is offered everywhere else. As for FOX News and Fox Business, I have alternatives fro both; just like I had alternatives for CNN. I watch news to get news, not someone's interpretation of the news. FOX News, MSNBC, and CNN all fail in that regard. Al Jazeera America and internet feeds of the BBC, CBC, and ABC (Australia) doe better coverage of the news (including this country), than the domestic "news" networks.
     
  18. Dec 22, 2014 #78 of 519
    mwdxer

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    One side note to this is for Fox to take away these channels just before Christmas is really tacky. They could have least waited until after the first of the year.
     
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  19. Dec 22, 2014 #79 of 519
    tsmacro

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    I wonder if any of the Fox News fans have stumbled across NewsMax on 223 yet? They'd probably find it more agreeable to their taste than CNN, MSNBC or Al-Jazera I'd imagine.
     
  20. Dec 22, 2014 #80 of 519
    BobCulp

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    Why can't any provider renew contracts three months before current contracts expire? Better yet, have all channels expire at the same time.
     
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