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Multiple Local Channel Markets

Discussion in 'General DISH™ Discussion' started by sikma, Dec 10, 2010.

  1. sikma

    sikma Godfather

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    Are there any areas of the country (particularly Wisconsin) that dish network provides two different sets of local channels because of one living on the edge of two different DMA's?
     
  2. garys

    garys Hall Of Fame

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    No.
     
  3. jscudder

    jscudder Legend

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    Yes, two that I know about:

    Windham County VT gets both Burlington VT and Boston MA locals.
    Bennington County VT gets both Burlington VT and Albany NY locals.

    John
     
  4. nmetro

    nmetro Godfather

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    I thought the area between Baltimore and Washington DC was another such market. and the same for people who live between Philadelphia Pa and New York City NY. And those who live between Providence RI and Boston MA.

    Of course an argument could be made for Fort Collins or Greeley CO ( Denver Locals) and and Cheyenne WY; they are less than 40 miles form each other. Same goes for Catsle Rock CO (Denver Locals) and Colorado Springs CO.

    That is the above falls under most viewed stations and these markets are so close to each other that their signals overlap. In in many cases, those who subscribe to cable in the area mentioned, usually get both markets.
     
  5. RasputinAXP

    RasputinAXP Kwisatz Haderach of Cordcuttery

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    In theory, Ocean and Mercer counties in New Jersey should get both. Their cable systems carry both as they lay in both DMAs for Philly and NYC.

    In practice, I have no idea.
     
  6. garys

    garys Hall Of Fame

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    Dish and cable companies do not have the same set of rules, My local cable co. had two sets of locals along with a pbs from another. Dish cannot offer the same thing.
     
  7. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    There are a couple of other places (one county in Oregon and one in Pennsylvania) where it appears DISH has locals from another market. I have not looked at addresses to see if people get both markets.

    The law allows for significantly viewed stations but they are rarely given. The only way to know for sure is to run an address through the DISH Network website.
     
  8. Wilf

    Wilf Legend

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    I wish that were so.
     
  9. RasputinAXP

    RasputinAXP Kwisatz Haderach of Cordcuttery

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    My in-laws' address in Ocean County is NYC only.
     
  10. shadough

    shadough Icon

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    where in oregon? i recently did some address checks in oregon on directvs site an found the entire state got portland locals unles you lived within another DMA like klamath falls. i thought it was odd giving the eastern state portland locals being some 3-400 miles away. epecially with Boisie closer.
     
  11. brant

    brant Icon

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    i had the same issue when I had satellite tv; local cable co's had two DMA's but I only received the tallahassee, fl channels from dish network.

    the only georgia station I could get was PBS, and I had to pay an extra monthly fee for it. This was during the digital transition and my local pbs' signal wasn't strong enough then to pick up OTA.
     
  12. SaltiDawg

    SaltiDawg Active Member

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    Nope. A few years ago Mr. Ergin on the Charlie Chat said that for the Washington DC DMA that Baltimore locals were "Significantly Viewed" locals and soon would be available for those of us in the Washington DMA.

    Never happened.

    I can receive the B-more locals OTA with a better signal than my DC stations.
     
  13. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Most of Oregon is covered by the Portland DMA (blame AC Nielson) but there are other DMAs in the state (Boise, Eugene, Medford, Bend, Spokane and Yakima). Malheur County is in the far south east of Oregon and is in the Boise Idaho DMA.

    There is uplink data showing five of the nine Portland stations on channels on channels 6265-6269 flagged as Boise, ID, market stations. I was thinking Malheur County, Oregon, got these stations - considering in state content to be important - but checking on DISH's website the county seat Vale, OR, gets only Boise stations. Perhaps a town closer to the Portland market gets both?
     
  14. shadough

    shadough Icon

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    I remember that Charlie chat very well. I had vision of B-more locals dancing in my head. Always been able to get them OTA, at least until the analogs were shut off. Now its a crap shoot......I may pick up 1 or 2.

    I also had visions of Richmond locals too, my 'other' house is in a rural area. The cable co. offers both DC an Richmond but ney off the bird.
     
  15. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Unfortunately cable's rules are very different from satellite's rules. Cable has a threshold for local channels depending on the size of the channel lineup. They have to set aside a certain percentage of their channels for locals. A small cable system can pick and choose locals to meet the threshold. None of the "carry one, carry all" required of satellite (and by carry I mean offer carriage - stations can refuse to have their signals carried). On the other hand cable is required to carry locals ... satellite is not (although once a satellite carrier carry one local in a particular market they must offer carriage to all). Cable generally picks from stations they can receive at the head end - where they pick up signals. The "significantly viewed" rules were introduced decades ago to allow stations to force their way on to cable systems by proving people in the area were watching their stations and cable should be carrying them.

    These rules have led to a coverage based system for cable. Generally cable carries what someone in the community could receive with an antenna and perhaps a few stations more. DMA lines are less relevant. Satellite has been forbidden from carrying out of market stations regardless of the coverage of the station. More details after the quote.

    A few years ago (Dec 2004) congress passed a law that allowed satellite carriers to carry significantly viewed stations. Unfortunately they tied carriage to the "distants" law and when DISH lost permission to carry distants they also lost permission to carry SV stations. The law was revised earlier this year to move significantly viewed to the "locals" part of the law (immediately restoring permission for DISH to carry stations) and further changes were made that allowed DISH to regain permission to carry distants after meeting certain standards (including offerin LIL in 100% of local markets).

    One problem with SV is it is based on the cable list. A list designed in the 70's for stations that were not carried on cable to gain carriage. If a station had cable carriage they didn't need to be on the list. If a station is not on the SV list they still can be carried on cable. Satellite can't carry a station not on the SV list (without going through the more strict distants laws).

    A second problem with SV is gaining permission of the in market station. The in market network station must give permission for a "competing" SV station to be carried. Cable requires no such permission.

    If I were king I'd level the playing field to a point where satellite could deliver any channel that claims coverage of the customer (based on their FCC predicted coverage maps) plus the rest of the DMA. We wouldn't have situations where neighbors separated by a county line would get entirely different market locals. But I'm not king, so we're stuck with the system we have.
     
  16. scooper

    scooper Hall Of Fame

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    Can we nominate you to at least replace Mr Genachowski ?
     
  17. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    That would be nice ... there are probably some things I disagree with that he's pushing that wouldn't get done if he was not pushing them. But this locals issue is one for Congress to fix. Genachowski's hands are tied by the law. All he could do, if he cared about leveling the playing field for satellite, is ask Congress to change the laws.
     
  18. Wilf

    Wilf Legend

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    But why on earth would you want to? The Baltimore ABC channel is very big on infomercials during the daytime. The NBC channel had "editorials" by the station manager. These are really hokey for a city of Baltimore's size.
     
  19. SaltiDawg

    SaltiDawg Active Member

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    To each his own, I suppose. In DC the local channels frequently preempt weekend daytime national programming in favor of local "stuff."

    The idea that you would not want a choice, if available, seems very strange. lol
     
  20. SaltiDawg

    SaltiDawg Active Member

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    And I'd vote for you based on this platform position.
     

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