Recent theft of Dish account information?

Discussion in 'General DISH™ Discussion' started by rasheed, Oct 20, 2007.

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  1. rasheed

    rasheed Godfather

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    I am feeling Dish is getting customer account data stolen either from an insider or other breech and other not so credible resellers are trying to lure customers.

    A copy of a message I just sent

    ----- Forwarded Message ----
    To: ceo@echostar.com
    Subject: Recent theft of Dish account information?


    Dear CEO office,
    Account phone number: xxx-xxx-xxxx

    I wanted to tell you about another reseller calling me as an existing customer and acting as they were officially calling from Dish. This reseller had the following information:

    -Which receivers I have (942 and 811)
    -What programming I have (including recent programming changes made in the past two months)
    -My address, home phone, alternate phone were read back to me.
    -How I paid a bill two months ago -- last four account digits (specific credit card type), but not how I paid my most recent bill (as I changed card choices)

    The offer they made was:
    -All same programming I currently had plus new Dish HD
    -$10 savings from current charges for entire 18 months ($70 per month total cost) (signal it was not Dish)
    -18 months commitment
    -722 and 211 receivers with no cost
    -Keep old receivers (another signal that it was not Dish as I currently have leased receivers)

    Finally, at the end they requested both a credit card number and social security number. And for the verification call, they were to request that I answer that I do not currently have Dish Network (to create a new account).

    I disconnected the call at this point as providing credit card info and social should not be required if it was from Dish directly. Frankly, I do not understand how this reseller would have access to so much account information. Either this information was given by Dish to the reseller OR it was a recent theft of information from Dish Network systems (since it contained recent account changes -- the download of data from Dish must have occurred in the past two months).

    Does Dish acknowledge these problems with account data being stolen? Frankly, while I was savvy enough to realize these 'fake' Dish calls, I am sure other customers would have taken the 'deal' (not sure if it would have changed in reality when their bill came).

    It would be better for Dish not to become the next TD Ameritrade, TJ MAXX, or other large company with such problems and acknowledge these issues and try harder to prevent either inside theft or other methods of people taking such large amounts of account data.

    While I would like such a good promotion to go from the MPEG2 to MPEG4 digital process, it does not seem Dish would be so generous for existing customers until MPEG2 is no longer available.
    Please help us in protecting the data.

    Thank you,
    Rasheed
     
  2. Richard King

    Richard King Hall Of Fame

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    Good, well stated letter. Keep us informed if you get a response (or if you don't get a response).
     
  3. jsk

    jsk Icon

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    Fallston, MD
    If you get paper statements, is it possible that someone "borrowed" your latest statement from your mailbox? That's why I'm glad that I don't have paper statements.

    At any rate, I'm curious to hear what E* does about this.
     
  4. rustamust

    rustamust AllStar

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    Feb 21, 2006
    Why do you think its a reseller and not just someone after your credit card and ssn numbers?? Could be just a new way to pry info from the public and nothing to do with dish except for stolen data.
     
  5. 585960

    585960 Legend

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    Feb 4, 2007
    It WAS a reseller, doing the slam dunk. All that would have happened was, a new account would be opened, a letter most likely would be added to the end number of your address, and as a new account, you would get new equipment, and promo prices. The resellers do this all day to get a commission on older accounts. When these come up in my routes, and I see existing equipment, I cancel them. Then do a dish it up.
     
  6. rasheed

    rasheed Godfather

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    Sep 12, 2005
    Dish has already replied to me (on a Saturday no less) and do take these matters seriously. Dish agrees that this is a reseller/sales partner, but (Dish and myself) don't know at this point who it might be.

    If anyone you know gets a call that smells like this, please ask them to stall or say they need to call the person right back to compete the offer and try to get a call back number and direct extension to the sales person or as much as possible. Should you get this information in the future, you can contact Dish with it as I did (and they can verify if it was Dish or a reseller call like I got) or you can also send me a PM, and I can forward it on to the person at Dish who contacted me after my email. While it might be nice to just get rid of the call, find out as much as you feel safely determining as there is a number of problems here.

    A) Use of account information for not allowed purposes (by Dish or anyone else)
    B) Do not call implications -- I am on Do not call, but this reseller ignored it, and lied as calling from Dish (calls from Dish under normal account purposes are typically allowed unless otherwise noted)
    C) Creating new accounts for existing customers is obviously a no-no

    A couple of additional notes to append to questions asked here:

    -Because I knew they had access to recent account changes (since they read back to me that I had Showtime which I joined earlier for the three month promo we've talked about on the forum), this appears to be a recent account access (it might even be a live time review, but a download of records)
    -This is not a generic credit card theft -- it was specifically for generating a new account since I am likely not under contract as I've been a customer for a few years without relocking for any purpose (I am truly waiting for a 722 and new DishHD promotion better than what is being offered out there since I don't want to really pay the higher $20 for Dish HD services versus the $9.99 I currently pay or any leased box upgrade fees.)
    -It was an overseas call center (first calling me at 6am Pacific time)
    -I joined DVR advantage at the same time I added Showtime to save $.99 per month and now have no statement (no statement has been stolen from me either)

    In summary, at least on this issue, we need to help Dish find these rogue partners and close them down, and the easiest is a call-back number (some toll-free) which may likely identify the reseller or partner.

    Thanks,
    Rasheed
     
  7. 585960

    585960 Legend

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    you can be the dish police all you want, but it will not matter. Obviously the reseller gets their info from dish and tries to turn it into a new account, thats all it is. Paranoia for nothing. Reseller wants a commission, thats it.
     
  8. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator

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    In this case it is BEST to follow the advice of Dish Network from the CEO's office. If anyone comes across such a scam collect as much information as possible and tell E* 's CEO office. These guys are not going to be shut down without some information from their potential victims.
     
  9. 585960

    585960 Legend

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    There is no potential victim if its a reseller. They are promising newer equipment and promotional offers that apply only to new customers. So its a win for the customer, a commission for the sales team, and Dish has a new 18 month contract.
     
  10. Stewart Vernon

    Stewart Vernon Roving Reporter Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Two potential victims in this case. If it goes through, then Dish was the victim because an existing customer was granted a new customer deal that otherwise would not have been granted. If it doesn't go through, then the customer was the victim and likely has had his account compromised and may have had his old one closed already.
     
  11. James Long

    James Long Ready for Uplink! Staff Member Super Moderator

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    It saddens me when someone sees fraud as a victimless crime.
     
  12. 585960

    585960 Legend

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    Sad? I guess it is........but its all about the cha ching. And who doesn't benefit? The customer, corporate, the reseller? Customers outright lie to do this, as do the resellers. Tell me its not so?
     
  13. Sat4me

    Sat4me Legend

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    HDMe: How can this be such a bad deal for Dish? I have 2 friends who would have stayed with Dish had they been able to get the new customer deal and that would have kept them a customer for Dish and would have given Dish another 18 month committment from each of them. Instead, these 2 customers have switched to Directv. Just what good did that do Dish?

    Instead of many of us always defending Dish in everything they do, it might be better if we try to get better deals for everyone. I read recently that it costs these companies an average of $600+ to get each new customer, yet they let existing customers get away over a few dollars. Makes no sense to me.
     
  14. Richard King

    Richard King Hall Of Fame

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    Obviously you are speaking as a retailer. Yes, someone is hurt from this action, the original retailer who REALLY brought the customer to Dish. Suddenly because of the actions of this other party his residuals will disappear and they will be going to the retailer who has no ethics.
     
  15. HobbyTalk

    HobbyTalk Hall Of Fame

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    Pretty easy to figure out. As you noted, this "new customer" has cost Dish $600. Consider that, at the most, a company makes 20% profit (this is a VERY generous figure). Over that 18 months the customer spends $2200 in programming. Dish makes $432 on that programming... or a loss of $168.

    If that same customer wouldn't have become a "new customer" then Dish could have made a profit. My guess is that over the 18 months Dish actually breaks even on "new customers", but this scheme does eliminate any profit for Dish on that customer over the next 18 months.
     
  16. Stewart Vernon

    Stewart Vernon Roving Reporter Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    HobbyTalk beat me to the answer...

    Using your own information... it costs Dish more to get a new customer than to keep an existing one. Granting new customer deals to an existing customer makes that existing customer a new one, and costs Dish again..

    Part of the "sweet" in the new customer deal is designed to entice you to come aboard, but Dish hopes you will stay after that. If you leave immediately after your initial commitment, then Dish hasn't started making money on you yet. Giving you a new customer deal when your other deal just expired would create a neverending spiral of non-profit.

    If you ran a company, how often would you subsidize your current customers just to keep them and lose money? Profitability only happens when customers pay you more than you pay out... and if you keep giving them free stuff, you never turn a profit on that customer.
     
  17. He Save Dave

    He Save Dave Legend

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    Wow, thanks for the heads-up on this. I'll sure try to get infos if they call me.
     
  18. 585960

    585960 Legend

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    nope, not a retailer at all!! Just a lowly dog on the food chain of installers.
     
  19. samhevener

    samhevener Godfather

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    File the report with your local police and call the 3 credit card bureaus and have a freeze put on your credit accounts, they are Equifax 1-800-525-6285, Experian 1-888-397-3742 and Transunion 1-800 680-7289. This will prevent anyone opening credit in your name.
     
  20. Richard King

    Richard King Hall Of Fame

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    I hope they give you some good Alpo for dinner tonight. :D
    If everyone did this to all of the customers of the retailers that you install for you wouldn't be installing too much longer because of the loss of residuals from those retailers. I have no idea what current chargeback rules are, but I suspect some chargebacks may rear their ugly heads along the way also.
     
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