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The Charlie Collection (excerpts from many forums and msg boards)

Discussion in 'General DISH™ Discussion' started by Marcus S, Apr 9, 2003.

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  1. Nick

    Nick Retired, part-time PITA DBSTalk Club

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    Apr 23, 2002
    The...
    :rolleyes:

    Forgive me for being so oblique;
    I have to work to do on my technique.

    - it's moot, not "mute"

    ...and here's a freeby:

    - it's the Rockies, not the "Rockys"
     
  2. Marcus S

    Marcus S Icon

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    Well, you are possibly irriated on current E* issues as well, but then are only two to climb? :)
     
  3. Are you or are you not the Snyder, "the 13" and part of the Ku design team under gov contract in 87 that came up with with DBS technology that we all use today?
     
  4. Mike123abc

    Mike123abc Hall Of Fame/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    Well it comes down to Dish is in the business to make money, not provide the television channels everyone might want, where they want, how they want, and with the equipment they might want.

    Dish is basing decisions on what will make them the most money. As any corporation should. Now of course to make money you need to have customers to pay you, and to get these customers you need to provide the goods/services that they will pay for at the lowest possible price.

    Now, assuming Marcus is correct and they are going to drop all but NY/LA distants, they must think that the cost of uplinking and the cost of transponder capacity is too high for the number of subscribers they have. I have pointed out in the past that as they add literally a 100+ markets covering 90%+ of the US population, many people will opt for LIL rather than distants. Maybe they decided that by freeing up 2 transponders on 110 for other programming (maybe 6-8 HDTV channels) would attract a large number of subs and make up for any possibly lost subs. Where do these subs think they are going to go anyways? DirecTV does not offer them, and C-Band is about abandoned and a pain to use. E* knows this and decided to make them suffer a bit and could possibly lose a few subs but will gain more in the long run.

    As people around here gripe and complain about the E* equipment, E* increases subs. This would indicate that the vast majority of E* subs think the equipment works just fine. It could be argued that they do not know better, but at this point they do not care to go find out what other equipment is there.

    With respect to the HD market, I do think Dish is going to do the correct business decision and run out their supply of 6000s before they introduce a lower cost new HD receiver with Open TV and other features people will want (not talking about the 921 PVR). Why saddle yourself with millions of useless inventory? They know they can get rid of the 6000 soon and it is starting to show that they are about out.

    As far as what channels they carry for what cost (like YES), I am sure they have studied it extensively and determined what the costs vs the lost subs are and selected lost subs. Maybe they have accurate info that the average YES sub would not come to Dish anyways because there is no NFLST or MLBEI on Dish. This would explain why DirecTV felt it was essential, and Dish did not.

    This is not a defense of Charlie or Dish, just trying to point out that they are a business that makes decisions on a $$ point of view not a wish list point of view. If they are betting wrong then they will lose subs and will lose money. Then they will make adjustments. If they decided YES was the answer, they know how much they would have to pay and could go out and make the deal tomorrow.
     
  5. Richard King

    Richard King Hall Of Fame

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    Wow!! A voice of reason.
     
  6. reddice

    reddice Godfather

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    The only thing that Dish has that Directv does not have is the superstations so it is not worth it switching, as long as we get our Mets games we are okay.
     
  7. Mike123abc

    Mike123abc Hall Of Fame/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    I suspect the only reason the Superstations are not going the way of the other distants is that so many markets are missing a UPN, WB or both. Here we have UPN but no WB. Probably a much wider following on superstation than Dallas/Denver/Chicago main networks.
     
  8. gopherscot

    gopherscot Legend

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    Mar 25, 2002
    They are missing a few of the premium stations as well such as Showtime Beyond.
     
  9. Marcus S

    Marcus S Icon

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    Apr 23, 2002
    E*'s attraction in the past was to offer many nitches that the competition did not offer. If E* continues ther direction to drop these nitch areas, becomes a mirror of *D, less channels such as YES, PBS Kids, Ogygen, but still retains the one and last nitch, International Channels, what will prevent the average consumer from saying, well both providers are pretty equal so I'll go with whoever gives me the best install and equipment deal?
     
  10. Mike123abc

    Mike123abc Hall Of Fame/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    I think E* has found out that you are exactly correct Marcus. When you go to the store to look at E* and D* what are the odds you are going to get someone at Walmart that can tell you the difference? Instead you will see the price only. They will look more closely at the monthly price & up front costs and less at the individual channels. With the independent dealer fading away as people flock to Radio Shack and Walmart who can tell the difference between the two services? E* is hoping you will be WOWed by how cheap AT-50 is or how many channels you can get quantity wise not quality wise. DirecTV hopes that NFLST will make you buy them. People in and around NY probably look for YES now if it is important to them.

    The only reason I picked E* over D* was the Superstations. I will freely admit it. But, now I would not be able to make that choice because the new marketing brochures do not make a mention of the Superstations. I would instead stay with cable... Sad there is almost no way to find out about the Superstations on E*. I have local UPN OTA, but no WB. Cable carries the basic WB feed.

    I would bet 90%+ of DBS sales are simply made on price. Price of cable is what drove me to look at DBS... when my cable jumped up to over $110/month. When I saw the Superstations were available on Dish I decided to switch.

    Dish is slowly losing me as a customer with price increases. My Dish bill at my renewal next month is going to go to be $103/month. I am hanging on just for the HDTV content, if my cable company came out with an HDTV package I would consider switching back. DBS is a pain compared to cable, you have to have an adapter box for every TV. At least with cable you can get analog free on every TV in the house, and when Digital cable ready TVs come out you will not need a box at them either.
     
  11. Cheyenne

    Cheyenne Legend

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    Apr 23, 2002
    Marcus has not concept as to Echostar business plan.
    A ex-worker that has "other" motives.
     
  12. Marcus S

    Marcus S Icon

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    I am employed and have never worked for E*. If your belief is that all corporations have viable business plans, I would look around at all the Fortune 100 and 500 companies that are now gone, in Chapter 11, or are having to merge to survive. But again, you side track, make personal attacks, and do not address or counter the posted issues. I would suggest that you read the recent New York Time article about E*.
     
  13. Sherlock

    Sherlock Legend

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    So, you're suggesting by these arguments you have brought over from Yahoo that E* is going out of business?

    Can you provide a NYT link or at least give us something more than "Echostar" to do a document search and identify the specific article you keep referring to? Has anybody else addressed the NYT topic?
     
  14. Marcus S

    Marcus S Icon

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    Not at all. These are issues that existing subs are having, many have been discussed individually here and on other forums, the opinion ones are obviously source Yahoo, but highlight a rising stress level. The purpose is for discussion, reflection, or to post your positive experiences. The hope by many of these people is for E* to address their issue(s) and not everyone is effected by the same sub set of issues. The NYT topic can be found in the General forum, or click here;
    Dish Network NYT Article Discussion
     
  15. Sherlock

    Sherlock Legend

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    Thank you.

    I had a similar "no deal for long term subs" experience that forced me to leave DirecTV a couple of years ago. The way to see how the companies are performing, and whether or not the subs are happy, is by growth. E* has been reducing churn and growing at a greater rate with lower SAC. We'll see how things go forward after the NWS/GMH deal is consummated.

    Greg M
     
  16. Marcus S

    Marcus S Icon

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    You bring up an interesting question on churn. If *D and E* become almost mirrors, what will consumers be looking for in the comparison process, what will either provider need to do to attract growth, and though the NYT aritcle targeted E* on these questions, both providers should also be looking closely at what causes churn. Perhaps the articles note that Charlie and executive team are in Mexico on summit, is a hopefull indication they will be addressing these issues and future business direction.
     
  17. Sherlock

    Sherlock Legend

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    ...yet they don't need to go to Mexico to figure out such things.
     
  18. Marcus S

    Marcus S Icon

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    Apr 23, 2002
    <duplicate> removing.
     
  19. Cheyenne

    Cheyenne Legend

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    Minimizing churn? I figure both DBS providers and cable realize that most customers create a closed loop.
    Or maybe all providers simply lower standards together, thus no where to churn to. The industry seems to be putting more effort into trickery vs. customer service now.
     
  20. BobMurdoch

    BobMurdoch Hall Of Fame

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    Scott, I'm getting concerned.......

    You have a disillusioned tone in your posts that sounds like you are souring on E* in a hurry.... I noticed the same phenomena when Dan Collins at DBSForums starting circulating a desire to start a class action suit on E*. He went from singing their praises to heaping scorn in a short time.

    Is this a short term frustration on your part, or are you contemplating hopping over the fence as well?

    Just wondering.......
     
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