Questions about Sats/Pointing/Signal Strength

Discussion in 'General DISH™ Discussion' started by 1611mac, Sep 26, 2017.

  1. 1611mac

    1611mac New Member

    8
    1
    Sep 26, 2017
    Hello. Due to a new roof I moved my dish from roof to a post on ground. I thought I'd try "pointing" the dish myself. I have the system working but the experience forces me to learn more....

    1. How do I know if I have a 300 or 500 "System" as the Point Dish Utility asks? I don't find this info anywhere.

    2. I assume there is more than one Sat you can point to? ("Satellite" selection on Point Dish utility)

    3. Is Sat selection based on best "line of site"?

    4. How does one determine the "Transponder" selection?

    5. Is a signal strength of 60 OK and is max signal determined by which sat you point to?

    Based on my zip code the Point Dish utility tells me to point to Azimuth 237, Elev 34. The roof install (done by Dish Tech 4 years ago) seemed to be pointing to Azimuth 152, 44 Elev. I believe this was done due to "line of sight" needs.

    I setup the moved dish by "tweaking by hand" pointing roughly the same as when on the roof. When I view Point Dish util it tells me "Wrong Sat - EchoStar 72.7 West"... But if I "Check Switch" it returns with a strength of 60 and "Locked - EchoStar 61.5 West." A line of sight check using dishpointer.com verifies that this is indeed roughly where it was set to previously.

    Comments please.....
     
  2. scooper

    scooper Hall Of Fame

    7,230
    195
    Apr 22, 2002
    Kansas City KS
    Location (zip code or city is close enough) and what locals do you get, also are you getting HD Locals ? Also need a picture of your dish / LNB.

    Azimuth 152 is indicative of an Eastern Arc install (61.5 and 72.7, opt 77)
    This means you CAN'T use the settings in the Dish receiver - what you see there is for 119/110 .

    Dishpointer.com will give you 3 different number assuming you have the 1000.4 Eastern arc dish ( has all 3 - 61.5, 72.7 and 77) a skew setting (which direction and how far off of vertical), Elevation, and azimuth.

    If you are having troubles pointing - it might be easier to call Dish and have them send a tech to get your Dish pointed correctly.
     
  3. 1611mac

    1611mac New Member

    8
    1
    Sep 26, 2017
    Hello, I'm close to you! - NE Raleigh NC
    On screen does show my local HD channels

    As for the 119/110 - Dish (obviously) knows my location so why in the world doesn't the point dish util know that and point me to correct sat?

    I don't want to pay $150 to have my dish pointed.

    I can supply pic of dish/LNB... may I ask why you need it? (for my learning)
     
  4. scooper

    scooper Hall Of Fame

    7,230
    195
    Apr 22, 2002
    Kansas City KS
    Ok -

    Raleigh is lucky that our HD locals are available on both Arcs - East (61.5, 72.7 and 77) and West (110 , 119, 129) - so techs can select which one has the better line of sight. If you have Dish 500 (like I started with back in Oct 2000), All you get is the SD versions. our Eastern HD locals are on 61.5 transponder 22, the SD versions are on 110 transponders 29 and 31 (for PBS), and HD locals on 129 (don't know which transponder, since I can't see 129 due to LOS issues as well).

    For my zipcode(27596) in Youngsville, dishpointer shows for 1000.4 (3 LNB) elevation 47.7, azimuth (true) 170.3, Azimuth Magnetic 179.7 , Dish Skew 82.2 .To convert the skew to the settings on the dish, use the formula answer = 90 - skew = 7.8 (8 degrees is close enough) - you can probably use the same setting , but once you set skew - DO NOT MOVE IT AGAIN. THis also assumes your pole in the ground is perfectly plumb (very important!!)

    getting azimuth and elevation for a 1000.2 eastern arc -
    61.5 - mag azimuth is 162, elevation is 44.5
    72.7 mag azimuth is 179.7 , elevation is 47.7
    as a SWAG - start with elevation 46, mag azimuth 171. in both cases, we're splitting the difference between the two . Mag Azimuth is what you use when you're pointing with a magnetic compass. I'd suggest covering the left LNB (from the back of the dish) with aluminum foil, then maximize the weakest non-zero non-spotbeam transponder on 61.5. For me - that is transponder 17. After this is dialed in, take off the foil, then do a check switch - it should find both 61.5 and 72.7 . signals on 72.7 will range for just below 50 to about 60 on all 32 transponders.


    I wanted the pic so I knew which LNB you have. From the point dish screen it should be able to tell you 1000.2 (2 LNBs for eastern arc ) or 1000.4 (3 LNBs Eastern arc) .

    If you can't tell - I've been doing this a LONG TIME and have picked up a few tricks along the way (the foil trick for one).

    Ask if you have any questions.
     
  5. RBA

    RBA Well-Known Member

    1,318
    110
    Apr 14, 2013
    TEXAS
    If it hasn't become clear you don't have either a dish 300 or a dish 500, they are old mostly discontinued dishes. As DISH has changed the product offered they have not upgraded the setup software on the receiver. Paper or electronic setup information is used instead of wasting memory space on the receivers.
     
  6. 1611mac

    1611mac New Member

    8
    1
    Sep 26, 2017
    OK... a very very basic question... I've read in many places the importance of a plumb pole. I have a treated 4x4 in cement. (I used a level when it set.) But I'm sure it and probably the mount is not perfect. What part of the mount actually needs to be "plumb?" I assume the critical vertical member of the mount is the round tube which the dish actually sit's and rotates on and it is this vertical round tube that needs to be "plumb."

    And, is a strength of 60 typical? As I opened with... everything is working fine. So I hesitate to mess with it to make it "better." :) But I am enjoying the learning!
     
  7. scooper

    scooper Hall Of Fame

    7,230
    195
    Apr 22, 2002
    Kansas City KS
    Correct, the "round part where the dish is mounted" is what needs to be perfectly plumb - the closer you are, the easier the pointing is (especially with the skew).

    Dish readings - when somebody tells me they have a signal of "60" - I tell them they haven't told me anything. it's ALL in context - need to know WHICH SLOT and WHICH TRANSPONDER to put anything on that at all. If you don't understand that - give me a table showing all satellites and all transponders on them and I can tell you if you have a "good install".
    The following table illustrates what I'm talking about - these readings were taken Sunday Sept 24 @0758 AM


    61.5 72.7 77
    1 50 56 78
    2 52 57 x
    3 63 55 x
    4 60 52 74
    5 53 59 76
    6 52 57 x
    7 51 54 x
    8 48 55 78
    9 53 57 76
    10 63 55 72
    11 55 51 74
    12 47 53 75
    13 52 57 x
    14 45 55 72
    15 45 53 .x
    16 48 53 74
    17 43 57 72
    18 0 55 x
    19 0 53 x
    20 55 52 72
    21 43 57 73
    22 57 spot 55 x
    23 43 spot 53 x
    24 45 spot 52 73
    25 39 spot 53 76
    26 33 spot 57 74
    27 0 51 x
    28 0 53 70
    29 0 60 78
    30 0 55 x
    31 0 56 x
    32 50 spot 54 78

    61.5, 72.7 and 77 are the slots
    1-32 on the left are the transponders
    first number is 61.5 for that transponder, "spot" means it is a spotbeam (used for locals). 2nd number is 72.7, 3rd number or "x" is 77 (I have a 1000.4 dish and LNB). X means that that transponder is skipped.

    I consider my dish to be well pointed - it takes some pretty bad thunderstorms to take my dish reception out.
     
  8. 1611mac

    1611mac New Member

    8
    1
    Sep 26, 2017
    What frustration these gigantic companies can be! I was referring to the signal strength bar graph on the Setup/Install/Point Dish screen. They tell you to "Enter your ZIP and select sat 110 or 119 and they return a signal strength. I'm learning that's all bogus....????

    If DISH is not going to keep the software/"Pointing screen"/utility current or even usable (and tell you how to use it) why do they even have it? Very frustrating!

    Are you taking your numbers off the Point Dish screen? Here is what I currently have. I assume the least bit of rain and I'll have no picture???

    On 77 I have all zero's on every transponder.
    On 72 I have all zero's on every transponder.
    On 61 I have
    08 - 45
    09 - 46
    10 - 61
    11 - 46
    12 - 45
    14 - 44
    15 - 30
    16 - 45
    17 - 40
    18 thru 32 - 0
     
  9. scooper

    scooper Hall Of Fame

    7,230
    195
    Apr 22, 2002
    Kansas City KS
    I'd say your dish is not pointed correctly OR it is not a multi slot dish (where's the pic of the DISH and LNB ? )

    As I said - YOU probably would be better off to call Dish to come and point your dish correctly.

    What frustration these gigantic companies can be! I was referring to the signal strength bar graph on the Setup/Install/Point Dish screen. They tell you to "Enter your ZIP and select sat 110 or 119 and they return a signal strength. I'm learning that's all bogus....????

    I knew exactly what you were talking about - I see that screen at least once a week. But you didn't have any context info. You must have it set as "Dish500". It's also why I suggested you pay to get the tech out to get it aimed -

    Back when I started with Dish - they had just started using 110 along with 119 - I had to get some techs out to get the dish aimed - and THEY didn't know how to get 110 and 119 on a single dish !!! I had to go back and correct it after they left - but at least I had a ballpark place to start at that point.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2017
  10. 1611mac

    1611mac New Member

    8
    1
    Sep 26, 2017
    yeah... I'll just call for a tech....
    Thanks for the education. I much appreciate it!
     
  11. 1611mac

    1611mac New Member

    8
    1
    Sep 26, 2017
    Oh.. here's a pic....

    [​IMG]
     
  12. scooper

    scooper Hall Of Fame

    7,230
    195
    Apr 22, 2002
    Kansas City KS
    Yes that's a 1000.2 Eastern Arc 2 LNB dish. See how it is leaning to right ? - that is the Skew setting. The plastic on the left is for 61.5, and the other is for 72.7
     
  13. RBA

    RBA Well-Known Member

    1,318
    110
    Apr 14, 2013
    TEXAS
    Before you go further with the install, you might want to consider replacing that 4x4 with a metal pipe. It won't happen overnight but the PLUMB wooden pole will move as it's moisture content changes. It might be 6 mo to a year but you will have to realign that dish.. Having a 2 LNB dish will give you a little more margin for error but wood will twist and lean over time.
     
  14. 1611mac

    1611mac New Member

    8
    1
    Sep 26, 2017
    Install is basically done for now. RE- 4x4 - I know... I had a 4x4 that has been sitting out in weather for over 3 years. I'm hoping that the warping and twisting has mostly occured and slowed enough to give me some time before I have to re-set with a proper pole. I was kind of thrown into this unexpectedly as my roofers changed schedule and the dish (on roof) had to be removed without much notice at all.
     
  15. satcrazy

    satcrazy Icon

    1,126
    36
    Mar 15, 2011
    Great...
    Throw this in for good measure:

    Had trouble for well over a year with signal [ and three tech visits who said that was the best they could get] UNTIL-finally tech guy # 4 [ a bit older , maybe more experienced?] Said I had good LOS, but upon close examination [ he ran his hands over the dish itself] found the dish had a bubble [ couldn't SEE it, but I felt it too] and as soon as he replaced the darn thing, I no longer lost signal for HOURS, sometimes most of the day, due to rain fade. All the years with satellite, never saw this coming. So If you or anyone has an unexplainable signal issue, remember this as a possibility. Tech said it isn't all that unusual. That surprised me.
     
  16. 1611mac

    1611mac New Member

    8
    1
    Sep 26, 2017
    Well, the techs should like me a lot more... moving the dish from roof to ground. Some techs refused to go up on roof. I can't blame them but if that is the case Dish never should have allowed to be mounted there.

    I had an initial problem of losing signal a LOT. (when I moved to this house 4 years ago) - Tech's could not figure out why. Then finally one looked at the install and said the connections where not done right and they were all full of moisture. Not sure what that meant but he ran all new cable in home and up to dish and I have had no signal issues since. In past 3.5 years signal has been rock solid but I've had to replace receivers 3 times. Last time a tech didn't even come out. They sent me a new receiver with card and programmed all ready with my info. Plug and play!
     
    crodrules likes this.
  17. scooper

    scooper Hall Of Fame

    7,230
    195
    Apr 22, 2002
    Kansas City KS
    Dish pointing done yet ?
     

Share This Page

spam firewall

Advertisements